Loadbetty

You're my hero Haycyn....I was given the "choice" (resign or be fired) 3 days before the probationary period was up....and what did I miss in nursing school? I've been reading post after post and it's always the same...."not working out" "resign or be fired"....is that some secret class for nurse managers only?? I'm old and cranky, so I'm going to make them put an actual fact on paper. So far it's been pure fiction and zero to do with patient care....interesting that most hospitals I know of have a "step" program for corrective/coaching actions....I've never had a "step" - then again, I've never done anything that they could give me one for....I'm far from perfect - new grad - but I always ASK before I DO if I'm the least bit unsure....you would think mgt would desire that trait....apparently not.... I may get out of nursing all together - I've never worked with a group of people more nasty, more dishonest, and more UNcaring in my life...just breaks my heart that I sold my soul and nearly everything I own to get through school to come out to this.....it's just heartbreaking... Not sure what to do now....I love your quote about the "reason" you left the job after only 6 mos...I'm definitely going to steal it when going on interviews.... And by the way..."training" - seems they like to tell you how long training is in terms of weeks....and get ****** when you do the math....makes it sound better I guess.... 6 weeks = 2 wks 3 days = 17 DAYS of training...it's not like you're going to work 7 days a week - you're working a 3 days a wk schedule like everybody else....17 days of training for a specialty unit for a no prior health care experienced new grad isn't a long time....it's a joke - not to mention dangerous...I happen to have no shame - I could care less if someone thinks I'm an idiot or worse calls me an idiot for asking questions....but I fear that a younger less cranky grad might be intimiated and not ask questions and just DO because they don't want to be berated.....DANGEROUS.... Oh well....thanks for the quote and the laugh - wish you could have been my preceptor!!

Dexter....it sounds like we work at the same place - I don't think we really do, but what happened to you - down to the words used "not working out" is the same thing that just happened to me. I never reported anyone for leaving me with tons of late meds, drsg chgs, etc. - I just did it - it was the asst mgr that for whatever reason hated me from day 1 - made reference to my age in the first 2 sentences she spoke to me...so I just "sucked it up" and went about my new nsg career....then she continued to write pure fiction in the new hire "progress reports." Nothing to do whatsoever with patient care - just that I had asked questions about how to do something when I'd "been told once before." You would think that a mgr, preceptor, asst mgr, whatever would WANT a new grad/nurse to ask before they do - but apparently I was wrong. And I'm not talking simple things - I would ask more than once when the occasion presented itself about things like a Heparin or Insulin drip...things I'd never done before - was shown, then when it would come up for the second time, I'd maybe ask another nurse if I was doing this or that right just to be SURE...anyway - I didn't respond too much to these lies, and they kept getting worse...more outlandish...like when a nurse pointed out something to me, I'd shrug my shoulders and say "so what." I can assure you, those words have NEVER come out of my mouth....again - the long and short of it is the last one accused me of asking questions and/or doing things when I WASN'T EVEN THERE....so when the mgr gave me the last one - I finally spoke up and said - "no, these things just aren't true." So I was told to "answer" the charges in writing. So I did. No embelishment or opinion, just facts...i.e. "not sure what this means because I wasn't working this night." Provable things - like I wasn't there, or a person I supposedly asked something of wasn't there that night....2 wks later I was called in in the middle of the night and told "it wasn't working out." Ironically 3 days before the probationary period is up. I chose to make them fire me because nobody can tell me why it's "not working out." Oddly enough, they still haven't arranged the HR official "axing" yet...makes me wonder if they're busy trying to dream something valid up....who knows....what I do know is I'm really appalled, disappointed, and shocked - I always heard that nurses eat their young, but I guess I thought that was a nursing school myth....boy was I wrong...I never ever worked with a group of people that are so malicious, nasty, and dishonest to each other - makes me wonder if I wasted my money in school - I wanted to be a nurse - someone that CARES...and not just about the patients because you'd paid to....care about the fellow human - including other nurses...what a crock! I'm applying for a zillion jobs, but I have to say, after this experience, I'm wondering if I should continue to look in nursing....I know nurses that are happy - it just CAN'T be like this everywhere can it???

God we must work at the same place! I have had the same experiences....all I can do is sink deeper into depression and cry....not at work - but at home - I'm totally lost and don't know where to turn!

Sorry to hear that - I don't have any experiences (yet) with the Chair - who is a new one I think - I know they didn't have a Chair for the NSG dept for the last year or so - not sure....just the people that "decide" if you're on the list in the first place are the ones that I am speaking of....I also have years of "life" experience in another industry, plus as I said, I completed the SUT program (but never found a job) - I took classes that weren't required for the SUT program that were required for the NSG program to be "ready" when "my turn" came - as I also said, because I didn't start standing on their desks everyday until this last year - they had a million and one excuses of why they didn't know me despite showing them letters THEY had sent, etc.....when I did get serious about not waiting anymore and had a folder full of statements from THEM, I guess they decided that I wasn't going to go away, can and did take it to another level, then like magic I was/am in...I'm not professing to be a genius, but really - how hard is it to set up a list based on GPA and prereq completion??? Just about every school on the planet does it that way....guess they'd prefer to suck as much money as they can from you taking non-required classes until you get frustrated enough to leave.....it's sad - it really is, especially because the reputation of SCC's NSG program really is good in the industry.....it's just that one person lives to have the "power" that's all - if you check out Mont. Co court system, you can find a couple of cases against them for just that - lying, extorting unnecessary monies, etc....hopefully now that I'm FINALLY in, all that will go away....it hard enough to keep up with the classes themselves without ALSO having to keep endless files on things they promised/required, etc too! As far as WSU - I gave them the $30 registration fee TWICE and still cannot get ANYONE to answer an e-mail, return a phone call - nada...3 years later.....still nothing - not even an offer of return of money since they did NOTHING for me - not even an e-mail! Unless you're an international medical student who will live on campus, (highest tuition they can charge) they could care less. Even had one of the MANY people supposedly in the NSG dept tell me that she would be SURE that someone called me as long as I gave them ANOTHER $30 - only THEN would she allow my name to be on a waiting list to speak to a nursing school counselor! She didn't have an answer as to what the previous $60 went for..... All schools are getting slimier and slimier because of the economy - higher education isn't any different than the banks and oil companies - you are nothing other than "free" money to them. SCC's "waitlists" and WSU's charging to just talk to a counselor, etc is why there are RETS, OIP&T and Miami Jacobs getting $20,000 and up for no degree and a license/certification that isn't required for the job (surgical tech) and even more for LPN's and RN's - Miami Jacobs put a years worth of LPN students through their overpriced program without certification! Have a niece that was caught up in that - paid $25K + and went to the boards to find out her education/certification to take the boards was no good....of course that is still in the courts and probably will be for a LONG time....in the meantime, the students that got loans are being forced to repay them of course because Miami Jacobs is declaring them as "graduated." They refuse to repay the duped students loans, the last offer was they could retake the entire program after they got their non-certification straightened out! Hard to believe any business is allowed to stay in business with that blatant of a Ponsy scheme against them! It's stuff like that that allows the less than honest behaviors from the state schools...so you really can't win - just try and make the best deal you can with the least amount of BS. It's a racket - but if you really want it, you may try SCC again, as I said, this Chair of the NSG dept is new I'm fairly certain - and while I can't remember her name, her initial's aren't GG I don't think.... Good luck in your search/pursuits!

