ML1376

Hello there. I've been an RN for 5 years. I have my BSN and got an MSN in Nursing Informatics from WGU. Many FNP programs don't accept WGU credits due to their "pass/fail" system. Carson-Newman says they offer an FNP certificate program and my MSN can shave off a few classes which is great. My concern: - The FNP certificate I would be taking is not CCNE certified. Their MSN-FNP is CCNE, however getting another MSN would be a lot longer and more $$. - Per the admission counselor, they are located in Tennessee (I'm in NJ) and the certificate program is regionally accredited (Southern Association of College and Schools Commission on Colleges.... mouthful). She said they are ANCC certified and CCNE accreditation will likely happen 2023 (no guarantee). - My MSN from WGU is CCNE accredited. This FNP program preps for FNP board/licensure. My question: Does having an MSN from a CCNE accredited school in Informatics offset not having a CCNE accredited FNP certificate? I figure the license is the license if I pass the boards. I don't want to put myself in an un-hirable or less hirable position should I pull the trigger on Carson Newman. Any/all thoughts or advice is appreciated. Thank you.

“We chalked that up to she is more important than us........in her eyes.” So wanting to protect herself and loved ones by not wanting to work in an environment where safety precautions were thrown out the window (putting it lightly).. where all across the country nurses were being threatened with termination if they didn’t jump in the fire.. where the front line “heroes” were exempt from the federal CARES Act that covered all other professions.. where in MANY cases not given hazard pay despite daily extreme risk when other professions were given it that had WAY less exposure to Covid, and you consider her stance to be one of “I’m more important than the other nurses...”. UNBELIEVABLE. Truly.. Nurses were BETRAYED and continue to be by the “President”, the government, the CDC, the healthcare system in general, AND by their own.. like you who dare shame a nurse.. having no real understanding of her story, her true risk, or her family situation. You shame her for not wanting to risk her life without properly enforced protection protocols that BEFORE this happened, she would be FIRED for not adhering to. I get there was/is a PPE shortage and patients need to be looked after (despite a national uproar on wearing something as simple as a *** mask that will keep cases down because you know.. personal “liberty” and “freedom” is more important than public health or in this case, death). Well sorry.. this country reaps what it sows.. With all that’s happened since March and US cases topping 4M and deaths in the hundreds of thousands and we STILL have a denier “President”.. we’re STILL outsourcing the vast majority of PPE.. from a country the “President” and true “patriots” routinely mock. He lets his son-in-law with ZERO experience and dead shark eyes lead the effort.. What an absolute joke. How about enacting that DPA bill that was signed in March so we can make our own PPE and not rely on a country that this country deems an “enemy”. The response and handling of this would be considered comical if not so unnecessary and tragic. I refuse to go back to bedside until these issues are resolved. Until REAL leadership is demonstrated. I refuse to risk getting infected (infecting friends and family) due to the complete ineptitude, laziness, and all around idiocy of the people currently running the show. If that makes me (or the nurse you feel considers herself more important than the others) a coward, so be it. This county and healthcare system needs to get it’s s**t together. We’re rightfully the laughing stock of the world.

Well, as an update, they didn't allow FMLA, but I took an unpaid LOA until the end of May. My manager emailed about the upcoming schedule and what my availability is. I've been in regular communication with my co-workers and consistently told how bad it is, how low they still are on PPE and reusing it, and having a discussion on reusing plastic gowns was a possibility if it continues. One nurse offered to buy a medical UV light to help with disinfecting equipment. He was told to come up with a presentation for that, even though nationally respected hospitals in our area are already using it. No sense of urgency.. PAPRs are finally in use but in short supply. Nurses from other floors have been infected. They say it's been war. The good news is that the numbers have been gradually going down, so that's comforting to hear. In response to my managers email, I asked if there was still a PPE shortage, and being that I failed the N95 fit test, will I now be able to use a PAPR (they denied it prior) for both positive and rule out covid patients being as test results still take 4-5 days to return. The response had a cool tone and not what I hoped for. Without directly citing, the response was: They have had appropriate PPE from the beginning and are using PPE conservation measures that all other healthcare systems around the world are using. They are dedicated to ensuring the protection of their colleagues and have been since day one. As far as answering my PAPR question, the response was indirectly.. "we have PAPRs available to colleagues as needed." Well.. these PPE conservation measures used all over the world are leading to healthcare workers untimely death all over the world, or the potential for permanent multi-organ damage. And to say there is an adequate supply of PPE is just factually not true. They may have just enough to not crash and burn, but I wouldn't call that having an appropriate level of PPE. I understand this is the stance a manager must take; she has to back up the hospital, especially in writing, but the tone spoke volumes. We both know what's going on with the situation and regarding my concerns, is really no different from when I left, but I feel her response makes it seem my decision was pure overreaction. So it looks like I'll be working elsewhere. I don't feel I can go back now as my concerns are still valid, and I'm sure my return won't be well received. I'm disappointed and feel a sense of betrayal, but this is the situation. I don't envy her position as a manager during this. I understand she may harbor a negative opinion as I am the only one on day shift to have gone on leave (others from night did though). That said, being higher risk with asthma and chronic bronchitis, a girlfriend on immuno-suppresants for respiratory issues, and seeing what I saw the last week I was there was eye opening in that I took care of several rule outs with 2 very likely positives at the time with one ill fitted N95 and management to allow a PAPR or even just the hood for extra protection, even though they were sitting unused in storage, etc.. Justifiably, I did not feel safe and lost confidence in their ability to protect us. I know I am explaining myself here as if to get approval. Being as the logic and emotion sides are still very much in conflict, I'm probably looking to get it from others, but in the end it won't change the situation. So that's all from over here. Thanks for reading/listening and everyone please stay safe out there.

