Chronis

Well I called them and was told that no one has dropped yet and no alternates have been selected. There are apparently 24 people on the alternate list so it doesn't look good for people on the alternate list.

Well it's been a couple of years now since I went there and I know a few things have changed. That being said when I went it was your GPA in select courses mostly in the sciences that mattered whether you where selected in the program. Taking a quick glance at Orvis website confirmed that this is still the case. Also I believe Orvis has started interviews being required now which it didn't before. So first I would calculate what your GPA is regarding Orvis school of nursing specifically, and what your nursing GPA would be if you got A's in your 5 remaining courses. That being said and I don't want to be mean here or anything here but back when I applied if your pre nursing GPA is 3.3 when you applied to the program you wouldn't have had a chance in getting into Orvis or WNC or TMCC for that matter. However I believe these schools have started admitting more students so you might have better chances now. Also the Apollo nursing school which is a for profit school would probably definitely be a possibility for you. You also might want to consider retaking those courses which you didn't get A's in that count towards your Nursing GPA. That being said if you truly want to be a nurse and are willing to relocate or to retake certain classes I am sure you can get into nursing school somewhere. I should warn you however the really hard part comes after you graduate when your trying to get a job. The California Institute for Nursing and Healthcare has had a survey revealing 46% of new new nurses not finding jobs after 18 months.

Well if you look at the study the RAND corporation did a few years back it does indicate that there will be a surplus of CRNA's by 2020. That being said in the field of nursing CRNA's are going to be the most in demand due to it's selective and restrictive entry requirements into the profession. Entry level nursing already has a massive surplus with new nurses struggling to get jobs. A separate study has also been done by the RAND corporation regarding NP's and they are facing a huge surplus by 2020. So while it is true in the future it may be difficult to get jobs as a CRNA it's going to be much more difficult for all other careers in nursing. I have posted the link to the study below: http://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/technical_reports/2010/RAND_TR688.pdf

Hi tgibs87: I can't really compare RNs to radiation therapy since I am not that familiar about the pay and job opportunities in radiation therapy. However I can say that the job market for new RNs is pretty abysmal right now so you might want to keep that in mind. However I have taken both microbiology and two semesters of physics. One thing you should look into is if the physics required for radiation therapy is a technical, intro, or health science physics class. Those types of physics courses are significantly easier than college level physic courses that one would need to take for things like medical school. I took two semesters of college physics courses and from my own personal experience I can tell you that I found microbiology to be much easier and the labs far more interesting. However the two are quite different with microbiology being much more memory based while physics as you can imagine was extremely math intensive. I will say though that I am surprised that if you got through human anatomy and physiology that you wouldn't be able to get through microbiology. All of those courses I thought where pretty much the same in terms of difficulty. Are you having problems with the micro lab, or do you find the class boring? Perhaps you just have a bad teacher. Have you tried taking microbiology with another professor? One suggestion I have that may help you make sense of a class you are struggling with is to look for a book like microbiology for dummies. This may seem a little silly I know but when I was in calculus I found the book the professor assigned to us to be absolutely no help whatsoever. If I had relied upon that useless 12 pound book I would have definitely either failed calculus or done very poorly. My calculus professors lectures also sucked and I learned absolutely nothing about calculus when I attended them. The only way I made it through that course was by taking my calculus for dummies book and using it to literally teach myself calculus. I also would encourage you to examine your own study habits and try to see how they might be improved. I know when I first started taking the science courses my study skills where really lousy. When I took general chemistry for the first time I got a D+ and in my first semester of human anatomy and physiology I got a C+. I would latter go on to retake both those courses and get A's in both so it can be done. In any event I wish you the best of luck whatever future career path you choose.

Hi Alana, I have just completed UNRs RN-BSN program. To tell you the truth I was not impressed. While some of the instructors where great others where absolutely terrible. Honestly if I had to do it over again I would definitely go somewhere else.

Dishes, I am an ADN nurse who is currently in school getting my BSN. I am also heavily into science and research and am always willing to keep an open mind regarding these matters. However there are currently numerous studies stating that there is a relationship between lower mortality rates and a baccalaureate degree in nursing. Combined these studies examined hundreds of hospitals, tens of thousands of nurses and hundreds of thousands of patients. These studies as you can imagine are very compelling. I also read your link about research that you posted. From what I gathered the study of an RN/RPN toolkit focused on designing a guide that would determine appropriate RN/RPN staffing ratios based on patients level of acuity. What I didn't see in this study was a comparison between an all RN work force and a RN/RPN workforce. Again this study seemed to be focused primarily on staffing. This study seems to be designed for setting appropriate staffing mix ratios of an RN/RPN workforce. This study was pretty hard to follow though and it's getting late so I'm pretty tired. So if you think I made a mistake regarding this research please let me know and I will review it again after I have gotten some more sleep.