Wellllllllllll, that's a subjective thing - when I started in 2004, I dual majored - surgical tech and nursing - supposedly the nursing clock started ticking then - but it didn't and doesn't. I finished the surg tech and took NSG prereq's filling in the "holes" while in the surg tech program - bascially I was done with EVERYTHING except the actual NSG classes....I graduated 2007, (surg tech) took the PAX test in 2005 (that counts for nothing and is required by no one) and the nursing program never heard of me.....it's typical and I know there are A LOT worse stories out there - I finally sent an e-mail to the administator, the dean of ALH AND the pres of the college asking "since I've been waiting since 2005, it's now 2009, is it ever going to be my turn?" They gave me some BS answer that my name was dropped in 2007 because I hadn't started the program - well you can't start the program without THEM sending you the letter with a start date...I recvd an e-mail asking if I wanted to start Fall 09 (this was spring 09) although I had finished the BIO series, they said I had to take BIO211 AND nurses aide training before I could start - I did - then the back peddling started again....as you read, I'm not 18 yrs old, so time is my biggest obstacle - so I again went to the dean, administrator and couselor....I "magically" got a letter with my "official" start date of Fall 09 - I start tomorrow! So for me, it was 5 yrs....but I didn't stand on their desk everyday until 2008/2009....you HAVE to be proactive - i.e. literally stand on their desk EVERYDAY - you cannot count on them to "send you a letter" when it's "your turn" - it absolutely won't happen. My advice is MAKE SURE you get EVERYTHING the administrator tells you IN WRITING - believe me, if you don't, they will say it they didn't say it - even when you show the written statements, they will try to get out of that - the answers to your questions are ALWAYS "maybe" or "you have to take this or that first" or "I didn't say that" GET IT IN WRITING....send e-mails and print out the responses. If you're an LPN, you have to take BIO211 and MAT109 BEFORE you start the program - you DO NOT have to take ANYTHING that's not on the program requirements no matter how many classes they tell you to take - the biggie for being a transfer is to get your englishes, maths, and bio's to transfer - go see Patricia Willis - she's a GREAT counselor, and I believe they made her the RN program's counselor - she's great and won't BS you - she's also the only one that can "wave the magic wand" and transfer your classes - the key is to get the requirements out of the way and literally stand on the desk of the RN programs administrators desk EVERYDAY - if you don't do that unfortunately, you don't exist - she can be abrasive, but if you e-mail her and ask her specific questions and get specific answers, you then have it in writing to show what they have told you, therefore taking the "you're going to wait another year" answer away from them. The thing to remember, particularly in Dayton is EVERY college/tech school, etc have MORE then enough students - they don't need you and show it. I went through all that with Wright State - so unfortunately they will and do say anything to get you to just go away - while telling you to take class after class (costing $$$) that aren't required for the program - you have to be persistent, have your ducks in a row and grades high - and by standing on their desks everyday to make them realize that you're not going away and won't be satisfied with BS answers, delay tactics and/or excuses, they'll get the hint..... So in answer to your direct question, "how long" - with Sinclair it's totally subjective - there is no "method." Seriously, they do not go by GPA, they do not go by time waiting, they do not go by alphabetical order, and they absolutely do not go by scores on the PAX test - that is total crap - no national, state or local agency requires the PAX test or uses it - Sinclair uses it for nothing - I would have rather just handed them $60 - there are 3 parts, when (and I'm not implying your are a sub-par student) you flunk one or two parts of it, you have to go to the counselor and find out what your "remediation" classes will be - turns out, that whatever part(s) of it you flunked, let's say science - the "remediation" course you'll have to take is whatever is next in line that you have to take anyway - let's say you are in BIO 142 and you flunked the science part - your "remediation" course will be BIO 143 - so as I said, the PAX test is just another BS part that delays - they only give the test 2 or 3 times a year - more waiting......so I would encourage you to take the PAX test FIRST THING - at least your waiting time will be less wasted because you will be taking classes that you have to take anyway to get in the subjective line....I'm truly not being negative, this is reality - at Wright State, the waiting list is based totally on GPA - so if you have good grades, you may want to consider WSU - at least you know where you stand there - the wait might not be as long, and you don't have to stand on anyone's desk everyday and spend time proving what they told you the day before......I'm not sure where you stand class/grade wise - but those are the facts from personal experience.....I'm in now finally - now I just hope I can keep up! Good luck!

Don't laugh, but I'm just starting RN school this fall......I graduated in 2007 as a certified surgical tech...had more "bling" for academic achievement on at graduation than Mr. T...it felt like I had a yoke on!.....didn't matter - the 2 or 3 jobs that were available went to the students that didn't show up for clinicals, had to take tests 2/3 times - any other program would have kicked them out - yet they were hand picked for the jobs......this, like most ANY other business is subjective.....I worked full time, went to school full time, and never missed an 8 hr a day clincial for 2.5 yrs......had a 4.0 - none of it mattered...I think the only person that felt bad at the end of the day was me...the only job (revolving door job) available wanted to pay $11.00/hr for scrubbing!!....sorry - but that wouldn't pay for half the libility insurance -- and they thought we (the applicants) should have been fighting each other on the floor to get to their "golden" job.....ahhhh NOT...... So I took a job in a totally different industry - there ain't nobody to pay da bills but me...(my ungrateful bag o fur cat refuses to cut back in ANY way...) Took just about a yr out of the RN rat race and decided to go ahead and go for it......I do REALLY want to do this for a living - REALLY.....even at my age..... The point to my story is if you REALLY want to do this (and it really sounds like you do) - unfortunately you have to be willing to move....it sucks and shouldn't be that way - but it's just the way it is.......here's a thought..... A classmate (and fellow scrub) is VERY young, VERY smart with 2 kids and a responsible longtime live-in boyfriend - they really scrapped for her to get through school.....ANYWAY - she called me one night and said there was nothing here, and probably never going to be anything here (for scrubbing anyway) - and she was reading the very expensive and equally as useless CST (Cert. Surg Tech) "magazine" they give you when you pay for the EXTREMELY overpriced licensure.....the only thing worth a hoot in it is the pages of job opportunities in the back.....so she's reading me names of hospitals, etc.....then the Mayo Clinic (Minnesota) came up - I said, that's it!! She thought I was joking until I made her fill out the application and sent them.....the LONG story short is here she is brand new fresh out of school - OK grades - not 4.0, but 3.2 or something...she is 24 yrs old and the Mayo not only got back to her in 2 days, they flew her up there, interviewed her, and offered her a job before she got back on the airplane that night.....she moved lock stock, kids, dogs, boyfriends and barrels another 2 mos after.....the kicker is Mayo PAID for the move.....they don't buy or sell houses, but they paid for movers, packers, gas, etc..... Amazing.....and VERY true....the Mayo is constantly hiring - they pay well and pay to move you.....if you're willing to move, there are A LOT worse things to have on your resume than the Mayo Clinic!! They really like it up there - of course Rochester, MN is just about ALL Mayo Clinic, but hey - who cares?? Just a thought and thanks for letting me rant about my past health care career that never was, and my future career that BETTER BE!! :angryfire Good luck!!

