Changes to the Nurse Anesthesia Council of Accreditation Standards

[wtbcrna]

* The COA approved the requirement for the degree granting institutions of nurse anesthesia programs to have regional accreditation. The COA determined this requirement will be reflected in its Eligibility for Accreditation policy rather than within the Standards.

* The COA approved a revision to Standard III, Criterion C13b to ensure applicants who matriculate into nurse anesthesia programs are prepared for the rigor of the program by requiring a minimum of one year of experience as an RN in a critical care setting vs. an acute care setting (refer revised 2004 Standards, pg. 6). A definition for "critical care experience" is provided in the Glossary (refer revised 2004 Standards, pg. 28).

The standards are found here.

There are more changes but these are the two that pre-CRNAs would probably be most interested in.

[wtbcrna, MSN, DNP, CRNA]

Sure, one school I know of for sure is Wesleyan in Fort Worth, I interviewed at their school and they openly said there rate was around 14%, while Wolford has a rate of 7-8%. You can find wolford's rate on their website, but if you want to verify wesleyan's, youll have to call them. Oakland university has a rate of over 12%, USC also has a rate of 12%, Mid western was a rate of 10%. All of these were listed on their website. I feel that's plenty of examples.

So, you think that is statistically significant? That the lawsuit(s), the complaints of sharing clinical patients/skills with other students, and a degree that essentially cannot be transferred/used for credit at the vast majority of other universities compares to a couple percentage lower attrition rates. Do you think the school is more worried about having the student's tuition rather than giving a quality education?.. Some of the NA schools that have the highest attrition rates are also considered the top NA schools in the country.

[BOOSTISADRUG]

Well look at it this way if I said you had two schools to choose from, School 1 has an attrition rate or 12% and a first time pass rate of 93% on the boards. School 2 has a attrition rate of 9% and a first time pas rate of 93%, which would you choose? I use 93% pass rate since that seems to be an average across the board. The stories of students sharing patients and so forth is something that has had mixed reviews from people saying it's true to others saying it's just when you start out to get accustomed to the OR and only last about a week. On the topic of transferring to other schools, well that's pretty much what this whole topic is about, because if they achieve the regional then that won't be a factor. And lastly, the lawsuit, people have mixed feelings over that, but the idea of CRNA students being worked to hard wouldn't suprise me. There was new guidelines past a couple years back about medical student interns being pushed for to many hours without enough sleep and resulted in a lawsuit. Lawsuits happen because anyone can sue anyone. Look at burger king or mcdonalds, whichever it was, being sued for their coffee being to hot. I understand if your concerns and comments on the school, and while they are valid and good talking points, I'm just trying to shine some light on the other side.

[a4562]

Since Wolford is currently not regionally accredited, some doctoral programs will not accept graduates of Wolford into their programs. People who are not interested in continuing education to get their doctorate after graduation obviously dont need to worry about this. What I am interested in is whether previous graduates of Wolford will be "grandfathered" in once Wolford has its regional accreditation status.

[BOOSTISADRUG]

CPH- I dind't think your comments were to slam wolford, no worries. Everything comes across with attitude over the internet :-P

a4562- That's a good question

[wtbcrna, MSN, DNP, CRNA]

Since Wolford is currently not regionally accredited, some doctoral programs will not accept graduates of Wolford into their programs. People who are not interested in continuing education to get their doctorate after graduation obviously dont need to worry about this. What I am interested in is whether previous graduates of Wolford will be "grandfathered" in once Wolford has its regional accreditation status.

Your degree will not be grandfathered to a regionally accredited status. What you have when graduate is what you have.