Nursel56 I think the Institute of Medicines report calling for 80% of all nurses to have their BSN by 2020 was pretty definitive. However I will include excerpts of the report below that further demonstrate the reports support for BSN education. "A growing body of research documents that hospitals with a larger proportion of bedside care nurses with BSNs or higher qualifications is associated with lower risk of patient mortality." "Advances in medical science and technology, the changing practice boundaries between medicine and nursing, and the increase in the share of the population with multiple chronic health conditions create a level of complexity in health care that requires a more educated health care workforce. Nursing is the least well educated health profession by far but the one experiencing the greatest expansion in scope of practice and responsibilities." I'm going to post a link to the Institute of Medicines report below so everyone can read it for themselves and come to their own conclusions. By the way nursel56 do you know the page in the report where you got your quote from? I looked for it but was unable to find it. My quotes are from page 485 of the report. The Future of Nursing: Leading Change, Advancing Health Nursel56 you can look for a certain result in science, it's called a hypothesis. However what you cannot do is disregard data that doesn't support your hypothesis. Researchers propose hypotheses as explanations of phenomena, and design studies to test these hypotheses. Nursel56, Nursel56 I took a look at your link. As a very intelligent individual you know that the American Association of Community Colleges (AACC) would be very biased regarding this matter. Also since the AACC first sent out this message back in 2003 it has had plenty of time to do its own research to dispute these studies but has not done so. In addition since the AACC's 2003 statement there have been numerous different studies that researchers have done regarding the relationship between lower patient mortality rates and BSN nurses. These studies have come to the exact same conclusions as the 2003 study that the AACC attacked. Here is another excerpt from the Institute of Medicines report which I think helps illustrate this concept: "Aiken and colleagues (2003) in a paper published in the Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA) showed that in 1999, each 10 percent increase in the proportion of a hospital's bedside nurse workforce with BSN qualification was associated with a 5 percent decline in mortality following common surgical procedures. A similar finding was published by Friese and associates for cancer surgical outcomes (Friese et al., 2008). Aiken's team has replicated this finding in a larger study of hospitals in 2006. Similar results have been published for medical as well as surgical patients in at least three large studies in Canada and Belgium (Estabrooks et al., 2005; Tourangeau et al., 2007; Van den Heede et al., 2009)."

By admitting there is a correlation you are admitting that there is a relationship between lower mortality rates and a baccalaureate degree in nursing. However you appear to be arguing that because the studies don’t show causation they are irrelevant. That is not the case. I brought up the smoking argument because it was relevant to this discussion. We didn’t prove causation when it came to the fact that smoking caused cancer. Instead we proved that smoking caused cancer by endlessly repeating findings showing an association between smoking an cancer. Therefore I believe you are in err regarding the argument that we cannot state that training in BSN programs helps reduce patient mortality. By endlessly repeating findings that show an association between lower mortality rates and a baccalaureate degree in nursing we can prove it and state it. As for the questions on the variables I was just asking you what variables you think could lead to a correlation but not causation.

futurernmena, i am sorry to hear about your boss. in response to your question to the best of my knowledge the current research would count adn nurses who complete their bsns as bsn nurses because that’s what they would be. i don’t see how that would affect any of the data in the studies however. dishes, do you know what those studies are called regarding the use of rn/rpn vs. rn? or what journal article they where published in? i would be skeptical to take anything employers said on faith. in my experience at least in america employers are more worried about saving money that protecting patient’s health. nursel56, that’s the same argument the tobacco companies used when they where trying to dispute the studies that showed smoking caused cancer. however if you have any ideas on unknown variables that might have effected all the studies i would be glad to hear them. gitanorn, topics regarding a new york rn-bsn bill have probably been discussed several times throughout the years. that’s because new york has proposed similar bills to a01977 requiring rns to go on and get their bsns for the last 8 years ryan, i certainly agree with you that cattiness in nursing must stop. horizontal violence in nursing is mean spirited and unprofessional. the issue of rn-bsn should not be used to attack individual nurses. however if the current studies do indicate that the training in bsn programs helps reduce patient mortality shouldn’t we take a hard look at implementing such training in our workforce? don’t we have a duty as health care professionals to give the best care possible to the general public?

Dishes I was able to find the whole article that you mentioned in your link: http://www.jblearning.com/samples/0763744379/Hall.pdf The study you mentioned does not refute the BSN only staffing models. It only states that a higher proportion of professional nursing staff (which this study defines as RNs and RPNs) in the staff mix have better outcomes than nursing staff mix’s that include unregulated staff (URW) and a lower proportion of professional nursing staff. RPNs in this case refer to registered practical nurses which in Canada have roughly the same practice rights as LPNs here. “Specifically, staff mix models that included a lower proportion of professional nursing staff (RNs and RPNs) were related to the use of more nursing hours (t = -2.09; P = .05). The fewer RNs and RPNs employed on the unit, the fewer hours of nursing care used. In contrast, the higher the proportion of unregulated staff on the unit, the greater the nursing hours costs.” No where in this study did I see it state how the (RN/RPN) nursing staff model performed in relation to the all-RN nursing staff model. However if you think I missed something you think is particularly relevant which will show me to be in error feel free to point it out and I will look over the study again.

