Nursing instructor putting student through embarassment and singles out

merrywhiterose · Oct 8, 2009

Wow! That sounds like my clinical instructor I had last year at Lincoln! Find out who the administrator is for your college over the nation and send them a letter along with a copy to the administrator over your college there. These instructors need to be stopped!

old ICU nurse · Oct 8, 2009

Dear mjacobs--I am sorry to hear that one of your fellow students is getting "picked on." It is hard enough being a student, much less battling an instructor in the clinical area.

You have essentially two options:

1. If you decide to take formal action, you and the ENTIRE class unite must formally discuss the situation with a scheduled meeting with the university's dean of nursing, otherwise, you will be **i***** the wind as far as effectiveness. If the meeting with the dean does not work, go higher AS AN ENTIRE CLASS. Being the only fearless "do-gooder" fighting the "mean" instructor because it is the "right thing to do" will ultimately get you no points in the long run, sister! Trust me. If the instructor has been teaching any length of time--the other professors might be "on" to the behavior issues from classes before yours that may have complained. However, they may not have the documented evidence to terminate her. (Remember the old nurse thing, "If it ain't documented, it ain't done.") So, document objectively as a collective, and formulate an agenda for discussion with the dean and THEN possibly a letter. A letter written in the heat of the moment LASTS FOREVER in your file. If you get a meeting, take at least three students from you class--and not a group of buddies--but the more respected cooler-headed students that can articulate the situation calmly.

Option #2--Do nothing and MYOB. I know that this is not the nursing advocate superhero role that we often like to fill--(saving the weak from the evil). BUT, before jumping into action, a few questions need to be asked:

1. What has transpired before this? (was there an initial "incident"?)

2. Has this student failed at other clinical or didactic exercises?

3. Is this person REALLY going to be a good nurse?

4. Is this person worth risking your enrollment if you want to fight and the rest of the class does not want to get involved or disagrees with helping?

5. Does the instructor act badly to any other student that you know of OR has a history of being a b*tch to the students? (establishing patterns of behavior would be helpful in your endeavors).

Unfortunately, nurses DO "weed out the weak" (aka "eating their young") but I have found that it is not for fun and games--it is sometimes to have the strongest survive. I have precepted nurses in the ICU and OR that DO NOT NEED TO BE THERE and when I realize it (which is usually very quickly--I talk to the nurse manager to have them reassigned). And yes, if needed, I would recommend termination if a nurse's practice was dangerous or neglient. If this is not the case, see option #1.

Good luck with your pursuits--I hope that if the instructor needs to be terminated it happens soon to bring harmony (as best as one can find in nursing school) to you and your peers.

MORNINGSTAR99999 · Oct 8, 2009

This message is for LivetoLearn, Llg and Vida - Loca:

When I go under these threads to read - there are students who may want some input of what to do. I noticed on all of these threads the majority of bloggers are instructors. When I emailed my input, I didn't say and never will say "all nursing instructors are bad." There are good instructors and there bad instructors. We live in the 50 States of America. There isn't a single end of nursing instructors that are good or bad. You want bashing of instructors, just go under www.ratemyprofessors.com and click whatever State you belong and what school. Then you'll see what bashing is from other students about their instructors.

When you meet an instructor for your semester you learn from them. The student should grasp every opportunity because oneday that opportunity may cease. By the end of the first year, the student should grasp the nursing process and the instructor may toughen up as the days progress. What I missed on the person's thread, the person never mentions when does this problem occurs. Did it occur in the beginning of the program or what transpired to this incident. The person fails to take action based on the "Nursing Handbook." Doesn't the student have a handbook that guides them through the program?

Life is tough. As for Llg, never take a single word or sentence and exploit as an insult to instructors. You have to take a look at the whole picture. You have to read the threads before making a decision. It's an open forum.

I'm glad that I will never step a foot into nursing school. There are other means of getting into a program and enjoy the thrill.

ralon11c · Oct 8, 2009

This cannot continue anymore. That instructor needs to receive consequences for her actions. For everyone that sees this going on, you have a responsibility to report that wicked instructor.

jjnmrsmom · Oct 8, 2009

I didn't get a chance to read all of the posts and my advice may come too late but here goes. Most of us go through this as nurses. It's a hazard of the job. Whether it happens with an bully professor, a fellow nurse who has something to prove, or a doctor who wakes up on the wrong side of the bed. We are going to be mistreated at some point. I'm not saying it's right but it IS going to happen. We have to develop a thick skin or we won't survive. Better this girl gets her feet wet while she's in school rather than when she's on the floor working as a nurse.