Thanks SO MUCH! Being in the program, you know how important it is for graduates/current students to "steer" you toward the good prof's/classes, etc. I think I'll be OK with Becker - I only have a hard time with unnecesssary "attitude" when it is accompanied with no teaching!! If he teaches, I can almost always overlook or laugh at the nastiness......almost! Patient care cards.....can't wait!!! .........NOT!!! Got any for sale???? LOL How do you like Atrium? Hope they don't have the big bad "Valley" attitude yet...I loved Good Sam until they took over - felt really sorry for all the long time GSH employees that now had to endure the MVH "attitude." Hopefully I can stay within the KMC network - but as you know, it sometimes doesn't work that way - I'll take whatever they give me that works with my work schedule... Got any advise on NSG prof's?? I only know one, Marsha Wamsley - her and I worked at Emery for a thousand years....she's great to work with - never had her as a prof though...any/all advise you can give (especially saving money on books, supplies, etc) is GREATLY appreicated!! Thanks again for your reply - looking forward to the next!

Thanks!! The care plans sound like case cards - basically we had to write up this horrendous 4 page "report" of EVERY surgery we did - I mean everything, like down to what kind and how much suture! Wow - not looking forward to stuff like that again, but thanks for the warning.... When you say: ..."the next couple days you will go to clinical and take care of your patient...." That I'm sure is on the non-class days (clinicals) - how long are you in the hospital for on those days? Couldn't agree with you more about the "good feeling" you get from the Kettering Network - so did I, but only got to spend one quarter there - they wouldn't let us go to surgery centers - which I think is dumb - the excuse is "they go too fast" - well yeah, but surgery centers are ALL small surgeries - a newbie can learn a lot more from a smaller surgery at first even if it does go fast! The big surgeries go just as fast and are more confusing to the new (and "old") student - geez - my very first, right out of the box, the first time I stood in surgery was a VERY complicated open heart....it was really cool, but all I ended up doing was standing in a corner were I couldn't see detail (like instruments, set up, etc) and didn't touch anything.....you don't learn like that, and an open heart, much less a complicated open heart where there's a zillion people in the room isn't a place for a student - not one that's in school anyway.... Which leads me to the preceptor question - unfortunately at every hospital you're going to run into the person that is "forced" to teach and doesn't want to, so spends the entire time taking their frustrations out on the student(s)....I don't mind someone being in a less than amiable mood, what I don't like and no student should have to put up with is preceptors that won't teach you and/or won't let you do anything, etc.....had a few like that - finally said something in my last year - you know, I busted my rear end to get here (winter) and I can stand in a corner at home - no reason to go to all that trouble just to do nothing and literally stand in a corner...the answer was (and always is) - "oh, so and so is just that way, she/he doesn't like students...." WELL DON'T GIVE THEM STUDENTS THEN!! Geez!! Did you run in to that much?? It feels like such a waste of time when you're not being taught how to do anything - I'd rather be home doing case cards or studying!! Where in your opinion did you get the best education/clinical experiences?? Sounds like we like the same thing - i.e. Kettering Network....that's where I hope to end up after graduation - I hope anyway! Appreicate the salary info - makes me feel better - I still feel like such a total idiot loser for "drinking the Kool-Aid" of the SUT dept that I still don't trust everything SCC tells me....that experience sure has me on my guard - so that's good that I'm hearing it from the voice of experience.... I hear you about losing motivation for school - I'm excited, but also dreading a little - the non-clinical stuff (like care plans).....a really wise person once told me that if I wanted to continue my education that I HAD to immediately go from one to the other or I'd never get to the other.....I believe that - fortunately I went from the SUT program to no job - to a non-healthcare related job - to starting school again (SCC and U.D.) - so at least I didn't have more than a quarter break - trouble is I was only taking 2-3 classes - certainly not a nursing program....so I'm gearing up for the circus to start all over again!! Thanks SO MUCH again :redbeathe.....insight on the best clinical experience would be great if/when you get the chance.... Try and have a great day....the roads are horrible....

