cindyrn1

Who do you have to provide the Mental Health services in your prisons? We are privately contracted in the prison that I am with in Missouri. I was just wondering who provided your mental health services and how big that staff is? Do you have an RN that deals with the psychotropic meds and orders etc?

Hello to all! Those of you nurses who have your BSN or MSN, could you tell me about how long it will take me to get my license from an ADN? I have numerous college credits that I can use, but I am unsure as to what is going to be needed for me to further my education. Can you clep out of some courses? What are some of the courses that you have to take to start on your BSN degree? Did you find it harder than regular RN school? Can I do some of it online since I work full time and have 3 kids at home? Any information you could give me would be greatly appreciated. One more thing..at this point in time, does it make a difference whether you have a BSN or Masters in Nursing when there is such a nursing shortage? Are the jobs out there for BSN's or Masters level RN's? Thanks.:wink2:

merry christmas! i wanted to give you another option for your nursing career in missouri......cms in the prison system and forensic psych nursing at mid mo mental health or fulton state hospital. cms is desperate for nurses right now where i work and they are paying really well along with shift differential and bonus shifts. the prison is located in fulton, mo which is about 30 miles from columbia. fulton state hospital is also located in fulton, mo but it's a whole different type of nursing. you are dealing with the criminally insane and it's a fairly dangerous job. (i worked there for 7 years). mid mo mental health hospital in columbia is run by the same ceo as fulton state and it's much safer than fulton state. it's a state job so the benefits are great as well. let me know if you would like any other information on these areas? oh and when i worked at capital region in jefferson city, i was making about $35 an hour working 2 twelve hour shifts on the weekends only. a great job with full time benefits.

We use to have a male nurse that would take the cap off of the syringe and drag the needle down the concrete wall on the way to the patients room before giving the patient a shot. This way it would dull it and hurt worse going in!!!!! I never saw him do it but I had heard from other nurses that he did it and then he would brag about doing things like that. About 20 years ago at the same hospital, the aides gave the medicines to the patients and they wouldn't even measure what they were giving. If the patient was upset in the slightest, he would recieve a large dose of thorazine or haldol and if the patient was calm, he would get just enough to keep him calm. Needless to say, being a new nurse in this hospital proved to be very difficult when I refused to do anything close to what they were accustomed to. You just would not believe some of the things that go on in State facilities. There are some good nurses that work in this system yet there are some really bad ones as well. The male nurse I was talking about above, has since died. I had another nurse who had been at this facility for several years and she ended up being fired because she forced an NG tube into a patient perforating the patient's sinuses and causing permanent nerve damage to that area. I am not perfect in any way shape or form but I think I would have stopped once I realized the patient was screaming in pain?????? :angryfire

When I worked at a State Forensic Psych Hospital I knew an aide that got pregnant by a patient and she still works there. On another incident an aide was caught having sex with this same patient on the floor in the canteen but she called it rape and so she still works there. An LPN that worked with me was smoking pot everyday and even after documenting her behaviors and them finding her urine dirty, she got her job back because it was considered an ADA issue? I can't believe all of these people still have jobs with the State but yet someone like me who tried to go back to work there when I couldn't find anything else was told that I was not elgible for rehire.......why?????? Because I didn't get along with one of my supervisors and I wasn't doing my groups during the week. Outrageous huh? None of the nurses were doing groups except me and yet I was not elgible for rehire because of that? It's incidents like these that really make me question my career choice sometimes. It is a known fact that more people trust nurses than any other profession. Yet the "bad" ones seem to stick around while the good ones get fired, laid off or let go. Sad.

There is definetly something wrong with society! Our tax money pays for a lot of things for the incarcerated. You just wouldn't believe the kinds of things these people get! Seriously, I have so many of them that would rather be in prison than back out on the streets. And in the Department of Mental health, they simply get EVERYTHING they want. So who would want to leave there? Something is terribly wrong with the whole system when they put these kind of people first and people like us that follow the rules etc get hardly nothing especially when we need it! :angryfire

Hello~ I just interviewed for a DON position with CMS and am wondering why this company has such a bad reputation? I would really appreciate your telling me the things that you know are wrong with it so that I can at least have a heads up before making a decision to take the job. You can IM me if you want. I have just heard over and over that no one wants to work for CMS. Why?????????