My first semester of nursing school I had a clinical instructor that prided herself on making students sweat. And she was VERY good at it! She reduced several of my classmates to tears. Guess what... we all survived and are tougher for it. I know it's natural to be protective but your support is enough. I consoled many a weary student during nursing school. It's only one instructor... she'll be fine.

luvlyf · Oct 8, 2009

i know how that student must've felt. I used to go to Triton College, it is a community college in Illinois. I had a teacher who wants to be called Doctor ___. Personally, I want to call someone Doctor if the person is a medical doctor, but if you are a nurse who wants to be called doctor because you have Ph. D., technically, you're really not a real doctor--"Hello!". This same teacher made me feel she hated me from Day One. While she applaud on other students' lab skills performances, she made me feel like her watching me make beds or do any skill was a waste of her time--the time I and the government (since it is a community college) paid her. Well, you know I paid the same amount of money the other students she watched and praised do their beds/skills, for me not to be treated the same way she treated others was unfair and inappropriate. She also made faces while I do skills. When I passed that course, my first sem first year first course in ADN that year, I was so happy I was done with her. But the following sem, she had to be my clinical teacher in Labor & Del. She screamed at me at the nursing station and made me cry I did not want to do nursing anymore. The following day, she must have thought I will complain to the authorities, she wrote me two page details of how I did that day in clinical and made me sign that paper so she'd have something to cover her a**, a justification for her unprofessionalism. I didn't tell the nursing director or anybody in the college. I don't think my classmates knew. She screamed at me in the nursing station when we were alone. In the nursing classroom halls, she would smile at everybody and when she sees me would make that disgusting look like "why are you here?". I believe anybody who is a nurse or will become a nurse will be or has in some way going to get or has been maltreated. What surprised me is why would a student get that in school. Teachers should encourage and teach. What she did to me was exactly the opposite. I thought, she doesn't deserve to be called a doctor with an attitude like that, she's not a real med doctor anyway, she's a nurse who have a Ph.D. None of the Doctors, real Medical Doctors who I personally know behave like that. Most nurses I know, whom I've met at work or elsewhere or relatives who are nurses were never rude to clients like that. As her student I am her client, as a patient to a nurse. I paid her. Well, you know, I believe in karma. And that God doesnt like ugly but is not crazy over beauty either. This year someone I know updated me about that nursing school I attended and told me that that professor can not teach this semester due to health reasons. Should I just think that she maltreated me in response to the pain she was feeling that is now manifesting in her body? Or maybe God is punishing her now. I do get mad but only God gets even.

hickjoe · Oct 8, 2009

I too had a similar situation the first time I entered nursing school.

hickjoe · Oct 8, 2009

I had a similar problem when I was 18 years old and a new nursing student. My instructor actually put me down in a similar fashion. It caused me to leave nursing school and not go back until I was 30 years old. She actually told me I would never make it as a nurse. I proved her wrong by getting my BSN and my MPH in Community Nursing and going on to teach. Her "example" helped make me a much more sensitive nurse/instructor, I believe.

My suggestion would be to make an appointment with this instructor away from the other students. Tell her how her comments in public make you feel and ask her if there is some reason she is singling you out for public comments. Tell her in a professional way that you would appreciate it if she would either take you aside or make an appointment to discuss this with you. Tell her also that you realize she has years more experience than you and that you want to learn all you can from her. But you need to keep your tone professional and in the "I" form of communication so as not to be seeming to attack her. She is after all, for better or worse, your instructor and you don't want to antagonize her.

Hope this helps. When I was young I didn't have a clue on how to deal with this adult and left nursing entirely.

hickjoe · Oct 8, 2009

Two replies:

1. If a nurse has a Ph.D she may not be an M.D. but she has earned the right to be addrrssed as doctor.

2. I too believe in Karma - while I was working at a local health clinic in a major city, I wanted to go back to school and get my BSN. I had a plan worked out so I would not be in class too much during the day and could use my personal days which I had accumulated. When I approached the Director of Nurses and her boss, they turned me down -FLAT! I believe it was because I had bucked the/their system a couple of years before by pushing for a specific person to take over my job as supervisor of the clinic. They were none too happy.

I found out that they were themselves taking off time during the day to attend classes. But I decided to quit a job I loved because I wanted to get both by BSN and Masters so I could teach in the future. I found out years later that both of these individuals had been fired for not doing their jobs and lying on their time sheets and reports about what they had actually been doing. So I don't know if it was Karma or that old saying, "what goes around, comes around"

old ICU nurse · Oct 8, 2009

Some of this is totally off the true reason for the initial threat--how to deal with bullies or difficult people. Unfortunately it has deteriorated to a passive aggressive lesson. To those who think that anyone with a PhD in nursing should not be called doctor--you are very mistaken. It is very difficult attain a doctorate in nursing (or any other discipline) and it shows ignorance of the writer. Those who think that physicians are the only one who "deserve" the title of "Doctor" are in for a rude awakening in a hospital setting--especially a teaching institution.