I'm with you on the motivation - I did it too - looking back at the SUT program - don't know how I worked 10-12 hrs a night and immediately went and stood for 8 hrs in surgery for 2.5 yrs....but as you say, motivation is the key....too bad I poured all that effort and work into a program that was never going to pan out....that's really my only regret, is that I fooled myself into thinking that I was too cynical when the writing was in my face - I should have dropped in the beginning of the 2nd yr and went to the NSG program - I had both programs prereq's done before I started the SUT - I WAS a dual major - so now I'm a dual major with a year inbetween! Should have trusted my intincts - woulda shoulda coulda! Oh well....I haven't got that many more bad decisions to make - 50 is going to be here for me next year....that's why I'm picking as many brains as I can - like yours! Oh I'm all about sarcasim - have that tendency myself - -just getting crankier as I get older I guess - I have WAY less tolerance for BS with each passing year...I don't need to be spoon fed, but sometimes it takes me a while to figure out the prof's "style" so to speak....the way I see it, of the 4 classes I have to take before Fall, the MAT109 and the Nurses Aide ALH120 are the only ones that are kinda unecessary - I don't plan on being a STNA (nothing wrong with it, just not my "path") and because it's worth 6 credits, it's kinda obvious to me what's going on there - but NSG isn't the only program that requires unecessary classes - and don't get me wrong, I think you should have to have more than one math class for nursing - just don't think SCC's "nursing" math has hit the mark....I had a GREAT prof a couple of quarters ago in MAT102 and he is the third prof in a year to tell me that they were trying to talk him into teaching the NSG MAT....apparently the 2 they have are less than "amiable" to math as a "science" for nurses.....that's the prof's I hate - the holier than thou - hey I have a Masters or a PhD in MAAATTHHHH....big deal - if you can't break it down far enough for your students to do well then what good is it??? I've already bought the million dollar Physiology book - geez - didn't think I'd forget as much as I have about A&P....so I'm glad to have that class actually and the Pharm - those are a couple of subjects that if you don't have down you can get yourself into REAL trouble.... Since you're doing the BEACON, and are in the B of the BSN - what do you think about the RN-BSN online stuff? I'm scared of that I think - how much more is it that A LOT of programs don't deem it necessary to be in an actual classroom? I know they're trying to accommodate a zillion schedules, but I would think if it's considered higher skilled nursing that you'd have to be in a class or higher zoot clinical setting....what's the deal with that? What kind of pay rates are you finding in the Dayton-Cincy area? I'm not asking what you're making - I don't do that - just wondering what the typical range is - I have no idea, and now that I've been burned by the SUT program, I don't know that I'm going to have much faith in what the NSG program tells me..... Funny you mentioned UC - that's my dream that I fear is going to be unrealized - that's what I went into all this for - to eventually get to UC and do the CRNA program - I LOVE anesthesia - always did.....I've done A LOT of research on it, particularly the program at UC - I think I could do it, it's a function of time....by the time I'd have the degrees and experience to apply realistically I'd be closer to 60 than not....but that's not really the deterent - it's the after it's all over to I want to just be BEGINNING my career at over 60-something?? Who knows - I have to get by this one first! Thanks again for the advise - ANYTHING you feel you want to impart - PLEASE PLEASE do!

Wow! You are a motivated individual!!! And A LOT smarter than me - statistics ON-LINE?!?!?!? Thanks for the insight - as I said - I'm the "nerd" that likes the classroom - I've taken quite a few on-line, mostly because I couldn't make full time work and full time school work all the time - and I still say on-line classes are typically harder - I think because you miss a lot from not having the face to face lecture.....well you two have convinced me - I will take it in class - unfortunately I'll HAVE to take it in the summer, which by the sound of it I better make that my only class - I don't mind studying and working hard - just don't like the prof's that insult and denigrate just for the sake of doing so....I've found that the weakest prof's tend to do that....as long as we can ask questions I won't have a problem.... Hopefully this "endevour" will turn out to be more fruitful than my last "plan".....always was going to get the RN, but in the meantime since I was laid off, I thought I'd get the surg tech because I really like it - good idea, bad program (not educationally, stupid childish shenanigans by the dept)....HOWEVER - they can't take away the experience and the little knowledge I have left from it!! It's HELL getting old!!!!! :chuckle Thanks again - are you working locally or in Cincy?

Thanks again - I'm sure you know that this type of info is VERY helpful! I really appreciate the time you are taking to advise me.... I'm a "non-traditional" i.e. "older" student, so I'm the "nerd" that always shows up to class ontime and as prepared as I can be - trouble is working nights, it's great for early classes, but if you have a rough night at work and can't review before you go to class - sometimes the "preparedness" lacks a little - I'm not worried about the work, studying or going to class - but advise on professors, classes/alternatives is invaluable... Taking Pharm online isn't my first choice - aside from a very few (ALH 102/103) I think you miss A LOT if you're not in class....I had to take medical terminology on-line (schedule wouldn't work) - wow - that was a challenge to say the least - I got an A, but worked harder on that than I did any of my other classes....on-line classes certainly aren't for the half-there student - as you said, if you don't have the discipline and dedication you'll flunk quicker than had you taken the class and didn't go.....I agree with you totally - because they are only offering BIO 211 at one time 10-11:40 and the lab isn't until 1:00 - yick! I don't have many options next quarter - the only choice there is is if you take it M-W or T-Th - the times are the same....I really like A&P, but it's been a couple of years - I already bought the books and am trying to brush up - wow - I've forgotten A LOT - so this class is going to be challenging as all the BIO's are/were....but I REALLY like the BIO dept as a whole - the prof's are great - Heckendorn and Currier were not easy by any stretch, but they were REALLY good and VERY helpful - glad to read what you said about Becker.....I did hear one student say he wasn't all that bad, but the majority say the class is a nightmare - scaring me actually because I'm going to have to take it in the summer - summer classes with the shortened schedule are always extra challenging....the nurses aide classes now don't sound as daunting as they look - hopefully I can work a schedule that will work for me - some of the classes are once a week, but they're 8 hrs - that's too long after working all night - this quarter they offered a 5-9 PM class twice a week - that may work out better for me if the clinicals are at the same time - but I feel a lot better about it now that you described it for me....thanks! And no, I've never worked in health care - only the 2.5 yrs I did in clincials with the surg tech thing.... A couple of questions about the job market and the clinicals for NSG if you don't mind...do you get ANY choice of hospitals when you're in clinicals? What are the hours like? Are you at your hospital 8 hrs a day 3 days a week? That's the way they work it in the SUT program...just wondering if the clinicals were flexible at all - I did clinicals a little differently with the SUT program in that I did clincials at almost all the area hospitals to get a feel of the work environment - surprizingly they were VERY different from each other....a lot of the other students stuck with one place....as far as nursing is concerned, is it wise to get a taste so to speak of all the hospitals or is it best to stick with one place? Last question (for this posting!) - is/was the pay as you expected? The SUT program quoted an average pay rate MUCH higher than was it actually was....they were quoting around $20-23 per hr when in actuality the highest paying hospital in the city for surg techs was $17 - the lowest believe it or not (Children's) is $11.00 an hr! Then you also pay $300 PER MONTH in health care benefits which brings down your hourly rate to about $9-10 an hour - you really can't support youself on that espeically these days! I was considering that because I was a new graduate, but after really thinking about all the job (surg tech) entails, the responsibility plus the liability - one would be crazy not to get some type of malpractice insurance just to protect yourself - well adding all that in ends up being a couple of dollars above minimum wage....even if there were jobs around for surg techs (which there aren't) - it's just not financially smart to take it with all that considered if you have to support yourself. Talking with a few friends/fellow students in the nursing field, the AVERAGE around Dayton seems to be $21-25 per hr for ADN's...is that correct? I hope once I get through the program to go on for a BSN just to widen the range of opportunity...I'm not really interested in management - I've been in management most of my life, and I'm not a kid, so a "title" doesn't interest me at all - just thought having the BSN provides more flexibility as far as selection of jobs - but I could be way wrong about that - what are your thoughts/experiences? Hope I'm not being too personal - just don't want to kill myself again working full time and keeping up with a very agressive full time program to end up with either no job, or one that I can't take without having a second job to live....I'm not expecting to be a millionaire nor get something for nothing - and it's not ALL about the money, but you have to support yourself - at least I do, so my asking about money is strictly for weighing the options thats all.... Enough for now - once again, THANK YOU!! I REALLY appreicate your advise and time.

