what are we coming to?

Nurses General Nursing

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This is a repeat of topic in "Managed Care" section: I'd like to hear how nurses feel about our system of health care delivery in the U.S. And from nurses who live elsewhere, how do you feel about the access to health care in your country (and what do you think about the system in U.S.?)?

To me, it is abhorent that people who live in one of the prosperous countries go without needed health care because of financial restraints; that people who have worked hard and saved some money in their lives can be wiped out financially by an illness; that the "working poor" wait until their condition is dire before obtaining care; and that we tolerate a market-driven health system.

I believe that the FOR PROFIT must be taken out of health care. The U.S. has the most expensive system in the world (about 25% of dollars are spent on administrtion of insurance plans), and we have some of the poorest outcomes. WHY?

According to surveys, people who live in Canada and England are largely satisfied with their health care systems, they go to get care when they need it, they pay no money and fill out no forms; and their overall outcomes are better.

I'd like to hear how other people feel about this. Thanks!!!

LindaC

23 Posts

This is a repeat of topic in "Managed Care" section: I'd like to hear how nurses feel about our system of health care delivery in the U.S. And from nurses who live elsewhere, how do you feel about the access to health care in your country (and what do you think about the system in U.S.?)?

To me, it is abhorent that people who live in one of the prosperous countries go without needed health care because of financial restraints; that people who have worked hard and saved some money in their lives can be wiped out financially by an illness; that the "working poor" wait until their condition is dire before obtaining care; and that we tolerate a market-driven health system.

I believe that the FOR PROFIT must be taken out of health care. The U.S. has the most expensive system in the world (about 25% of dollars are spent on administrtion of insurance plans), and we have some of the poorest outcomes. WHY?

According to surveys, people who live in Canada and England are largely satisfied with their health care systems, they go to get care when they need it, they pay no money and fill out no forms; and their overall outcomes are better.

I'd like to hear how other people feel about this. Thanks!!!

glog

8 Posts

I was fortunate enough to experience healthcare on my own bones in 2 different countries. Here in the US and in Italy, which has a system very similar to the one in England. The advantages of the Italian system are that you are always covered, your insurance is not tied into your job, you have no forms to fill out, no money to pay out. When you move into an area, you are assigned to a local clinic and you receive all your care in that clinic. Also it is highly centralized. For example, suppose you live in a city and your children receive their vaccinations. If you are transferred to another city, you don't have to go hunting for immunization records. They are kept recorded in a national central bank that can be accessed with a computer, a print out made and easy does it, it goes to the school. I always hear a lot of put downs about socialized medicine...wait times, choice, less technology, but the reality is that socialized medicine in Europe is no different from receiving care through a managed care company in the US. The difference is that it is simpler ( really no paper work) and it covers 100% of the population. Europeans get choice, short waiting times and high tech, just like Americans do if you have money. If you can pay out of pocket, you see a private MD and use a private hospital. Just like in the US, if you are the CEO of a company, you would probably have commercial insurance, see whoever you please and be able to afford that sometime gigantic 20%. I have come to the conclusion that what really scares the American population is the word socialized. It conjures up images of communism and bread lines and scares the hell out of people who have never been out of their towns. I propose that the word social medicine be dumped and that federal medical plan be used instead. What if every American were covered by something like Medicare with some adjustments to control costs. The thing is also that physicians in Europe don't earn nearly as much as they do here, unless they are internationally famous. An average salary is probably in the range of 80,000. That is opposed for example to MDs in NYC making about half a million a year in private practice. In Italy, nobody goes into medicine to make money. It is a calling. If you want to make money there you have to pick another profession.