It is the same for those "slam" nurses who do not have a BSN--I have both an associate's degree and Bacholer's degree and currently enrolling for a master's. A four year degree does not automatically make a better nurse when starting their practice.

Good luck to those who are "glad they will never step foot in a nursing school." It is a learning and training process. I hope that (Morningstar99999) and some of the others have your pancake making skills when you are working at an IHOP instead of an ICU or any other clinical setting.

MORNINGSTAR99999 · Oct 8, 2009

OldICUNurse,

I have one other option to for in a clinical setting. I thought for a moment I was finished. Since I met all of my requirements for this allied health program, I will apply for this program. I will remain it nameless. I have to get all of my transcripts in before I turn them in for next year's program. It doesn't mean I have to really pursue nursing. I can go for something else other than an LVN or RN program then license.

I value your opinion. I never sent an email to you about pancakes. Maybe perhaps, we should eat Quaker Oats oatmeal together. Won't you think so? You are correct and I agree with you about the instructors roaring on their students. Which till this very day; I can't understand it. These instructors don't understand is - if you take away their credentials - they're regular people like you and I. Because one day these same nursing students may treat their former nursing instructor with a foley catheter, of some sort. Or doing chest compressions, for example. I understand to challenge them to the utmost, but to break them down is uncalled for. I don't about the other States, but the hospitals in my State and County I live in are promoting customer service for other people to come back to our hospital. Now it's very conflicting when nursing instructors are deamoning their students, but when they go to these hospitals to do their clinicals, you have to be professionals? I apologize for off setting on a different topic. But can you see my point?

I hope the program I'm entering will not be so deamoning as to nursing. This program is a two - year program. The program is challenging. I'm looking forward of tackling this program. And I hope I can succeed better than I did in nursing.

luvlyf · Oct 8, 2009

I agree with this: MorningStar99999 "These instructors don't understand is - if you take away their credentials - they're regular people like you and I. Because one day these same nursing students may treat their former nursing instructor with a foley catheter, of some sort. Or doing chest compressions, for example. I understand to challenge them to the utmost, but to break them down is uncalled for."

To OLD ICU Nurse: I would have to respect if you want to call someone with a PhD degree "Doctor" before her name. The thing is, when I was in the hospital doing my clinical rotation, I called her Doctor ___ (fill in her first name), the nurses and doctors who heard looked at me and her. I thought maybe they thought she is actually a real medical doctor, it was awkward. When you are in the hospital setting and you call someone a doctor when she is not an MD, people might think she is a physician. I know it is hard to get PhD degree, getting BSN is already hard, much more getting higher degrees. MDs studied and help save lives for 10 years to be called Doctors plus huge clinical internship residency hours under their belt, as compared to PhD "doctors" who studied 2 to 4 years max to write PhD dissertation. Big difference to be called "Doctor" is what I mean.

To OLd ICU Nurse, you might think:" To those who think that anyone with a PhD in nursing should not be called doctor--you are very mistaken. It is very difficult attain a doctorate in nursing (or any other discipline) and it shows ignorance of the writer. Those who think that physicians are the only one who "deserve" the title of "Doctor" are in for a rude awakening in a hospital setting--especially a teaching institution. " But you know what traditionally, Doctors arent called Doctors if you're not a real Medical Doctor.

My thought is: If you are a Person who have a High education such as PhD and would want to be called a "Doctor", you should present yourself as a respectful person who deserves respect from people who doesnt have your PhD degree or from your students. SHE DOESN' T NEED to be called "Doctor". What she needs is some lessons in how to respect her students and be professional. And actually TEACH in class/lab/clinical. And not make nursing school a place to unload her pain or personal frustations. Students did not sign up or paid for that!

I think that complaints in this thread comes down to teachers who are NOT doing their jobs encouraging students to learn what they know and share what they have experienced in Nursing career. These teachers are old and will be retiring soon, and maybe replaced by these students who they have previously in their teaching careers when they were able and too high and mighty embarassed and maltreated when they were trying to learn and thrive in the nursing field as STUDENTS.

These teachers might need the help of their students as nurses someday in the future when they will be confined in hospitals as patients, so teachers should be good to their students. The most basic, golden rule:"Do not do unto others what you don't want others to do unto you" still holds true. As I say, rephrased from above, Vengeance is not ours, It's God's.