Thank you SO MUCH!! I was beginning to think there weren't any SCC on this site!! I am VERY relieved to hear their aren't any shenanigans in the program! As I said, I feel I received a GREAT education in the SUT program, trouble is there weren't (and never were) jobs for everyone and they left the "old" and top of the class students out in the cold....I loved surgery - there just isn't any jobs out there - the major hospitals know there's an endless flow of "free" help (students) and aren't short of surg techs - so whomever SCC decides to put in the open slots that aren't advertised got the jobs - only 4 of them.....I'm hoping the nursing front is better.... Couple of questions....since I graduated from the SUT program, I only need BIO211, ALH219 and the MAT109 (that I can't take until Fall when taking NSG121 and 122......is the ALH219 do-able online? I've heard nightmare stories of Becker (the only prof that teaches it) - just wondered if it's too much to take on-line....I'll be doing that in the summer..... Also - the ALH120 - the nurses aide training - the couselor told me that if you don't take it at SCC you have to get the actual license STNA - there used to be "speed schools" around here - like being able to get it in a weekend, then go to Columbus and take the test - I work full time at night and it would be very hard to stay awake in a class for 8 hours....it's different when I'm in clinicals - I did it (working full time and clinicals) in the SUT program - but like I said, it's different (at least for me) to sit in a class for 8 hrs vs. actually doing something like clincials....is there a "better way" for this NSG 120? The couselor also said that the class doesn't result in an actual STNA license - which is fine because I don't plan on working as an STNA - don't need another license in my pocket that I'm not going to use...Would LOVE some insight on that ALH120 deal!! Thanks! And congrats - I know the program isn't easy!! I have alot more questions if you have time. Thanks again!

I say stop school hopping and stick with where you are the most ahead - sounds like the CC - I'm starting a ADN in the Fall FINALLY and graduated from the same school with the AAS and surg tech certification/licensure - I was a 4.0 all the way through - guess what - didn't get me a job or count for anything else for that matter (except self satisfaction).....a classmate who was A LOT more relaxed about everything and got a job used to joke everytime she got a C on something (she was VERY happy with a C)......"C's get degrees" know what? SHE'S RIGHT!! When I learned to fly a million years ago - I used to panic over not getting 100% on something - particularly my licensing.....a VERY wise guy told me - "hey take out your license and look at it....look at it HARD......where is it printed on there what your score was on your written?" RIGHT AGAIN..... Not to encourage slacking off in anyway - but the goal is to get through the program - unless there's something that you can't qualify for due to not having a 4.0 - as scorpion said..."suck it up and go!" Just stick with it - whatever program is going to get you there the fastest and just try and do your best....remember.... C's get degrees! Good luck!

Totally agree with everyone's comments - I am FINALLY starting the ADN program in the Fall - however - it took 2.5 yrs to get through the surgical tech program (with associates degree - not from a trade/tech school) and I worked full time through most of it with no help from anyone.....4 mos on unemployment with nothing but school was HEAVEN!! (but I had saved money to pay my mortgage for that period and the unemploy. checks were for "the rest" of the bills) The good news is I'm totally done with all the prereq's and gen ed courses, so that will cut down on school time A LOT! Anyway - I, like most on here, worked at night - I think that's the key because I haven't seen many "night" nursing programs/courses....it's tough - no doubt about it - when I first was laid off after 25 yrs I got severence, paid for unused sick/vacation days, etc - at the end of the day, my FAFSA/tax returns for that year made me look like a millionaire because they lumped it into all one check (shouldn't be that way, don't get me started - it KILLS you in taxes) - FAFSA/govt/Pell grant gave me triple of what I needed to go to school - it all helped of course because I was on unemployment.....my point is, the next year I was literally $200 below poverty level - and Pell/govt, etc said I was working now (making a whooping $9.00 an hr) so I don't get anything - you go figure - make a "million" dollars a year and you get WAY more than what you need - be at or below poverty level and have a minimum wage job and you get nothing.... As far as the money game goes - I think you have to go into your program with the expection of getting no help, and if you do - it's just a bonus.....but it's a time consuming process, and if you want/need "free" money, you have to be persistent....I only got 3 quarters of Pell - the rest of my education either I paid for or got scholarships - I worked hard kept my grades high and was lucky enough to get A LOT of scholarships - quarter by quarter - I didn't get any that paid a "full ride" - BUT - if you stay on top of it, show up at Fin Aid asking for any unpublished scholarships that may be available WEEKLY, write the 3 or 4 paragraphs in a statement letter of why you're deserving - you'll get them.....at the end of the day, I spent less than $1000 out of my pocket - including books..... As far as working and going to school.......it ain't easy.......but it can be done and lots of people do it.....I totally agree with everyone on here - it's all about the scheduling.....working the night shift is the best - unless you have classes that are available to you that meet at night....but that won't cover the clinicals - that's what was the hardest for me.....working 10 hr shifts at night and standing in surgery for another 8 hrs.....3 days a week for 2 yrs.....class was on the other 2 days....basically I had Sunday "off" - but that's eaten up pretty quickly with life stuff..... The trick is to get OC (obssessive complusive) about your schedule, your homework, and your clinicals....don't deviate period....it takes a while to get your family and friends "trained" - but it can be done....you have to resolve yourself to the fact that you are going to have ZERO life outside of school and work until it's over...you have to want it - it's not for the faint hearted or for the half attempt.... I'm lucky enough to have a good paying 3rd shift job now - they aren't going to pay for NSG though - so my "schedule" will have to include the "free money" game again.....Can't wait to start this circus all over again with the NSG program......ahhhhh NOT! But as I always tell my young friends and family - no body is going to do it for you - if you want to be there you'll do whatever it takes to get there.... Good luck!!!

OK - this is going no where - good luck to you - last word of advice.......SPELL CHECK!

Blue - what a prophet you are! I was waiting for my favorite Einstein quote...the definition of insanity is repeating the same behavior over and over expecting different results...unfortunately combating organized religion and its extreme departure from reality is the battle I still have a hard time resisting... Thank you for your post.....ahhh to be young again!

