Lonman

nessajune21 stated, "I understand that a surg. tech works under an RN". WHAT? You're joking right? Not sure where you get your information from, but the surgical tech does not "work under the RN". This statement can be found at the AST website; The surgical technologist works under medical supervision to facilitate the safe and effective conduct of invasive surgical procedures. This individual works under the supervision of a surgeon to ensure that the operating room environment is safe, that equipment functions appropriately, and that the operative procedure is conducted under conditions that maximize patient safety. I just wanted to clarify. Lonman

After reading the responses on here I can happily say that I must work in a pretty darn great OR. The respect is there. All the workers treat each other the way we all would like to be treated and noone tries to do someone elses job, disrespectfully. We all DO help each other. Do I circulate? No, not from start to finish and all the tasks involved. I do everything except the paperwork when I am not scrubbed in. That is the job description of the circulating RN. Thank you Shodobe for the history of the RN in surgery and their role in scrubbing. Times with economics did make way for the changes that we have come to see. The surgical technologist is formerly trained for their role in the OR? The field has helped meet the needs of hospitals thoughout the years and also the fact that they get professionals that know what there roles are. OJT is not needed for the ST. The bottom line is that each professional has their respective roles and the ST's already know them and have them defined. This comes from the acreditted training that is recommended for the field. The RN's have them defined by the rules set aside by the hospitals. In the operating arena, the RN is OJT regarding their roles. The ST already has this defined within their training. Another member here made a good simple point. People have to remember to treat each other like you would like to be treated. Not that hard. It is so true that adult professionals need not to act like children. Oh yeah, back to the question, are ST's and RN's equal?? As i see it, only in 1 way---we both want the best care and outcome for our patients. Happy Thanksgiving!! ~Lonman

This has started at another hospital in our city as well. I did read about this issue in the Surgical technologists magazine many months ago. My major concern is who takes liability if there is a problem with the refurbished item? I certainly don't think the original manufacturer would. Also, are these companies that refurbish non disposable items ok'd by any governing bodies such as JACHAO or FDA? What is AORN's stance? I sure wouldn't want to be in court over this issue. Lonman

You're welcome. ~Lonman

Welcome Yuca! A scrub nurse refers to the RN in the operating room who "scrubs in" for a procedure. "Scrubbing in" means that a staff member becomes part of the sterile field team during operative procedures. These team members can include surgical technologist, MD's, resident MD's, RN's, PA's, NPSA's, medical students, and other medical profession students. There are many roles for the "scrub nurse". For starters, they set up the sterile field and the instruments required for the procedure. They also help the "circulating nurse" get the operating room ready prior to the patient coming to the room for their surgery. During the surgery they pass instrument to the surgeon or the resident physician. They also can assist the surgeon during procedures as a first assistant or a "second scrub". "Second scrub" refers to a person who assists with the procedure by holding a retractor, camera, or an extremity. A second scrub would be considered the third team member that has an active role in the operative procedure. During your different rotations in your nursing program, chances are good you will go through a rotation in the operating room. Some programs actually are begining to have a more indepth operating room experience and training. The operating room is like no other nursing area. You will learn this. Upon graduation, if you choose to do so, you can join the operating room staff. The operating room is an option just as floor nursing, ICU, OB, etc is. Once you join the OR team you might be asked to learn to scrub for procedures. This, of course, will depend on the hospital itself. Some hospitals don't allow, want, or need the RN to be in the scrub role. This would be because there are surgical technologists that are specifically trained for this role and economically more efficient for some hospital budgets. Some hospitals do, however, want their RN's to be able to scrub and circulate. This also can help with efficiency in the operating room. It really is different everywhere. The primary role for the RN in the operating room suite is to circulate procedures. This is the most common practice, but as stated before, the RN can learn to scrub procedures. If you want to read more about the "scrubbing" role I would visit the Association of Surgical Technologist website. http://www.ast.org Any of your questions you might have regarding the "scrub" role can be answered there also. Good luck in your venture! There is no place like the OR! ~Lonman