I too get very angry when I hear that offenders get the flu shots but individuals that have not committed a crime and need the shot cannot get it. I too think that when you mention chronic illness in the prison population there should be more detail given as to what bunch that is. I don't think that just because you have Hep C you should get to get the flu shot. I think it should be only those offenders that have SERIOUS medical conditions, pregnant women and the elderly in the prison setting. They mention in that article from the CDC that health care workers should get a flu shot as well. I believe we should too but if it were between me and a another person who really needed it, I would give my shot up. As a nurse I have been able to fend off most of the nasty bugs that go around. Plus if I were to get the flu.......I would be able to take a day off to rest~! I know that the flu can be very dangerous but again, they need to be more specific on who gets the shot and who doesn't. I bet you the Department of Mental Health is giving out shots for all of their patients........not fair at all! I know that they are insane most of them but there are many that are not insane but just copped a plea to keep out of prison. I think once again, they need to prioritize which patient will get the shot based on their medical conditions.

I have an LPN friend that desperately wants to go to RN school but can't due to finances. Does anyone have any ideas on how she can get the money and financial assistance to put her through school? She said that they take your last years income to decide if you qualify for a pell grant so she can't get a grant. It's been so long since I went to school that I don't even know where to direct her to get help. But surely some of you new grads could help me out in giving her some info on how to get her RN with very little money that she makes right now. I would really appreciate any advice or suggestions. Thanks~!

I have an interview tomorrow for a DON of a huge Prison and I am wondering what the pay range is for a DON with CMS and what are some of the job duties that will be required in a job like this? I currently work in the prison system but I am the Mental Health RN. I only make $40,000 a year and that's with me driving an hour to and from work everyday with only 10 hours of PTO time per month! I would appreciate any insight anyone could give me on this. I am in the Central part of the Country. Thanks. :balloons:

I have been a psych RN for 15 years and have worked with every age from 2 to 99. I know for a fact that I would never want to be a social worker for the pure fact that I would be limited in what I could do for them. Right now I am a Mental Health RN for a huge Women's prison and I love what I am doing. I get to spend time with each of the inmates (like a social worker does), I get to do groups with the inmates, I get to handle crisis interventions, and best of all I have an excellent relationship with my psychiatrist and I make sure these inmates get the meds that they need or get them changed as needed. I am the only Psych nurse for 1800 women and it's such a great feeling hearing an inmate say that they are feeling 100% better since starting on their meds and that they actually have goals for when they go home. I start my day at 7:30 am or 8 am depending on when I want to come in. I get in my mailbox to see what MSR's (medical services requests) have been submitted from the day before. I then look up on the computer when they were last seen by a psychiatrist, what meds they are on, if they have been compliant with meds and what they are wanting to be seen for. I then call out the ones that I need to see. I might spend 4 hours a day talking to inmates about what their problems are and how meds might help them. Then I spend the remaining time charting on my computer everything I talked to the inmate about. I then order the meds, make copies and take them over to Medical so that they will pass the meds that were ordered by the psychiatrist. There are days that inmates are sent over from medical in a crisis (crying, anxiety attack, etc) and I will deal with them on an individual basis getting them whatever they might need. I will also go over to the mental health side of the housing unit to see the ones that are in a program for the mentally ill. I have groups with those inmates. My biggest job though is ensuring these mentally ill inmates are taking their meds and if they aren't why not? It's a great job and I love what I am doing. There is some days that there is stress but it's very short lived and easily manageable. The officers are a huge help in all situations because if an inmate gets out of hand or raises their voice in a threatening manner, all you do is call the officer and they take the inmate away. I almost always leave after working my 8 hours. If I want to work 4 ten hour days and take a 3 day weekend I can. But I usually just do my 5 days a week. There is virtually no overtime and I rarely leave any work undone from that day. When I worked in a Forensic Hospital (Maximum Security) I worked with aides and WE had to deal with the aggressive patient. So I was in physical altercations almost everyday. I got hurt more times than I can count when I worked there. I finally decided that my life was more important than losing it working with those kind of mentally ill patients. Prison is SOOOOOOOO much better. I hope this helps you in seeing what kind of day I have when I work everyday. The drive to and from work is the only thing I hate about my job because it takes me an hour to and from work. But so far it's worth it to have this great job. Good luck to you in whatever you decide to do. Regular hospital nursing on Med/Surg was probably my worst job ever and working with children and adolescents in psych has been my best job ever. Take care! :balloons:

Hello! I am a Psych nurse and have specialized in this kind of nursing for almost 20 years. My son was diagnosed with ADHD before he even started kindergarten but only because I knew the signs and he had most of them by age 4!!! If it weren't for the medication, he would have had a very hard time making it through the early years in school thus causing him to probably fail a few years. I, like you, didn't want to put my baby on meds right away but after a lot of research and working with these sort of kids, I realized that my child needed the medicine. Their little brains are moving a thousand miles a minute and this is very disturbing for them. They can't help what they do sometimes and I really feel sorry for the ones that aren't on meds or can't pay for the meds to help their condition. I am a ADHD adult and let me tell you, if I would have been treated earlier in life, things might have been a little different for me. I have never regretted NOT being on meds, but my mother has since told me that I was such a handful for her growing up. I just started STRATERRA yesterday matter in fact. This is a NON stimulant medication for ADHD. So a lot less side effects like for the Adderal, Ritalin or Dexedrine. I don't mean to go on and on about this subject, but please use your heart to decide if your child needs to be on meds or not. It certainly isn't going to hurt him if he does go on meds but if he doesn't, he will be miserable because his little brain and motor movements are going to be so fast. If you have any questions or would just like to IM me, please feel free to do so. I went through hell and back with my son and his ADHD. If I can help just one person understand what the child goes through and what the parent has to deal with, I feel that I have done good. I actually feel that my ADHD has helped me in my career and excelling in what I do as a nurse so I used my disease as a constructive disease. Always remember, love your child no matter what and please don't hesitate to do what's best for your child. That's just my opinion on this subject. Have a great evening. Cindy :balloons:

Thank you for your reply and advice........BUT I did go to work for Corrections but not in the same capacity as most nurses do. I am the Mental Health RN for the facility sub contracted. I love what I am doing! There are days that are worse than others but overall, it's a great job. No stress whatsoever. I do not have to pass meds or run to codes or deal with the medical needs of the population. I am only responsible for the mentally ill and their meds. I work closely with the psychiatrist and the therapist that work with me. I have my own hours, my own office and my own secretary. I have finally found the job that I have always wanted! I love psych nursing and this job is the ultimate. Sometimes I think it's too good to be true! But, I work very hard everyday and drive an hour to work and an hour home. So it makes for a very long work week most of the time. I just wish that other nurses could enjoy their careers half as much as I do right now. I know that I will never go back to the State as a psych nurse because of the way they treated their nurses. The Department of Mental Health really needs an overhaul and some of their administrators need to retire or get nice! Now that was work! A forensic psych hospital for the criminally insane. Too many things you were responsible for. I loved what I did, but couldn't take the pressure of administration beating me down all the time. Nothing was ever good enough for them. So I quit there. And hopefully will never go back. But enough of my job. Thanks for writing and I hope you are enjoying your career as a nurse as well. :balloons:

Do you work in Chilli? I never heard of any sexual misconduct in either prison but of course I just started too. I love my job and I love the people that I work with. I am very impressed with the way that they do things in this prison and the way that they are actually trying to make a difference in the women's lives. It's a very clean prison and the inmates are so well behaved (most of the time ha ha). I am really glad that I have been given this opportunity to work in this prison setting.

