Checking test results?

Healer555 said:

Why would people lie here? It's a anonymous 

 Just counting the days til I'm back to a normal life 

Because that's what people with substance use disorders do when they are in a monitoring program - they lie!  
 
You can't possibly believe everything you read on here.  Doesn't all of us on here have a strong science background and an understanding of the human body?  
 

Pumping gasoline and spilling gas drops on you doesn't cause a positive alcohol test.  Using hand sanitizer doesn't cause a positive urine etg test.  Swishing mouthwash doesn't cause a positive test.  
 

don't believe everyone here - they lie.  

PassportCruiser said:

Because that's what people with substance use disorders do when they are in a monitoring program - they lie!  
 
You can't possibly believe everything you read on here.  Doesn't all of us on here have a strong science background and an understanding of the human body?  
 

Pumping gasoline and spilling gas drops on you doesn't cause a positive alcohol test.  Using hand sanitizer doesn't cause a positive urine etg test.  Swishing mouthwash doesn't cause a positive test.  
 

don't believe everyone here - they lie.  

I can understand lying to the board or monitoring program to avoid trouble,  but lie here? For what? If an anonymous poster says they did or didn't use a substance,  they're anonymous.  I truly don't get it. I'll be overly cautious for a few more months just in case but thank you 

Healer555 said:

I can understand lying to the board or monitoring program to avoid trouble,  but lie here? For what? If an anonymous poster says they did or didn't use a substance,  they're anonymous.  I truly don't get it. I'll be overly cautious for a few more months just in case but thank you 

I understand that it's hard to get it, but that's how it is.  When a person with a true substance use disorder defend themselves, it is natural to not tell the truth.  And that includes an anonymous Internet forum because they are repeating the lie to themselves over and over.

Regardless, why do you believe everything you read on the internet?  It's the internet!  Do you believe all the ridiculous political things that go on?  Now even science is a target.

Chinese food, Italian food, pumping gas, soy sauce, perfume, hand sanitizer etc does not doom you for etg tests.  To say otherwise is false information and detrimental to the mental health of people seeking comfort and hope on this forum.  

PassportCruiser said:

I understand that it's hard to get it, but that's how it is.  When a person with a true substance use disorder defend themselves, it is natural to not tell the truth.  And that includes an anonymous Internet forum because they are repeating the lie to themselves over and over.

Regardless, why do you believe everything you read on the internet?  It's the internet!  Do you believe all the ridiculous political things that go on?  Now even science is a target.

Chinese food, Italian food, pumping gas, soy sauce, perfume, hand sanitizer etc does not doom you for etg tests.  To say otherwise is false information and detrimental to the mental health of people seeking comfort and hope on this forum.  

I don't believe everything on the internet but this is a group of nurses . I just don't understand the point of lying.  

Thanks 

PassportCruiser said:

Because that's what people with substance use disorders do when they are in a monitoring program - they lie!  
 
You can't possibly believe everything you read on here.  Doesn't all of us on here have a strong science background and an understanding of the human body?

 

don't believe everyone here - they lie.  

I agree with your sentiment, but only partially agree. Yes, most or many addicts do lie, but not ALL addicts in recovery will lie on a message board. I would argue that the majority would Not lie on a recovery forum. You wrote to not believe "everyone." What does that mean? Is it really that (all inclusive)?  Or....are you saying believe no one? What percentage? 10 percent? What about 50 percent? 80 percent?

The point I am making is that I am agreeing with your premise about lying, but.......I don't do the "all inclusive" thing with words like ALWAYS, NEVER, ALL OF THEM, NONE OF THEM, because in reality, I actually have a science background, I know that all inclusives Rarely apply and the truth often lies somewhere between two points on a continuum and along that continuum, its often closer to the middle. 

Words matter.. We have to choose them carefully because if not chosen carefully, we let EMOTION overcome Objective thought and having a science background in the form of a Doctoral Degree, we learn that folks that use emotional based ALL INclusive or ALL Exclusive words to make a point have immediately on the spot, usually let emotion do the thinking before the objective thinking occurs. Why? Because ALWAYS and NEVER or ALL of THEM or NONE of THEM are rarely true when compared to words like "often, sometimes, usually, on many occasions, some of the time,.most of the time," etc. And using these words to make a point often has far more weight in academia and research and it wreaks of objective thinking compared to emotional first- based thinking.

With all of that written above, I agree we have to be careful on forums as people can and sometimes do lie, but certainly not everyone lies.

PassportCruiser said:

Because that's what people with substance use disorders do when they are in a monitoring program - they lie!  
 
You can't possibly believe everything you read on here.  Doesn't all of us on here have a strong science background and an understanding of the human body?  
 

Pumping gasoline and spilling gas drops on you doesn't cause a positive alcohol test.  Using hand sanitizer doesn't cause a positive urine etg test.  Swishing mouthwash doesn't cause a positive test.  
 

don't believe everyone here - they lie.  

Actually, this isn't fully accurate.

ETG/ETS tests can be affected by multiple environmental alcohol exposures, and this has been documented both in toxicology literature and in guidance from multiple state monitoring programs. 

A few facts:

1. Hand sanitizer CAN raise EtG/EtS levels

There are peer-reviewed studies showing that frequent use of alcohol-based sanitizers (especially in healthcare settings where nurses sanitize 50+ times/day) can produce detectable EtG/EtS.

Usually it's low-level, but levels under ~500–1,000 ng/mL have been reported as incidental exposure.

This is why many monitoring programs specifically warn participants to minimize ABHS use when possible.

2. Mouthwash IS a known cause of false positives in sensitive ETG tests

Because mouthwash contains 15–30% alcohol, even swishing (not swallowing) can spike EtG.