Glad you seemed to have found a program that meets your needs - but here's another word of advice - JUST ADVICE from an experienced "old broad." You might want to consider toning down the defensive attitude - you ripped into BabyLady when she was giving you ADVICE - I re-read her comments more than once and I feel it was a thoughtful response to you and your situation - she has children and was merely sharing her experiences when her children were young and she was in school - she didn't critcize you or your choices, yet you felt a need to berate and dismiss her........you ripped into me when I was trying to share the "dirty little secrets" of trade/tech schools (even the ones that have "college" in their name)...this was my 2 cents of paying it forward from being hoodwinked by "professionals" and trying to save someone else from their poisonous talons....No one in these posts that I can see was even remotely attacking you personally - only sharing their experiences to try and help you with the dilemma you were/are in. Again, from experience, I will tell you that you're going to experience A LOT of people that intentionally treat you poorly for no other reason than you are a student, and they were treated badly when they were in training, so you get to "get" it too...it's not fair, but believe me, it's going to be there whether you like it or not....if you want to get through the program, you just have to take it or find another profession....if you raise the hair on your back and "defend" yourself when no one is attacking you at every correction, constructive criticizism or intentionally trying to get under your skin in the course of your training, you're going to have a horrible, miserable 14 months.....and that's just your preceptors and docs....the patients are another story again.....doesn't make it right - it's just what is. Try and grow a thicker skin, take people's words for face value rather than reading something into it that isn't there..... Please believe me when I tell you I'm not criticizing - I've seen way too many a young girl under a lot of pressure such as yourself self destruct because they took EVERYTHING personally - as you "young" kids say nowadays - it's not all about you....when people truly ARE directing nastiness at you - remember my words - it's not about you - it's about them being unhappy with themselves....again, doesn't make it right - it just is. Last thing, I promise - putting in a God Bless or using God's name to end a sharp or nasty comment doesn't make it any less sharp or nasty and certainly doesn't absolve you from hurting someone else's feelings....in todays world, using God or His name in the course of your work or dealings with others is a risky thing to do - it can be off putting to someone that may not be of your faith or belief - you never know who you may be dealing with. As it should be in all business, but particularly in health care you have to learn to be as neutral and professional as possible - the first, second and last thing taught in business and the military is NEVER EVER get in conversations about religion or politics....you NEVER know who you're talking to....you can cross your arms and hold your breath if you want to and scream at the top of your lungs that no one is going to diminish your faith and beliefs and that's OK, just remember that you also don't have the right to impose it on others... Just friendly, sincere words of advice - nothing more. BTW, in response to the "electrical" question - I'm just one of many supervisors in dispatch and transmission - deal with high and low line guys daily....interesting industry - only been there for a couple of years - came from 20+ yrs in aviation...now I'm going to be a nurse......one of these days I'll figure out what I want to be when I grow up! One thing I figured out FOR SURE - when you take yourself too seriously you never have any fun!! Good luck - SINCERELY - good luck - I know you're under a lot of pressure - it's easier said than done, but take a step back and take a deep breath...it will all come together eventually - I promise.

Hi! Would like to get feedback from Sinclair RN graduates or current NSG program students- finally starting the program in the Fall - graduated from another Allied Health program last year - what a rip-off - education was good, but did not (and never was) result in a job mostly because of the prof's....they "chose" their 3 or 4 and placed them in places where they knew there were open slots....the rest of us - well "too bad, thanks for all your money and hard work." Is the NSG program like this? PLEASE tell me it's not! I have wanted to do this for a long time - don't want to graduate at the top of the class (LOTS of sacrafice, hard work and doing what I was told) AGAIN and end up with no job prospects!! HELP!!

Just starting myself (at a late age) I am scared too HOWEVER - I found in my "past life" (aviation-26 yrs) that it's a good thing to keep a HEALTHY fear of what you're doing - never to the point of not being able to function in a competent manner - just enough to not allow yourself to become complacent - and ALWAYS allow yourself to make mistakes - just make yourself learn from them and NEVER EVER been afraid to ask for help - hopefully my requests for help and knowledge will fall on the ears of a person that views it as an opportunity to pay it forward rather than a cynical little creep that views students as somehow a threat......ran into a few of those!! Good luck!

I used a lot of different things - what seemed to work best was not trying to cram the whole course into a review session - look at chapters/notes one system at a time over a long period....most of the time that would prompt me to remember something else I was foggy on and led me to study/review that....and on and on and on... I also received a few "Cliff Notes" books as gifts...the one that kept me laughing and that stuck with me the most is "The Complete Idiot's Guide to A&P" - not to be confused with the "Dummies" series....I have that one too - the Idiot's Guide is funny and gave a lot of mneumonics/jokes to help you remember and understand.... Good luck! I have a Physiology class I have to take next semester to FINALLY begin the NSG program - it's been 2 yrs since A&P!!! I'm breaking out all my A&P books and notes to try to be at the top of my game when in the class too!! Amazing how much I forget!! Good luck!

"thanks for the concern... but please try & be more kind. this is a career choice i have been looking into for nearly 7 years. i have done research and spent alot of time looking into the programs and talking to people who teach the programs, who administer the programs, who have graduated from the programs and who have hired nurses from the programs. please respect my decision to become a good lpn at this stage in my life. it is the choice my husband and i have made, and it will not be changed. god bless!" sincere apologies if you think me or anyone else was being "unkind." it's just reality. no one, certainly not me was or is critcizing your choices, what i and others were commenting on was your "outrage" at the price of the school you were looking at, the inability to get financial assistance and the self-imposed scheduling conflicts you have with your desire to be with your child. a very wise person once told me that ..."if you have the sincere desire to accomplish something, you have to be willing to remove all the roadblocks you put up and not expect payment from others (financial or otherwise)..." what that means is if you really want this, you'll find a way to do it on your own and look at any perks you get (i.e. financial aid, child care, etc) as just a bonus.....i've been down that path, and found a way to pay for my choices (not just financial) without help from anyone/anything in the equation. when i did earn a scholarship(s), a free book from someone, or a free meal, etc it was not only a huge bonus, it made me more appreciatative and determined to do well and give back whenever i could.....i hope you remember your experiences as you're going through them - there's a lot of people just like you that you could "pay it forward" to by giving them an expensive book you no longer need, a kind word when they get stuck in a class or just a simple cup of coffee... life ain't easy and choices are sometimes hard - sometimes you have to sacrafice more than you would like to - which is all good as long as you keep your eye on the ball - it typically is worth it in the end.... no one, least of all me is "disrespecting" your decision(s) - i believe you were seeking advice, and some of it might be what you don't want to hear - but take it in the context and spirit with which it was given - it's just that - advice - if you choose to not follow it that's your choice - by soliciting many different opinions, you'll get a wide spectrum with which to consider - you don't have to follow it nor defend the choice(s) you've already made ...remember that if you ask for advice then become defensive and criticize what you ask for, you'll eventually not receive the guidance you seek.... you have chosen a "tough row to hoe" and are doing what a lot people do - chasing their goals while maintaining their lives - it's not easy and not everyone takes the same path - they do what works for them - you have very obviously chosen your path - you don't have to defend it or explain it - go do it! the paths that others have taken and shared with you aren't wrong or unkind to you personally because it doesn't work for you. people are only sharing the wisdom of making mistakes along the way and trying to "pay it forward" by adverting someone else from having to learn the hard way too..... by the way, my "day job" i.e. what pays for school and life is working in transmission and distribution for my local electric company - your husband, a lineman, doesn't have an easy road himself - i'm sure he needs your support as much as your child - adding to your already full plate......using your time wisely will be the biggest battle at accomplishing your goals... and just a word from someone that has had to struggle and make tough choices (like everyone else) too - my "wise friend" also told me that i shouldn't ask the question if i don't want to hear the answer - i (like everyone else) have had to learn that the hard way a few times too....it's good advice and i wish you a smooth road to reaching your goals....