Since this is the greatest nursing site to get information I thought I would see if anyone knew where I could find the percentage chart they use to determine your injury amount? I know that the back is a 400 and the knee is 160 but I need the chart as well as the calculations they use to determine how much you will get based on your rating from the WC doctor. I have 5 cases that will be heard in July and I am wanting to get some information from anyone to find out what they ended up settling for for their particular injuries. A few friends of mine settled out for $17,000 on their backs but they weren't hardly injured at all compared to me. My attorney is telling me that we are looking at close to $20,000 for both of my knees. I use to work in a very dangerous place where physical take downs happened almost everyday. I hit the concrete floors on my knees for almost 7 years doing these take downs and now I am suffering from the wear and tear of the cartilage and have arthritis like problems. This does not count the numerous concusions I have had, the 3 bulging discs, the 8 abdominal hernias and a few other injuries that we are fighting for. I just need some information or true case stories from you all that have been through a workman's comp case before and what I should be looking for. Can I settle for a cash settlement and yet still be taken care of in the future when these discs become worse? I know working with WC is a horrible ordeal because I have been dealing with them 2 years now with my injuries and they simply do not care. I had to hire an attorney because they just wouldn't do anything to help me. Anyways, if you know of any websites that I can look at to get an idea of the percentages of the body or if you have been through a case and can help me, I sure would appreciate some of your information. Thanks. :)

Who is your immediate supervisor? Who hired you? If you are salary, then why should you have to clock in? Sounds like you are being harassed by your co-workers. If you work over 40 hours then that's overtime.......federal law. And since you are salary, you can leave when you want to! I would be doing some talking to someone and I would do it really soon.

An excellent way to ensure the IM is taking his meth. Of course, I do not understand how anyone who is coming off drugs would WANT to give their methadone away! And to drink someone else's vomit to get it??????? Sick! I just hope our facility doesn't start this methadone programming. It's an excellent idea and I am a methadone advocate for treatment of drug dependency but with 1600 women, I think they would all take it if we offered it to them.

I totally agree with you that administration does not care what happens to the staff! I too worked in a Max Security Forensic Hospital and even though the staff were getting seriously hurt, administration was still working on a policy to do away with 4 point restraints and seclusion!!!!!!!! And we as nurses had to work our ward no matter what the threats were against us. A client once threatened to rape a stafff member and even though administration knew about it, they did nothing to keep it from happening and the man almost suceeded in raping this staff member. He waited a few weeks before he tried but the point is, admin knew about it and didn't care! Those people who have told you that this anti-social pig can come back anytime he wants to, should have to work with this one patient for 40 hours a week! They sit at their big desks or go to bogus meetings or luncheons and then try to tell us how to do our jobs. I tell you that I really feel for the people that are working at the last job I had because most of them need a job and this is all that they can find right now. But I sure wish they would make a stand and strike for better work conditions and better support from administration etc. Griping and complaining about things isn't going to get them anything. They are going to have to make a huge impact by walking out or calling in for their shift or something. There has got to be some changes in our systems before any more people die from trying to protect society from the criminally insane.

First of all I am jealous that you have such a great job! Where are you located that they have a Partial Hospitalization Program? Second of all, there are so many things you can do in your program being the nurse and all. The main thing is that you need to keep your subject short and to the point. You will find that 35-45 minute groups are about as long as they can take at one time. Also handouts work best with those in your group. It allows them to look at something while you are talking about it. With medication education, you can always have the drug reps come and see you with their samples and have them give you one of their tapes. I had tons of them when I was Director of a PHP program. Let the tapes do the teaching and then you do the answering of the questions in lay-men's terms. Always search the internet and it too will give you lots of information. I didn't have the luxury of having the internet when I did PHP's. As for groups, as long as your groups are called psychoeducational and they are a certain length of time, you can bill the clients for every group that you do. Some of the groups that I did were: Depression, Anxiety, Assertiveness vs Aggressiveness, Active listening skills, Communication skills, Medication management and symptomology, Grief and Loss, Personality Disorders, and so many more. You could spend one week discussing the different areas of Depression. Try to do groups around the time of the year too. Like at Christmas, a good discussion to start is on Depression because so many people have trouble with depression during this time. I would be more than happy to answer any questions if you have any on PHP's. Take care and good luck in your job. :balloons:

I am trying to find other Mental Health RN's that are working in Corrections so that I can hear how they do things at their facility. I am the only RN for 1600 women and 550 of them have some sort of mental illness listed in their problems. I am responsible for assessing them before they see the psychiatrist. I assess for the need to change medications, increase or decrease the meds, provide groups for the inmates, provide medication education, respond to all of the Medical Services Requests, and assess the referrals from the therapist in our department. We have about 15 people responsible for the Mental Health Department for the whole prison so we are a very close bunch. I love what I do now and am just interested in talking to some others that do what I do. Look forward to hearing from you!