Well ADN's would still have the same rights to practice as they always have but would need to obtain their BSN in 10 years. According to the bill any licensed ADN nurse who doesn’t obtain a baccalaureate degree in the required time would face disciplinary action including but not limited to the loss of their registered nursing license.

I was curious what everyone thinks about the debate over the law being proposed in New York which seeks to require all registered professional nurses to attain a baccalaureate degree in nursing within ten years of their initial licensure? http://www.advisory.com/Daily-Briefing/2012/01/04/BSN-in-10 The New York bill A01977 wouldn't apply to registered professional nurses who are already licensed in the state of New York. Also those currently in school to become registered professional nurses in the state of New York would also be grandfathered in and exempt from the new legislation. I have looked into research regarding this topic and the research I have seen seems to support the fact that nurses educated at the baccalaureate degree have lower mortality rates for patients. One study indicates that increasing nurse's educational level decreases the risk of patient death and failure to rescue by four percent (Aiken et al., 2008). Also hospitals with a higher proportion of baccalaureate-prepared nurses have a lower mortality rate (Friese et al., 2008). In fact the Institute of Medicine has issued a call for 80% of registered nurses to possess a baccalaureate degree or higher by 2020 (Institute of Medicine, 2011). Other research I found supports the fact that BSN nurses are associated with lower mortality rates. I have included this research below: Estabrooks, C. A., Midodzi, W. K., Cummings, G. G., Ricker, K. L., & Giovannetti, P. (2005). The impact of hospital nursing characteristics on 30-day mortality. Nursing Research, 54(2), 74-84. Tourangeau, A. E., Doran, D. M., Hall, L. M., Pallas, L. O. B., Pringle, D., Tu, K. V., et al. (2006). Impact of hospital nursing care on 30-day mortality for acute medical patients. Journal of Advanced Nursing, 57(1), 32-44. To be fair I tried locating research that would cast doubt on the research above or that would come to a different conclusion. I was however unsuccessful in locating any such research. If anyone has any additional research that would repudiate the fact that nurses prepared at the bachelor's level seem to have a lower rate of mortality for their patients could you please post it? I would love to see such a study and would be very interested in reading it. References Aiken, L.H., Clarke, S.P., Sloane, D.M., Lake, E.T. & Cheney, T. (2008). Effects of hospital care environment on patient mortality and nurse outcomes. Journal of Nursing Administration, 38(5), 223-229. Friese, C.R, Lake, E.T., Aiken, L.H., Silber, J.H. & Sochalski, J. (2008). Hospital nurse practice environments and outcomes for surgical oncology patients. Health Services Research, 43(4), 1145-1163. Institute of Medicine. (2011). The Future of Nursing: Leading Change, Advancing Health. Washington, DC: The National Academies Press.

Scir If you want to be a CRNA aren't you going to need your bachelors? In any case I went to WNC and personally didn't know anyone who had a 4.0 GPA. Counting just my pre-nursing classes I had about a 3.91 GPA before I started nursing school. While in nursing school I averaged about a 3.3 GPA. I definitely don't think WNC would be the right place to go to get a 4.0. However I don't think TMCC and UNR are going to be places where you can get easy A's either. All 3 of these nursing schools are extraordinarily competitive to get into. Once you get accepted into one of these nursing schools you're basically competing with all the other super high GPA students. That makes it very difficult to maintain your GPA. But if you absolutely have to get A's I would say your best shot is Carrington College. Many of the students who go to Carrington where rejected from the other schools because they had lower GPA's. So at Carrington you're not competing against all the other 4.0 GPA students. Hoped this info helped you out. Good luck!

Actually at least when it comes to nursing men are almost twice as likely to leave the profession as females according to this study done by the University of Pennsylvania. "7.5 percent of new male nurses dropped out of nursing within four years of graduating from nursing school, compared to 4 percent of women" http://www.upenn.edu/researchatpenn/article.php?435&hlt

MrsEd are you already and RN and are you referring to the RN to BSN program? If so then yes I am also applying to that program for this fall. What I have heard is that they are getting more and more applicants each year and it's becoming a competitive process. I was told that they are first going to take the applicants who have ever last prerequisite class done (Not counting the classes they waive by petition like nutrition). Once they have narrowed the selection down to those who have all their prerequisites done and if there are more applicants then spaces they will then rank people by there DARS Nursing GPA to decide who gets into the program. I heard they never have actually had to rank people by their gpa but due to the increase in applicants they might have to this year. Your DARS nursing GPA should have been at the bottom of your application when you applied. If you don't remember what your DARS nursing GPA is you can look it up via epaws. If you are not a RN already and are applying to go into the BSN program directly unfortunately I don't know that much about it. Here is a link some one posted before talking a little about it: https://allnurses.com/nv-nursing-programs/unr-spring-2011-a-509369.html. I believe that applicants to the direct BSN program also are admitted by ranking the applicants by their DARS nursing gpa but it's a tiny bit different from the RN to BSN one so be careful you don't get the two confused. In any case if you have any questions feel free to ask though I can't guarantee I will have all the answers. Anyway hopefully this info was helpful. Good Luck!