[wtbcrna, MSN, DNP, CRNA]

Well look at it this way if I said you had two schools to choose from, School 1 has an attrition rate or 12% and a first time pass rate of 93% on the boards. School 2 has a attrition rate of 9% and a first time pas rate of 93%, which would you choose? I use 93% pass rate since that seems to be an average across the board. The stories of students sharing patients and so forth is something that has had mixed reviews from people saying it's true to others saying it's just when you start out to get accustomed to the OR and only last about a week. On the topic of transferring to other schools, well that's pretty much what this whole topic is about, because if they achieve the regional then that won't be a factor. And lastly, the lawsuit, people have mixed feelings over that, but the idea of CRNA students being worked to hard wouldn't suprise me. There was new guidelines past a couple years back about medical student interns being pushed for to many hours without enough sleep and resulted in a lawsuit. Lawsuits happen because anyone can sue anyone. Look at burger king or mcdonalds, whichever it was, being sued for their coffee being to hot. I understand if your concerns and comments on the school, and while they are valid and good talking points, I'm just trying to shine some light on the other side.

The lawsuit is from students being used as staff at Collier anesthesia which the school owner was a partner in Collier anesthesia. Defedants File Answers In Nurse Anesthetist Students v Wolford College This lawsuit is all from graduates from the program.

The students' complaints were for having multiple SRNAs in one room during speciality rotations, and all claiming the case, CVLs, etc.

This program has had and still has lots of issues. This is not a program that should be recommended to any student at this time. When and if the program becomes regionally accredited, wins its lawsuit, no longer has students sharing cases, and doesn't send students to a hospital that is financially beneficial to the owner of the school then I will reconsider my recommendation of Wolford.

[BOOSTISADRUG]

Well I can't say much about the lawsuit since those can last on forever, but from the graduating class to the 1st semester class I spoke with, the sharing of rooms is not a current practice. The school has multiple sites that are not affiliated with collier including an all crna practice. And hopefully the regional accreditation hopefully will be resolved soon from what I've been hearing.

[a4562]

I personally know multiple people in the program currently who have told me that the sharing of rooms is not a practice that is being done now. They have had nothing but good things to say about the program and were a large influence on my decision to attend the program. I can see how the regional accreditation may be a problem for students going back to school for their doctorate at some programs. I however, do not plan on continuing to get my doctorate after this degree.

[wtbcrna, MSN, DNP, CRNA]

I personally know multiple people in the program currently who have told me that the sharing of rooms is not a practice that is being done now. They have had nothing but good things to say about the program and were a large influence on my decision to attend the program. I can see how the regional accreditation may be a problem for students going back to school for their doctorate at some programs. I however, do not plan on continuing to get my doctorate after this degree.

There is more to being regionally accredited than just the students being able to transfer their degree to another school. Regionally accreditation shows that a school has met stringent academic requirements, and is able to provide a high level of academic instruction. I am sure this is one of the reasons the COA is now requiring regionally accreditation.

[BOOSTISADRUG]

This is true and the fact that Wolfords first time test takers pass percent is right up there with all other programa speaks to their ability to provide a program that develops and equips nurses with the ability to be crnas. Now if their first time test taker pass rate was much lower then all other programs, that would easily be a concern when they are reviewed for accreditation.

[wtbcrna, MSN, DNP, CRNA]

This is true and the fact that Wolfords first time test takers pass percent is right up there with all other programa speaks to their ability to provide a program that develops and equips nurses with the ability to be crnas. Now if their first time test taker pass rate was much lower then all other programs, that would easily be a concern when they are reviewed for accreditation.

If the programs pass rate was much lower Wolford like every other program would lose its accreditation. Every decent program should have at least 90+% pass rate for first time test takers.

Pass rates are a poor indicator of how well someone is prepared to be a CRNA. Pass rates are around 90% right now. When a CRNA graduate can work independently/take solo call, perform their own PNBs, CVLs, run codes on their own, independently manage pre-op/post-ops, and fluidly transition from one speciality service to another then that graduate has gotten a great education. There is almost nothing that I have heard about Wolford that would lead me to believe that is the case at this time. I am glad to hear they are working to resolve their earlier discrepancies. I still recommend pre-crna adopt a wait and see approach to this program and not apply until they at least they receive their regional accreditation.

[wtbcrna, MSN, DNP, CRNA]

Just to be fair to Wolford: Assuming the attrition rates and pass rates are correct Wolford University has an impressive rate of low attrition rates and high board pass rates. Either rate is not spectacular on its own, but together makes for a strong indicator of preparing students for their board exam.

I could not verify these rates on their website.