chambers on 2008K

donroberto · Sep 5, 2005

Keep the arterial and venous chambers 3/4 full...applys to both k and h machines.

QUOTE=student60]Hello Group Members:

Can someone please tell me what is right and what should be done. I am being given different information from nurses about the chambers. First, I was told the chambers could be 1/2 full but not to let them get under 1/2 full. Then I am told to just let them run their course until they are empty. Now, on the 2008K machine is there an alarm that goes off when the chamber needs to be filled? Are there side effects that my patients will experience if the chambers get low to about 30 cc of blood left? Thanks.

student60 · Sep 5, 2005

This is what I was originally told. 3/4 full. Now, I am being told to leave until blood gets to bottom of chamber. Is there an alarm on the K machine when the blood reaches a certain level whereby it needs to be filled? Why would the charge nurse tell me not to fill until it is low or not to fill if it is 1/2 full? We are a busy small unit but isn't this unsafe for the patient? I thought I read, in orientation that it was to be 3/4 full. I told this to the charge nurse but she insists I do what she says.

QUOTE=donroberto]Keep the arterial and venous chambers 3/4 full...applys to both k and h machines.

QUOTE=student60]Hello Group Members:

Can someone please tell me what is right and what should be done. I am being given different information from nurses about the chambers. First, I was told the chambers could be 1/2 full but not to let them get under 1/2 full. Then I am told to just let them run their course until they are empty. Now, on the 2008K machine is there an alarm that goes off when the chamber needs to be filled? Are there side effects that my patients will experience if the chambers get low to about 30 cc of blood left? Thanks.

donroberto · Sep 5, 2005

Hmmmm...can't answer that. Just remember to slow the pump speed down significantly (200 or less) when filling the arterial chamber...otherwise you stand a good chance of getting air in your lines....and as we all know, it's a real pain in the butt to get it out.....

QUOTE=student60]This is what I was originally told. 3/4 full. Now, I am being told to leave until blood gets to bottom of chamber. Is there an alarm on the K machine when the blood reaches a certain level whereby it needs to be filled? Why would the charge nurse tell me not to fill until it is low or not to fill if it is 1/2 full? We are a busy small unit but isn't this unsafe for the patient? I thought I read, in orientation that it was to be 3/4 full. I told this to the charge nurse but she insists I do what she says.

QUOTE=donroberto]Keep the arterial and venous chambers 3/4 full...applys to both k and h machines.

QUOTE=student60]Hello Group Members:

Can someone please tell me what is right and what should be done. I am being given different information from nurses about the chambers. First, I was told the chambers could be 1/2 full but not to let them get under 1/2 full. Then I am told to just let them run their course until they are empty. Now, on the 2008K machine is there an alarm that goes off when the chamber needs to be filled? Are there side effects that my patients will experience if the chambers get low to about 30 cc of blood left? Thanks.

gutym · Sep 22, 2005

For all chambers on all dialysis machines the chambers should be full enough to avoid splashing as this will lead to clotting in the chambers. Usually 3/4 full is enough, all though I keep mine slightly fuller, say 7/8--I want to avoid it going into the transducer line and transducer protector which causes one to both loose pressure readings and then losing the transducer protector. The clotting in chambers can plug up the transducer line and cause false pressures or no pressure readings. On the H & K Fresenius machines there is nothing to detect an empty chamber until the venous chambers empties and air goes through the air detector---by this time you have a real problem. The machines, as do most have knobs, buttons, or some type of switch to adjust the levels. On the Fresenius H there is no adjustment for the Arterial Chamber, what I do is use the small extra line with a syringe to adjust the level, just clamp the long transducer line while your adjusting to avoid the alarms, then open after the adjustment has been made. Good Luck,

student60 · Sep 24, 2005

For all chambers on all dialysis machines the chambers should be full enough to avoid splashing as this will lead to clotting in the chambers. Usually 3/4 full is enough, all though I keep mine slightly fuller, say 7/8--I want to avoid it going into the transducer line and transducer protector which causes one to both loose pressure readings and then losing the transducer protector. The clotting in chambers can plug up the transducer line and cause false pressures or no pressure readings. On the H & K Fresenius machines there is nothing to detect an empty chamber until the venous chambers empties and air goes through the air detector---by this time you have a real problem. The machines, as do most have knobs, buttons, or some type of switch to adjust the levels. On the Fresenius H there is no adjustment for the Arterial Chamber, what I do is use the small extra line with a syringe to adjust the level, just clamp the long transducer line while your adjusting to avoid the alarms, then open after the adjustment has been made. Good Luck,

Quite upsetting. We are told does not have to be even 1/2 full and to tell patients, if they ask, that it is ok if 1/2 full or less as long as it is not empty. FMC unit

student60 · Sep 24, 2005

Thank you. Our unit (FMC) we are told, if patient asks, to tell them it is ok at 1/2 full or less and not to worry until it is empty.

gutym · Sep 24, 2005

Thank you. Our unit (FMC) we are told, if patient asks, to tell them it is ok at 1/2 full or less and not to worry until it is empty.

First of all, one thing you will see in every dialysis unit is a different way of doing things--there is more than one way to accomplish a task in this field. I gave you my reasoning and how I perform tretments, but if you want it from the horses mouth simply read the package insert from a box of Fresenius blood lines or whomever bloodlines you use...it sttes I believe to keep it above the pour line and have some distance (approx 1/2 inch) from the top to prevent stagnation and possible foaming at the top that leads to clotting. Hope this helps and you need to relax--anyone worrying this much has got to be a careful person and I'm sure you are--so do yoour best and continue to learn and eventually you'll have lot's of expertise!!

Good Luck!!