I haven't been there since the end of March, but at that point, it was surgical masks only for covid rule outs, with test results taking 4-6 days to come back. Only if pt was having aersolizing procedures was an N95 required. That was protocol then and I'm told by my coworkers is still the case. So I guess you're kind of screwed if the patient turns out positive and you were only wearing a surgical mask and they went into a coughing fit, or otherwise got it into the air. Also most covid patients aren't in negative pressure rooms due to lack of availability. I got push-back from my manager and managers manager on PAPR use and told they could only be used on positive only patients.. not patients being ruled out. The issue here is the long test result time.. we could have been with a rule out that was really positive for that time frame only wearing a surgical mask, which I didn't and don't feel comfortable with, especially being high risk for complications myself. As anywhere else, sometimes what happens in the unit, stays in the unit.. routines and requirements aside. We do the best we can with what we have, whether it's true protocol or not. Rules can be and are bent if need be, but if you suffer as a result, in the name of doing it for the greater good, don't think they'll have your backs. They'll say you should've known better and been looking out for your safety first and foremost. It's talking out of both sides of their mouths, or they'll say there's no way to prove if we got it at the hospital or outside somewhere to avoid accountability. I was in the ER on covid detail with several rules outs, but two very likely positives, with a beard at the time (shaved the day after and failed the fit test then too), wearing N95's that didn't fit correctly obviously. One of the negative pressure rooms was broken, one worked, and the other two were regular rooms. They wouldn't give me a PAPR because the patients weren't officially positive yet. It was explained to me that they can't overuse the PAPRs due to a shortage of filters needed. I asked how about just the hood and I'll wear the N95 under it.. no filters needed. They still said no. So the PAPR was sitting there, not being used, while I'm caring for these patients who were coughing out of control wearing only an ill fitted N95 and only one negative pressure room out of 4 patients. They were completely fine with this scenario. No one jumped into to help out or look after my safety, and my attempts to address it were shot down. So yeah.. what "should be" and "what is" are often vastly different as we're all seeing.

And you shouldn’t be posting with that bs. Whoever is to blame, RN’s should not have to put their lives on the line, every 12 hour shift, every week for an indeterminate amount time. Included in the oath you’re should speaking about, should RN’s risk the lives of their families snd loved ones? When graduating nursing school, I don’t remember swearing to be be willing to risk my life if my employer in, no matter who's to blame, is unable to provide adequate protection, or even mentioning anything about risking my life period. What nursing school did you go to where you swore to that? Either way, hope you’re kickin *** out there, Captain Covid. Focus more on healing corona patients and leave people alone who are having an incredibly tough time struggling to navigate this bungled pandemic.

Yeah. Was just getting an update from 2 on the ICU status today. It’s pretty bleak. But I understand. Looking at different opportunities I can find.

Thank you everyone for the much needed and insightful feedback. Let me change the point of view.. from the teams perspective. if you had a co-worker abruptly put two weeks in, A teammate with asthma, chronic bronchitis, and anxiety and he didn't catch anything yet but was leaving the team for fear of getting it (the team is getting crushed daily with these cases and dealing with the same lack of ppe and safety protocols every shift). If he requested FMLA, then requested indefinite reasonable accommodations all reaching dead ends, so he said fine and quit, what would your thought/opinion be of him. As a nurse manager, charge RN, fellow RN, or even lab or resp tech, attending, or specialist. Just curious..