Well my brain certainly doesn't think I'm too old for anything.....right up until I can't get out of bed after a day of being the "coolest aunt" running around with my 20 something nieces and nephews all day and letting them convince me that I can keep up with a night of "clubbing.." Wow - that's a eye opener (and a head pounder)!! That's something I that will certainly concede that I just can't do it like I used to anymore! I'm really not hesitant about the schooling part - it's the fear of being lured by the carrot of an "automatic" job after killing myself for another 2 yrs - as I said before, that happened a year ago - worked full time, did the surg tech/AAS program full time - did VERY well - top 3 at everything - stood there at graduation with all my "bling" and nobody would hire me.....didn't help there were only about 3 jobs in the city, but they all went to the 19 yr olds that would work for $11 an hr, nights and take call every weekend and holiday.....I'm not against the hours - I've worked 3rd shift most of my life and really like it - don't mind working weekends either - it's just the demand that you WILL and they won't pay you to do it.....I'm certainly not going to take a VERY hard earned degree and licensure and kill myself at a hospital that places zero value on what you do and insists you work hours that prevent you from getting a second job to survive because they won't pay you enough to live! The "professors" conveinently "reserved" the descent jobs (only 4 of them) for the 18-19 yr olds, denied us (by us I mean the 3 of us that were in our 40's) clincals in the last quarter which is when you get the job offers.....it was all very illegal, but pursuing a legitimate, provable lawsuit doens't get you the job at the end of the day - so why bark up that tree?? We didn't stay silent, but bringing that kind of discrimination to light again, doesn't get you a job and it isn't going to change anything either....too bad....we were trying to help the next 40 something's that will surely "drink the Kool-Aid" like we did..... HOWEVER - I always try (and am usually successful) to turn bad behavior and hard lessons learned into something advanatageous.....so starting RN school with the intense surg tech school behind me will hopefully make some of the nursing classes/clinicals easier....at least that's the way I'm looking at it....and best of all, I don't have to to come home and want to slice my wrists trying to get through Micro or Chem or A&P!! The only non-NSG courses I have to take is Pharm (which I hear is also a new dimension in academic pain) and NSG math.....the rest is just the NSG.....that's a huge relief!! Just a word of been there done that advice to those of you that are just starting with no background/courses....it just happened (financially and waiting list) for me, and boy am I glad the universe worked it out that way.... If you're faced with a waiting list.....do whatever it takes to take ALL the classes that are required outside the NSG program - ALL of them!!! You'll be so happy and relieved that when you finally get in the program that you don't have to deal with the frustration and time it takes to try and keep up with NSG classes AND stuff like Micro, Chem, A&P, etc - even the "easy" classes like the ENG, etc - they are time consuming and all affect your GPA - believe me when you're trying to keep up with classes, labs and clinicals and have other "non" NSG classes to contend with you'll get overwhelmed quickly......it's WAY easier to get ALL of it done before you enter the program!! Trust me - been there done that! Can I get an Amen!!!! :chuckle This old broad is going to start studying for the Pharm and NSG math now....doesn't start till March!