There are many avenues to pursue as a surgical technologists. Some stay in their unit doing what they like. Some become first assistants for their unit. Some get hired to work as an assistant for a surgeon in their area. Some go on to PA school. Some go on to nursing school to get their RN degree. The list is endless. Some ST's find out they do not like the OR afterall. One of my former students enrolled in a EEG school and will actually make more starting out than she would have as an ST. It really is up to the individual as to, "what happens after gradualtion". My motto is when you become bored with your job and feel that it is no longer challenging , then it is time for a change. In the operating room there are many areas for a ST to excel at. This of course depends on the nature of the hospital. Some hospitals don't use as many surgical technologists as some do. Some hospitals don't use surgical technologists to their full capacity. Surgical technologists are an elite group of specialized professionals trained to work in the operating room setting. I would suggest going to http://www.ast.org for more info and join their discussion board as well. This is a great place to learn the goings on of the operating room, but at ast.org you might get more replies and answers to your questions. Best to you. ~Lonman

I too am a CST and unlike the ones on this forum, I really enjoy my job and it has allowed me to enter the fields of assisting and education. There are many roles and job opportunities for the CST. Not too mention the outlying roles that many CST's get into because of their experience, like working for companies that deal with products in the operating room. Are there hurdles for this profession to overcome? Yes, but changes in those areas are happening. That is another topic on its own. I would advise going to www.ast.org and asking some folks on their board about the field. The bottom line is do what you feel you need to do. If you want more in career regarding nursing, the RN is for you, but not everyone does. Good luck to you! Lonman

Here in Illinois, our surgical assistants can get registered now if they would like to. What title does your hospital designate for those assistive workers in the OR that help clean the rooms, bring equipment to your room, hold extremities when you prep, even might help tie folks up. Here in my area in Illinois 2 hospitals currently title them as surgical assistants and one hospital actually changed their title from housekeeper to surgical assistant years ago. Now with this act of registration and title protection act being brought forth, I have a problem calling these very helpful workers "surgical assistants". I also have brought this up with their manager to see what the hospital is planning on doing with this matter. Thank you for your responses. ~Lonman

Thanks for the input everyone. ~Lonman

With the many threads on here regarding scrubbing cases, I was curious as to see what the thoughts are on this board regarding hospitals training their own to be a surgical technologist. I am not talking about RN's or LPN's learning to scrub, I see nothing wrong with that at all. What I mean is those hospitals that train housekeepers, receptionists, central sterilization, or any other employees that happen to work in the area of surgery and when their training is done, the hospital calls them surgical technologists. They usually have some minor requirements and the "training" might be as short as 6 months or as long as a year. Upon completion and meeting their hospitals needs they are given the title ST, but they will not be able to get registered. What are your thoughts? In Illinois, currently in my area there is one hospital that is doing just that. training employees from certain areas to scrub. 6 months training. We already have 2 accreditted schools that help fill the demand for surgical technologists but they told me that they haven't had enough appilicants. 50 miles away they only will hire certified surgical technologists. Do any of you think this is an acceptable practice? Thank you for your comments. There are so many folks from all over the USA and the world, hearing practices from other areas I find very interesting. ~Lonman

Cervix, Yes, it is true that basically anyone can be trained to scrub. That fact is already being done to cut cost. In the field of surgical technology, hospitals have trained housekeepers, clerks, and central processing employees to do the job of the surgical technologist. It is a shame that hospitals would lower their standards and do OJT rather than hire the properly trained surgical technologist. With tight budgets and no regulation they do this. For this reason, many states, Illinois being one of them, has passed a registration and title protection act. Our goal eventually in Illinois is that hospitals use the surgical technologists that are properly credentialed. Certified registered and licensed. To put an answer to your question, yes, there is a certifying body for surgical technologists. But, as long as there are states that do not require the proper credentialing and uphold the high standards of a CST, then hospitals can do as they please with staffing their "scrub tech", which BTW, is not the proper term for that position. As a staff member, I would talk with my fellow staff and try to convince my supervisor that we should not settle for less and to hire the properly trained CST. Also, as you may be aware, many hospitals also cross-train the RN for this postiton. Is that an option in your area? You can get any other questions you may have regarding the CST at this website. www.ast.org Hope this helps, ~Lonman, CST