Beautifully said..

Losing "friends" because of it? I question that title, no offense. Nursing friends/co-workers or ones who have no idea what it's like and are judging simply for the sake of it? Either way, If they won't or or for whatever reason cannot understand how out of control and dire this situation is and further, judge you on how you feel and think about it regarding wanting to protect your health, and the life of your immunocompromised mother, I question them as friends at all. We all have "friends" like that at some point. Not telling you what to do, but it's worth questioning.. You are a human being and BY FAR not alone in thinking and feeling these things. Just look at the topics here and the hundreds of thousands of people viewing them, replying, creating new ones. It's so bad out there and dangerous and it all came about so quickly and intensely. You do what's best for you and your family, period and forget what those "friends" have to say on the matter.

I can definitely relate.. not so much on the kids factor, but the overall dilemma, as I believe all of us on here can. And to see how it is currently being bungled and completely mismanaged from the local level all the way up to the White House and has been from the beginning is nauseating. And it will continue to be... At the end of the day (and this is a decision I made for myself), you do what you have to do. The dilemma is... continue how you are and risk yours and possibly husbands and kids health, or step away until things are managed properly in terms of safety protocols, necessary protection and equipment, etc. I made my choice a week ago and everyday have been going back and forth if it was wrong or right.. what I will think about it when it's over, etc. I'm in ICU as well, and as you probably are too, I'm seeing younger healthy people with little to no co-morbidities being taken out quick and intensely, after presenting initially with mild symptoms and sent home to self quarantine. Sure, as critical care RN's, we see the worst of the worst, but there is no magic 8 ball, with who gets it and how hard. With CDC safety "recommendations" what they are, and indefinite limited PPE, we're getting exposed way more and with greater viral loads then anyone else. Between the two decisions you can make... stay or go, pros and cons points can be debated on and on. But beyond all the debate, external, and certainly internal, what is the TOP priority? I think you know.. Your kids need a mother and your husband needs a wife. Your parents need their daughter.. And you need them all just as much. So as long as these roles are being fulfilled, everything will work out.. maybe not exactly as planned, but what ever does?

Please contact a health care provider!

Hello there.. I just wanted to reach out to you. I have to say, my heart breaks after reading that. Regarding work, are you in a high risk group and if so, can you do FMLA? Do you have any money saved if you want to step away? Maybe if you don't already, you could move in with your parents or a friend/relative to cut costs? I'm suggesting these, because I feel you need to get out of there. What you're going through in your personal life is very much tough enough. Being divorced myself, I can relate. Mine was unexpected and it hit hard. That said, the last thing you need on top of everything is the non-stop stress and fear of everything going on now. I can't imagine going through what I did personally and having the covid situation weighing it all done. It has to be crushing. I'm working on a leave of absence now. Thankfully I have a little money saved and supportive family if need be. I really hope you are in a similar situation. I obviously don't know you, but given what I've read, I'd strongly suggest considering stepping away from work until things settle down. This is by no means normal in terms of nursing.. in terms of anything, and being a new grad, I can't even imagine how it's hitting you. And if you ever feel the need to do something drastic, PLEASE get help/reach out first. You're in a burning house now with everything you're going through. First things first, find a way to get out of the house (work), so you can deal with the personal issues and not worry about your health and safety. A red flag doesn't get much bigger than having management request staff fill out advanced directives.. you have to leave there.. Hello there.. I just wanted to reach out to you. I have to say, my heart breaks after reading that. Regarding work, are you in a high risk group and if so, can you do FMLA? Do you have any money saved if you want to step away? Maybe if you don't already, you could move in with your parents or a friend/relative to cut costs? I'm suggesting these, because I feel you need to get out of there. What you're going through in your personal life is very much tough enough. Being divorced myself, I can relate. Mine was unexpected and it hit hard. That said, the last thing you need on top of everything is the non-stop stress and fear of everything going on now. I can't imagine going through what I did personally and having the covid situation weighing it all done. It has to be crushing. I'm working on a leave of absence now. Thankfully I have a little money saved and supportive family if need be. I really hope you are in a similar situation. I obviously don't know you, but given what I've read, I'd strongly suggest considering stepping away from work until things settle down. This is by no means normal in terms of nursing.. in terms of anything, and being a new grad, I can't even imagine how it's hitting you. And if you ever feel the need to do something drastic, PLEASE get help/reach out first. You're in a burning house now with everything you're going through. First things first, find a way to get out of the house (work), so you can deal with the personal issues and not worry about your health and safety. A red flag doesn't get much bigger than having management request staff fill out advanced directives.. you have to leave there..