"good news, with the standard lpn program there are no prereqs... at least with the ones i have researched here in ohio and in kentucky. the classes (maths & anatomys) are all intrigued into the applied nursing curriculum. and believe me - i would not pay for the entire program up front. this particular lpn program (15 months) is about $24,000. i just found 2 other programs to look at today that are less than half of that cost." ok - a couple of things...."no prereq's" and the "math/anatomys" integrated into the "applied" nursing curriculum"....know what that means?? it means if you go on to the rn, the bridge programs you spoke about you won't be qualified for because you won't have the qualified college standard english, math, and sciences (anat/phys or not) "applied" means experience based, not academically based. nothing wrong with that - i have quite a few "applied" courses myself, but you also have to have the us college accepted standard for eng, math, sci, etc. for it to count at any other educational institution.... and $24,000?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? for 15 mos?!?!?!?!?!? this is exactly what i was talking about.....do the math!! 24,000/15=$1600 per month!! ok - let's do some rounding off here - an average quarter at an average community college = 3 mos....using your school's numbers, that would equal $4800 per quarter....let's also say that you're going full time - that's 12 credits per quarter.....know what that equals??? $400 per credit hour - if you attend the local university/community college at the rates you have been quoted - and let's just say you didn't need any extra/remedial/developmental classes and you finished the adn program at exactly what the program requires - 108 total credit hours to get an associates as well as an rn - you would have paid --- ya ready??? $43,200.00 - i think somewhere you say you're in ohio....so am i.....know what the average cost for the aas + rn program total is? $4,860.00 - don't know about you - but given the choice, i would take the community college, get a degree and double the license (lpn vs. rn) and pay $38,340.00 less............... yes books and nursing "trinkets" (i.e. stethoscope, shoes, uniforms, etc) are of additional cost, but it ain't no $38,000!!!!!!!!!! and there are lots and lots of ways around the "advertised" price for all that as you said about books on ebay..... basically what you are paying per quarter at the tech lpn school is nearly what you would pay for the entire program plus getting an rn, plus getting a degree - niether of which the lpn was offering.... about wia - i can't remember all the circumstances you stated you were in - but i went through wia too - they are in bed with the tech schools - they push for certificate programs that cost triple what a 2 yr college and some 4 yr colleges do - you end up with just that - a certificate and nothing else....the other glaring thing is w.i.a. stands for workforce investment act. it is for displaced (i.e. laid off, plant shutdown, etc) workers - maybe you said it, were you laid off/lose your job somehow? the wia program in my area was/is so bad that i was put off enough to go through all the channels and ended up speaking with the director of the program in columbus - they treated me horribly, refused to consider to pay a 1/3 of what they were pushing on me at the community college, etc. etc. etc.......it was so bad the director offered to send me to the local university (4 yr) at their cost.....unfortunately i gave up by then, started working 2 jobs and was already half way thru the surg tech program.....my point is, don't expect more from wia - if you qualify, you will be pushed into a certificate program - and if what you say is true (you want to give back and be an rn eventually) - i think i and everyone else has illustrated that a hard, fast, unecessarily expensive program isn't the way to go...... maybe you can take a step back, slow down, and do the math......if you don't and end up in the eveyln wood speed lpn program, i think you'll be in big debt, find yourself in a program that will demand that you spend 10-12 hrs a day in class/clinicals/lab "or else" they'll take away the program and make you pay for it anyway....most of those schools depend upon that and it is a huge part of their profit - drop outs - and typically it doesn't matter why you drop out - they are going to take your money, kick you out of the program and worse, you signed a contract saying you agreed....you may find yourself in a program that they make impossible to keep up with even if you were living at home with mommy and daddy with nothing else to do........ i say find that local community college that offers real degrees, has child care options (mine does) and their livlihood doesn't depend upon fast certificate programs.....i think you'll find you'll get a better education, end up with triple the options when you're done and not have to feel like you have to keep up with an unreasonable schedule "or else." you're going to save a ton of money and be a better nurse in the long run.... last thing about tech/trade schools (can you tell i'm not a fan of them yet? ).......as i said, i finished school once with an associate's and a surg tech certification/license.....do you know that 2 local tech/trade schools wanted to hire 3 of us to teach the surg tech program?????? talk about are you kidding me?!?!? yes, the 3 of us approached were the top 3 grade wise in the class - but that didn't give us enough o.r. experience/knowledge to teach classes on it!!!! how would you feel if you took the trade/tech school route, were pushed beyond any reasonable bounds (12-16 hrs a day required "or else"), paying $400 per hour and found out that your "professor's" ink wasn't dry yet on their associates degree dipolma and they had a year maybe two professional experience?? granted, i feel good about my skills and education and feel competent in the o.r. however - that doesn't make me qualified to teach - that should be a crime!!!! believe me - maybe that's the other questions you should start asking at the lpn school - if they're ligit, they shouldn't be offended at all when you ask to see the creditials of the teaching staff.....it's a totally reasonable question to ask!! give it some thought - check out the local colleges and universities before you sign some contract with a tech/trade school - and do the math!! good luck......sorry i'm on such a rant - i just had to get my niece out of a situation like this.....it's such a scam i can't even tell you......notice how many nursing schools have popped up in the last 4 yrs or so??? my area alone went from 2 nursing programs at colleges/universities to 12 nursing/allied health "colleges" trade/tech schools....all in the last 3 yrs.....2 were just shut down because it was discovered that they weren't certified by anyone....so 400-500 innocent kids that are in deep debt are now being told their "certificates"/"licenses" aren't valid...... stay away from tech/trade schools!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:no::no: good luck!

Well sure - I think you have to keep your mind open and your eye on "your" ball - you have to be willing to do anything that will get you where you eventually want to be.....it's easy to be distracted or think you can circumnavigate the "system" but that never works - age and the wisdom that comes with it is the advantage there! A med/surg and/or "floor" nurse I don't think is my cup of tea - I scrubbed for 2 yrs in clinicals and really like surgery - I always knew I would - but is that the job I want in the role of RN? I don't know for SURE - I think I would like ICU - but again, without having the experience in any of those (except surgery as a scrub) I cannot nor will not make an opinion about any path that RN's can take - I do know that I have always wanted to work neuro, specifically rehab for spinal cord and brain injuries....I don't know enough about it to know what the best path to get there is YET... My point (and answer) is this - yes, I think you have to be ready, willing and able to do whatever it takes to get to where you want to be - that isn't very popular in todays culture, seems there's a huge entitlement attitude nowadays - "you owe me, and I shouldn't have to work to get there" type attitude.....that certainly isn't me - but I'll admit I do get frustrated when people, corporations/hospitals reward that behavior by giving people like that what they want - then can't figure out why they weren't successful......there really is a purpose to "paying your dues" so to speak......it gives you the experience and knowledge to move on (if you want to) and most of all be better at your job....that helps everyone.... Great to hear your story - it's inspiring.....I remember things like that when I've been up for 18 hrs and have a 19 yr old preceptor being a nasty little creep, not teaching me anything and trying to give me lessons about "life..." :chuckle

Wow - are we sisters of a different mother?? I know - you're the YOUNGER one, but wow - sans the kids, we've had the same experience....I sat on my fat you know what for 25+ yrs waiting to retire from a yes, exciting to some career with an "old established" company - then was laid off.....EYE OPENER!! Did A LOT of for not taking advantage of my free educational benefits for that long....what a dope I am!! But as you said, with age comes wisdom....the only wisdom I had at 18 was I don't want to go to school and no body is going to make me! So I didn't waste my family's money on something I didn't want to do, didn't like, and would never finish.....so there I was....44 yrs old and starting from square one going for the surg tech, then RN with 2 Associate's degrees.....as you said - I found that I LOVE it!! Where in the heck did that come from??? I was a REAL child of the 60's/70's if you know what I mean.... why didn't I discover just how cool school was then????? I think you'll find that not only do you like school (because you're serious now, that's why) you'll be killing yourself to not let any "young punk" professor try and ruin your 4.0!! :chuckle It's going to happen - it really is.... It's cool being old....the kids in my college say "I'm the chit" for "being so cool and hangin in school" The other thing that's so weird about your post is I'm done with the Surg Tech/AAS- no jobs scrubbing, so working again in unrelated field, but currently doing the RN, already accepted to the RN-BSN school and when I started this "long strange trip" I'm on, my goal was CRNA.....it's fun to dream about - but that last one is probably the most far fetched at the moment....I CAN do it of course - but do I want to? Realistically by the time I have enough letters after my name to qualify - I'll be - let's say 60 - it's a MINIMUM of 2 yrs (at U of Cincy) and you can't work (meaning having to live on my retirement money) - it's THAT intense.....so that's a minimum of 62.....as I said, when I was laid off at 43, I only had 7 more yrs to retire.. like I should be retiring next year!........I was REALLY looking foward to that!!! So the question becomes not whether you CAN......it becomes do you WANT to?? I think I would be scared to start - only because when I get into something, I'm WAY INTO it.....I know what would happen - I'd get the CRNA, start working, and when I looked up again I'd be 85, ready to kick the bucket and never got to enjoy the "fruits of my labor...." I dunno............I think Nietzsche is right....."Reality is not real, it's perceived by your perception..." I know - maybe I got WAY too far into the 70's!!!:chuckle