glog

8 Posts

I was fortunate enough to experience healthcare on my own bones in 2 different countries. Here in the US and in Italy, which has a system very similar to the one in England. The advantages of the Italian system are that you are always covered, your insurance is not tied into your job, you have no forms to fill out, no money to pay out. When you move into an area, you are assigned to a local clinic and you receive all your care in that clinic. Also it is highly centralized. For example, suppose you live in a city and your children receive their vaccinations. If you are transferred to another city, you don't have to go hunting for immunization records. They are kept recorded in a national central bank that can be accessed with a computer, a print out made and easy does it, it goes to the school. I always hear a lot of put downs about socialized medicine...wait times, choice, less technology, but the reality is that socialized medicine in Europe is no different from receiving care through a managed care company in the US. The difference is that it is simpler ( really no paper work) and it covers 100% of the population. Europeans get choice, short waiting times and high tech, just like Americans do if you have money. If you can pay out of pocket, you see a private MD and use a private hospital. Just like in the US, if you are the CEO of a company, you would probably have commercial insurance, see whoever you please and be able to afford that sometime gigantic 20%. I have come to the conclusion that what really scares the American population is the word socialized. It conjures up images of communism and bread lines and scares the hell out of people who have never been out of their towns. I propose that the word social medicine be dumped and that federal medical plan be used instead. What if every American were covered by something like Medicare with some adjustments to control costs. The thing is also that physicians in Europe don't earn nearly as much as they do here, unless they are internationally famous. An average salary is probably in the range of 80,000. That is opposed for example to MDs in NYC making about half a million a year in private practice. In Italy, nobody goes into medicine to make money. It is a calling. If you want to make money there you have to pick another profession.

Paula

2 Posts

I live in Canada and I feel that our system is really quite wonderful. No one is refused access to healthcare and all people are treated equally (most of the time). We do have a lot of problems, however. We seem to have developed into a "drive-thru" healthcare society where things (tests, etc.) are taken advantage of because "IT"S FREE!". This is the attitude of many Canadians and (obviously) it is NOT true. We pay for it in our taxes, etc. This creates waiting lists, etc. It can be very frustrating. All in all, though, it does work very well.

Paula

2 Posts

I live in Canada and I feel that our system is really quite wonderful. No one is refused access to healthcare and all people are treated equally (most of the time). We do have a lot of problems, however. We seem to have developed into a "drive-thru" healthcare society where things (tests, etc.) are taken advantage of because "IT"S FREE!". This is the attitude of many Canadians and (obviously) it is NOT true. We pay for it in our taxes, etc. This creates waiting lists, etc. It can be very frustrating. All in all, though, it does work very well.

LindaC

23 Posts

Thank you both for replying: I don't think that the polictical climate in this country will soon see a federal insurance plan (but I sure like the name!). I will be keeping my eyes open and my heart open for a way to try to impact this HUGE problem which really hits almost every single person who lives here. If you have any ideas of how to become politically active on this behalf, please share your ideas with me. Thanks! linda.

LindaC

23 Posts

Thank you both for replying: I don't think that the polictical climate in this country will soon see a federal insurance plan (but I sure like the name!). I will be keeping my eyes open and my heart open for a way to try to impact this HUGE problem which really hits almost every single person who lives here. If you have any ideas of how to become politically active on this behalf, please share your ideas with me. Thanks! linda.

AnnieD

2 Posts

Linda,

I live in Canada as well and feel we have a pretty good system, but as Paula said, we do have some problems with the people that abuse it. If there was some way to control this without the cost of extra paperwork, it would be great. I feel strongly that if people would be proactive and take control of their health by living a healthy lifestyle, exercising and taking antioxidants which now are proving to be a necessary addition to our diet, we could save greatly on these costs, and possibly give discounts to those that do. Like smokers that pay higher premiums for life insurance! I do teach wellness and disease prevention so welcome anyone interested to contact me. I can send you to a great webpage also.

AnnieD

2 Posts

Linda,

I live in Canada as well and feel we have a pretty good system, but as Paula said, we do have some problems with the people that abuse it. If there was some way to control this without the cost of extra paperwork, it would be great. I feel strongly that if people would be proactive and take control of their health by living a healthy lifestyle, exercising and taking antioxidants which now are proving to be a necessary addition to our diet, we could save greatly on these costs, and possibly give discounts to those that do. Like smokers that pay higher premiums for life insurance! I do teach wellness and disease prevention so welcome anyone interested to contact me. I can send you to a great webpage also.

LindaC

23 Posts

Hi Annie, In what capacity do you teach wellness, who pays for it, private or govt health plan? In what area do you live? What are some of your subject areas for classes and who are the audiences? Linda.

LindaC

23 Posts

Hi Annie, In what capacity do you teach wellness, who pays for it, private or govt health plan? In what area do you live? What are some of your subject areas for classes and who are the audiences? Linda.

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