This will depend on what your state and hospital allows. To answer your question, yes they can. Now, does it happen everywhere or is it expected, no. CST's are trained to do this role as part of their accredited program. We do recognize the fact that the CST's primary role is not circulating. Many hospitals utilize RN's for this role and some do utilize the CST. I agree with Mailkrans about checking into what the state allows. Unless it is stated by state law, hospitals can do what they feel is necessary. Also what is interesting is the definition of "circulating". Out of all the comments from this topic, not once did anyone have a definition of circulating. Where I work, I am glad to say this is not an issue with our staff. We all work together to do what it takes to give out patients the best care. RN or CST. We are a team and we do what needs to be done. Our hospital utilizes an RN for the primary "circulator". This is the one person that will sign off on the many papers involved. I will say that I do not sign off and am not the sole person responsible for this action. I will, however, do any other "circulator" tasks if the need is there. When drawing up meds, spiking meds, or giving meds to the field, I do what is hospital policy and I verify the meds with the primary circulator and the person who is receiving them. ~Lonman

This will depend on what your state and hospital allows. To answer your question, yes they can. Now, does it happen everywhere or is it expected, no. CST's are trained to do this role as part of their accredited program. We do recognize the fact that the CST's primary role is not circulating. Many hospitals utilize RN's for this role and some do utilize the CST. I agree with Mailkrans about checking into what the state allows. Unless it is stated by state law, hospitals can do what they feel is necessary. Also what is interesting is the definition of "circulating". Out of all the comments from this topic, not once did anyone have a definition of circulating. Where I work, I am glad to say this is not an issue with our staff. We all work together to do what it takes to give out patients the best care. RN or CST. We are a team and we do what needs to be done. Our hospital utilizes an RN for the primary "circulator". This is the one person that will sign off on the many papers involved. I will say that I do not sign off and am not the sole person responsible for this action. I will, however, do any other "circulator" tasks if the need is there. When drawing up meds, spiking meds, or giving meds to the field, I do what is hospital policy and I verify the meds with the primary circulator and the person who is receiving them. ~Lonman

This will depend on what your state and hospital allows. To answer your question, yes they can. Now, does it happen everywhere or is it expected, no. CST's are trained to do this role as part of their accredited program. We do recognize the fact that the CST's primary role is not circulating. Many hospitals utilize RN's for this role and some do utilize the CST. I agree with Mailkrans about checking into what the state allows. Unless it is stated by state law, hospitals can do what they feel is necessary. Also what is interesting is the definition of "circulating". Out of all the comments from this topic, not once did anyone have a definition of circulating. Where I work, I am glad to say this is not an issue with our staff. We all work together to do what it takes to give out patients the best care. RN or CST. We are a team and we do what needs to be done. Our hospital utilizes an RN for the primary "circulator". This is the one person that will sign off on the many papers involved. I will say that I do not sign off and am not the sole person responsible for this action. I will, however, do any other "circulator" tasks if the need is there. When drawing up meds, spiking meds, or giving meds to the field, I do what is hospital policy and I verify the meds with the primary circulator and the person who is receiving them. ~Lonman

This will depend on what your state and hospital allows. To answer your question, yes they can. Now, does it happen everywhere or is it expected, no. CST's are trained to do this role as part of their accredited program. We do recognize the fact that the CST's primary role is not circulating. Many hospitals utilize RN's for this role and some do utilize the CST. I agree with Mailkrans about checking into what the state allows. Unless it is stated by state law, hospitals can do what they feel is necessary. Also what is interesting is the definition of "circulating". Out of all the comments from this topic, not once did anyone have a definition of circulating. Where I work, I am glad to say this is not an issue with our staff. We all work together to do what it takes to give out patients the best care. RN or CST. We are a team and we do what needs to be done. Our hospital utilizes an RN for the primary "circulator". This is the one person that will sign off on the many papers involved. I will say that I do not sign off and am not the sole person responsible for this action. I will, however, do any other "circulator" tasks if the need is there. When drawing up meds, spiking meds, or giving meds to the field, I do what is hospital policy and I verify the meds with the primary circulator and the person who is receiving them. ~Lonman