I wrote this a few months ago before I got my current job. I am now the Mental Health Nurse of a Maximum Security Women's Prison. I have at least 500 inmates with psychiatric issues. I am not responsible for passing their meds......I do the assessments when their meds need changed or if they need to be discontinued or whatever. I get my orders from our psychiatrist and then put them into the computer so that medical will start the medications for the IM. I am responsible for providing groups for the campus on medication management and symptomology. I love this job! It's the best one I have had since I became a nurse. I had one other job where I absolutely loved it and was at the top of my ladder, but the place was closed down. But ironically my boss from that job is the CEO of the Mental Health Department that provides services for the prisons in my State! I have to drive about an hour to and from work but it's so worth it when you work a job that you love. My starting salary is the same as yours. I will get cost of living raises and whatever raises our company gives for profits they make. I have worked Forensic Psych and now Corrections and I prefer Corrections any day! Mentally ill criminals are the most dangerous people to work with. I learned a lot working at the State Hospital for 7 years, but I also left with injuries that will be with me until I die. In the prison setting there is consequences for bad behavior unlike in the Mental Health system. Anyway, I am still learning something new everyday at my job and I love it. Oh and I set my own hours too. If I need a day off, I just work one day on the weekend and I can take a 3 day weekend or whatever. I hope that this is the job that I retire from. I hope that you like what you are doing as well. What State are you from? :balloons:

Very interesting topic.....working with men or women in the prison system. Well I have done both. I started as a Forensic Psych Nurse in a Maximum Security hospital and now I am in a Maximum Security Women's Prison. While in the hospital setting I worked with the men for a few years and found that working with men were so much easier than with the women! Plus they would fight fair. When I say fight I mean literally fight. The ones that I took care of in the hospital were extremely aggressive and many of my co-workers were seriously injured through the years we worked together. I too suffered some serious injuries and I am still in a Workman's Comp situation awaiting a court hearing. Anyways, women are harder to work with because they whine about everything!!!!!!!!! They have medicine for every single feeling you could possibly have and they have ointments, cremes, suppositories for every orifice of their bodies! They are domineering, sneaky, rude, viscious, emotional, erratic, demanding, disrespectful and just plain mean. Most of them have a mission to see just how upset they can get you or just how many people they can get fired for the fun of it. They fight against their fellow patients and they fight the staff that try to take care of them. They know more about staff and their personal life than the co-workers theirselves as the patients will sneak around and listen to every word a staff member is saying. They use anything and everything they can against you if you don't do something for them. They write grievances for every tiny thing they can come up with. And those tears........tears that can be turned on and off at will. They so over exaggerate everything that happens. I am an empathetic nurse but very cautious when it comes to my assessments of the inmates. I prefer to work with the women only because I hate dealing with the males that make sexually inappropriate statements, flirt, or whine like a girl. They are much easier to work with on the whole, but just not what I want to do. I am a Mental Health RN in the prison system now and it's a wonderful job. I enjoy working with the women and helping them try to get their lives back on track so that they can fit back into society.