Thank you for pointing that out. Something I meant to include in my last reply but got caught up with everything else haha. But it's sad and true nonetheless. And when that happens, nurses from far and wide won't be able to leave work to attend the funeral, nor will there be police escorts, a 12-gun salute, folding flags, or people saluting the heroism of the RN as they do in the other professions. Not that any of that is needed.. it's just more insult to injury when hearing the "you signed up for this!" response.

One study, in one journal, that involved one instance of exposure. Not convinced just yet..

At first your point hit me. But I then gave your comparison some thought and here’s my take. Sorry.. this is going to be long.. Parkland vs. Covid? Apples to oranges. Parkland was a one-time occurrence in an emergency situation. He had the necessary equipment to handle it. Regarding Covid, let’s take the Parkland scenario, except let’s drag it out over months.. Week 1: one shooter and a fully equipped guard with bullet proof vest, firearm, etc. Week 2: two-three shooters and school administration takes his vest away. Week 4: ten shooters, administration replaces gun with hunting knife and won’t give vest back due to ongoing supply shortages. And let’s talk about ongoing shortages.. The fact we have an unprecedented pandemic couldn’t have been foreseen. HOWEVER, it’s not as if there haven’t been warning signs in years prior that should have had hospitals, municipalities, states, and the government itself better prepared. Between epidemics, natural disasters, etc., there have been PLENTY of events that should have made us realize we need to be better prepared at all times.. not at the time of the disaster itself. Emergency planning 101 folks... Our government decided to go the opposite route having dismantled the Pandemic Task Force in 2018. CDC Timeline 2000s Going along with this, let’s say Parkland school authorities received word that an attack was in the works and would be happening sometime in the next month or two. After receiving the warning, administrators downplay it, even saying "it’s nothing to worry about….” And then it happens.. and it wasn’t just one shooter, but dozens... Who’s fault is it then? The lone guards for being out-manned, outgunned and under-equipped? Or maybe the higher ups who didn’t take it seriously and did nothing both prior to, and after the warning to prepare themselves and protect the students? Why is it some local hospitals here were proactive and had plans in place.. connections made prior with local business to retrofit their businesses to make healthcare supplies and have deep staffing so they truly can protect all of their workers and send those home if need be or not ask them to come back if still exhibiting symptoms. When business and/or government operate on a razors edge at all times, it doesn’t take much for the whole system to crash.. truly a house of cards. And let’s talk about nurses… Lately we’ve been getting “thank you for your service..” “we care about you and your safety” from management. Sure doesn’t feel that way. They care and protect us if possible, but if not, have no qualms throwing us in the fire for the “greater good”. They say how much they appreciate us in one breath, and in the next, threaten us with disciplinary action or termination if we speak up on an assignment that unsafe to us and/or the patient regarding potential Covid transmission. If quarantined, we have to use our own PTO. And here’s another kicker showing how “appreciated” we are.. Health care providers are excluded from the Families First Coronavirus Response Act. As stated: “the FFCRA says that the DOL can ‘issue regulations for good cause . . . to exclude certain health care providers and emergency responders.’” Further stating “an employer of an employee who is a health care provider or an emergency responder can elect to exclude such employee from the application of the provisions in the amendments made [in] this Act.” We are being told we “signed up for this” as if we’re military, but we don’t get any of their benefits.. We don’t get to retire in our fifties with a full pension, we don’t get lifetime benefits after retirement, we don’t get a GI bill.. hell, we don’t even get military discounts or special healthcare worker rates. We also don’t get hazard pay the way the police here are (time and a half).. or even dialysis nurses (Double time, who by the way are told if the hospital they are visiting doesn’t have proper PPE, they don’t have to accept the assignment). Do I feel bad about my decision? Yes, and you’re post made me feel worse. But when I think about it, it’s because I feel I left my coworkers behind. If my health and safety were protected the way it should be (and is at other facilities), I’d be right there with them. Let me do my job safely and I’m there til the end. Throw me to the wolves and treat me like I’m expendable, not taking my health and those of my loved ones into account? I’m out.. Hopefully the next disaster (there will be others) will be prepared for better, but I doubt it.. because we gotta keep saving/making those dollars today and passing the buck. It’s just how business is done..