Detox against their will.....

Your response was rude, non-productive and quite immature. I can't believe this "sentiment" is coming from another nurse, almost ashamed of it. ..----"

You're right, wasnt productive in the least. What I dont understand tho, is that you defend the right to "put them through a battery of painful tests" because youre fed up, and yet you are "ashamed" of my comment? Save your cynicism. I have been called names, screamed at, hit, etc by many a confused, sick, angry pt. Noone said nursing was easy or even fun sometimes. We deal with SICK people. We deal with undeducated, angry, confused, fearful, mean, filthy, and sometimes violent PEOPLE. They dont all deserve kind, sweet, heartfelt words and hugs. But they do deserve the best we as nurses has to give, and if you're feeling beat up, well maybe you wont have compassion in your words or eyes - I hope however, you have compassion in your heart.

Nowhere did I see anyone "defend their right" to put anyone through a battery of painful tests. I hear some nurses venting, justifiably, about being abused.

I would suggest that you look into your own heart for some compassion towards your fellow nurses. Being in recovery doesn't give one the right to spew venom at anyone who doesn't get it.

One of the (many) reasons I left ICU nurses was the number of ICU beds being taken up by patients going through withdrawal, and we had to administer Ativan or Valium and do the stupid CIWA scale every 15 minutes to an hour to check their status. One guy was upset that I didn't push the Ativan fast enough. There were days that up to one third of the beds were taken up with ETOHers, and this is in a plush suburban community hospital.

I know this is mean, but I would love to give some of these folks 3 changes at nice, tranquilized withdrawal in an ICU (over a lifetime), and after that, they just have to do it at home. I think it's a waste of money and resources.

Feeling cranky,

Oldiebutgoodie

You're right, wasnt productive in the least. What I dont understand tho, is that you defend the right to "put them through a battery of painful tests" because youre fed up, and yet you are "ashamed" of my comment? Save your cynicism. I have been called names, screamed at, hit, etc by many a confused, sick, angry pt. Noone said nursing was easy or even fun sometimes. We deal with SICK people. We deal with undeducated, angry, confused, fearful, mean, filthy, and sometimes violent PEOPLE. They dont all deserve kind, sweet, heartfelt words and hugs. But they do deserve the best we as nurses has to give, and if you're feeling beat up, well maybe you wont have compassion in your words or eyes - I hope however, you have compassion in your heart.

Please, don't flatter yourself with hoping that you made me feel "beat up". I do have compassion. I have compassion for the demented 94 year old patient who wanted to climb out of bed so I sat with her for over an hour and held her hand and watched her look at my badge and then look up at me. Do you have compassion? Do you have it for your fellow nurses who deal with patients who are mean and violent? It's so easy for one to say that nurses who are generally annoyed with taking care of drunk/high beligerant patients, are lacking compassion. I do feel compassion for these patients. Yes, they are hard to deal with. Yes, their life is sad and they live they way the do. But I think it lacks compassion for a nurse to think that other nurses should just deal with it.

Anyhow, I'm done.

I don't believe in forcing sobriety upon anyone. The individual has got to be the one to make that choice. It's a hard situation. Yes, alcohol addiction is a disease but there are many factors as to why someone has this disease and I don't think it's always because someone wanted to be drunker than a doornail for the rest of their life.

What's the solution than? Obviously we can't provide bottles of rum on the floor, and not all of these patients are healthy enough to just come in and out of emerg. I would much rather deal with a sedated detoxing person than one that I got drunk.

Personally, I think that we are so concerned with "over-sedating" that instead of just insuring that the person doesn't seize or stroke or go into DT's we waste nursing time checking Q1H when we KNOW they're gonna need another freakin' Ativan.

Legalize all of it. Give people sandwiches outside of the ED.

Why can't we just give them a beer in the ER and send them along their merry little way and stop holding up our rooms for people who legitimately need them?

Isn't that enabling?

Isn't that enabling?

I kind of do agree with this statement. Although, I would rather give them a beer than have them go into DTs.

If I get a pt with a hx of ETOH or substance abuse, and they tell me they want help to get clean and stay that way, I will move heaven and earth to get them into treatment.

However....

Those of us in the trenches know that most of these folks don't want to get clean, they want to be patched together enough to go right back to whatever self destructive behavior put them in the hospital in the first place.

And why do we treat them in the ER instead of turning them around at the door? EMTALA. What are the two "prongs" of EMTALA? That they a)present at the ER or any other part of the campus and that they b) request treatment/assessment. Well, if someone is brought to the ER by the county/police/fire/EMS and they are drunk/stoned, they are covered by EMTALA, as ETOH/substance abuse is classified as a disease process, even if it's the cops or EMS who "present" the pt and "request treatment."

I'm just waiting to be sued by one of our frequent flyers for the cost of his drugs because I ruined his high....