I worked for the State for almost 7 years at a Maximum Security Forensic Hospital. The patients in this type of setting are ones that have plead Guilty by reason of Insanity. Trust me, some of them just copped a plea to avoid being subjected to real consequences for their crime. Anyway, these patients who have committed horrible crimes (some too horrific to talk about) have better clothing than the staff, wear name brand tennis shoes, eat better than most families, have more parties that most of us in a year, receive better medical attention than those of us that pay for insurance and still think they deserve better treatment!!!!!!!!!!! A patient could buy $500 worth of clothes every 6 months and would buy FUBU, Tommy Hilfiger etc. Levi jeans, NIKE tennis shoes and all sorts of clothing. I knew patients that had 8 pair of tennis shoes or more that were practically brand new because they would have so much money to spend, they couldn't wear their tennis shoes out before the next clothing market! Each month there would be a Birthday party for any patient who had a birthday that month and again, they would receive birthday gifts courtesy of the TAX PAYERS! For meals they have had anything from Shrimp to Ribeye. They would have individual ward parties for various reasons and would be able to order out for McDonalds etc. TAX PAYERS were providing these criminals with the BEST that anyone could possibly want while serving their time. Now, I understand that some of the patients were truly sick, mentally and needed our help but to provide these patients with the luxury lifestyle that most staff couldn't even afford for their own families? Oh let's not forget the Olympic size swimming pool, the brand new gym and the Bowling alley and pool table room. I cannot believe that the politicians in our States don't realize just how much money we are losing to give these criminals a life of luxury!!!!!! If there was something I could do to bring these kind of things to the attention of our lawmakers, I would. So what are we teaching our criminals while they are incarcerated???????? You come to prison or go to a State Hospital and you can live the life of free food, movies, entertainment, NICE clothes and shoes and all the good medication that you could want. Then guess what? They get out and do you think they can afford to keep their "new lifestyle" up on the streets? I don't think so, not without having to commit another crime to get the money. Our State Hospital patients had 78 channels to watch on the TV, movies every weekend with buttered popcorn and soda. I will tell you that most of the patients that I worked with had gained at least 100# per year on the average. Our Tax dollars are going towards making our inmates feel like a Queen or King! As for the murder of this nurse..........it is outrageus that something like this could have happened. I feel for her family and friends during this painful time. Whoever did this to her, I hope they punish him to the fullest extent of the law. You give some of these criminals an inch and they take a mile. I had a patient once tell me that if a woman wouldn't give him what he wanted, he would take it because it was his right. Now this patient was able to say this to me without batting an eyelash and then laughed after he said it. He was in for numerous rapes and attempted murder but....... Guilty by reason of Insanity. Doesn't sound insane to me....just sounds like a man that has no remorse for his actions and has taken so much in life that he feels that whatever he wants he takes no matter who he hurts in the process. I did not mean to say so much in this post but it angers me to no end that our States are allowing our inmates and our mentally ill criminals to receive so much! Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous for free.......all you have to do is to commit a crime and you can have so much given to you for free! One last note, I did read somewhere that some States are beginning to make inmates pay for their stay while incarcerated. An excellent move on the States part. I hope that it works and that all States pass this law. Even if they don't have the money to do it, they should be responsible for the payment for the rest of their lives or until they can get their bill paid off. Sure would take some of the burden off us tax payers. Keep us posted on the case with the Nurse who lost her life taking care of humans that most people would rather throw away than deal with. My prayers are with her family.

Hello! I just got started in Correctional Nursing in Missouri and was wondering what facility you were at? Why did you leave? I was at Fulton State Hospital for years which of course is a Maximum Security Forensic Hospital but the patients are still inmates like in the prisons. The only difference is they copped a plea or are actually guilty by reason of insanity. But I loved that job. The politics got to be too much so I left. But now I am working the best job I have had in all my years as a nurse. I am in Department of Corrections but I am contracted through my company to provide Mental Health nursing to the female IM's. I love it! I am still learning how to do what I do and to help Medical nurses with what they have to do. My biggest thing right now is helping medical by discontinuing medications that the IM's are refusing to take. This helps bring down all the wasted medications and the extra people coming for med lines.

I am new to Correctional Nursing but I found your thread to be very interesting and somewhat scarey. Is this a new thing to dispense Methadone to IM's? Is this something that all States are trying to get in their correctional settings? I have worked with a Methadone clinic in my years in nursing and let me tell you, it's a great drug for detox, but dangerous as well. And you have to be so detailed in the dispensing of it etc. In my State of Missouri a physician can only have 30 patients who are taking methadone to detox or to stay off drugs. So how does one physician handle the hundreds of IM's that might be on methadone? I would like to know more information from those of you that are using Methadone in your setting and how you do what you do and if there is a chance that other States are looking at starting methadone on the IM's. Thanks.