Again, usually low levels, but enough to register on a very sensitive cutoff like 100 ng/mL.

 3. Gasoline contains ethanol additives

While pumping gas generally doesn't cause a high EtG, multiple studies and program advisories acknowledge that heavy exposure to ethanol-containing solvents can produce low-level positives  which is why many monitoring programs advise avoiding repeated prolonged exposure.

4. This is WHY modern programs look at level + pattern, not just presence

Most monitoring programs no longer punish based on low incidental levels because they understand these issues.

They look at:

• the actual EtG number

• EtS confirmation

• the trend over time

• the cutoff used

• the person's explanation

So the idea that "environmental exposure NEVER affects EtG" isn't accurate. The science is more nuanced than that.

People in monitoring aren't lying they're dealing with extremely sensitive tests that pick up even trace exposure, and that's widely acknowledged by toxicologists and by the programs themselves.

RNigothis said:

Actually, this isn't fully accurate.

ETG/ETS tests can be affected by multiple environmental alcohol exposures, and this has been documented both in toxicology literature and in guidance from multiple state monitoring programs. 

A few facts:

1. Hand sanitizer CAN raise EtG/EtS levels

There are peer-reviewed studies showing that frequent use of alcohol-based sanitizers (especially in healthcare settings where nurses sanitize 50+ times/day) can produce detectable EtG/EtS.

Usually it's low-level, but levels under ~500–1,000 ng/mL have been reported as incidental exposure.

This is why many monitoring programs specifically warn participants to minimize ABHS use when possible.

2. Mouthwash IS a known cause of false positives in sensitive ETG tests

Because mouthwash contains 15–30% alcohol, even swishing (not swallowing) can spike EtG.

Again, usually low levels, but enough to register on a very sensitive cutoff like 100 ng/mL.

 3. Gasoline contains ethanol additives

While pumping gas generally doesn't cause a high EtG, multiple studies and program advisories acknowledge that heavy exposure to ethanol-containing solvents can produce low-level positives  which is why many monitoring programs advise avoiding repeated prolonged exposure.

4. This is WHY modern programs look at level + pattern, not just presence

Most monitoring programs no longer punish based on low incidental levels because they understand these issues.

They look at:

• the actual EtG number

• EtS confirmation

• the trend over time

• the cutoff used

• the person's explanation

So the idea that "environmental exposure NEVER affects EtG" isn't accurate. The science is more nuanced than that.

People in monitoring aren't lying they're dealing with extremely sensitive tests that pick up even trace exposure, and that's widely acknowledged by toxicologists and by the programs themselves.

 

Then my hypervigelance hasn't been completely for naught. Our cut off level is 20 ng/ ml. I'm honestly not regretting going without to finish on time. I have about 3 months left on a 3 year monitoring agreement.  This has been horrible.  

SheelaDavis said:

No offense, but you actually do NOT need to make sure it "got there and got tested." Not only is that Not your responsibility, its Illegal for you to have ANYTHING to do with the specimen After the bag is sealed and you get the Chain of Custody form in your hand, because at that very moment of you receiving the COC form in your hand, you LEGALLY relinquish chain of custody of the specimen. 

What do you need to be sure of? Make sure the COC form is correctly filled out. For example, did the lab tech forget to check the temperature in range box and the split specimen box? Believe it or not, that part is your responsibility, because if the COC form is wrong, you simply have them do it again on the spot Before you leave the testing area. But you have ZERO responsibility for the "transport" or "shipment or mailing" of the specimen and then making sure the lab technician 3 states or 10 states away from you actually tests it.

Yeah saying no offense is actually offensive when you say it's illegal for me to have anything to do with it. Because I am not tampering or doing anything with my specimen. I actually LOVE seeing the negative results because it's just proof to MYSELF that I am doing well. I like to make sure it's arrived by checking and seeing the "negative, normal" results. And if that offends anyone I really don't care LOL. But don't come at me with how I'm doing something illegal when I'm not. I've worked damn hard at my sobriety so SUE me for liking to check the results and that it arrived! But never come at me for doing something wrong. My case worker with the board  of nursing is nicer than some of the people here. 

Nursrcy00901 said:

Yeah saying no offense is actually offensive when you say it's illegal for me to have anything to do with it. Because I am not tampering or doing anything with my specimen. I actually LOVE seeing the negative results because it's just proof to MYSELF that I am doing well. I like to make sure it's arrived by checking and seeing the "negative, normal" results. And if that offends anyone I really don't care LOL. But don't come at me with how I'm doing something illegal when I'm not. I've worked damn hard at my sobriety so SUE me for liking to check the results and that it arrived! But never come at me for doing something wrong. My case worker with the board  of nursing is nicer than some of the people here. 

I don't think she was trying to come at you! She was just trying to put your mind at ease. 

SheelaDavis said:

I agree with your sentiment, but only partially agree. Yes, most or many addicts do lie, but not ALL addicts in recovery will lie on a message board. I would argue that the majority would Not lie on a recovery forum. You wrote to not believe "everyone." What does that mean? Is it really that (all inclusive)?  Or....are you saying believe no one? What percentage? 10 percent? What about 50 percent? 80 percent?

The point I am making is that I am agreeing with your premise about lying, but.......I don't do the "all inclusive" thing with words like ALWAYS, NEVER, ALL OF THEM, NONE OF THEM, because in reality, I actually have a science background, I know that all inclusives Rarely apply and the truth often lies somewhere between two points on a continuum and along that continuum, its often closer to the middle. 

Words matter.. We have to choose them carefully because if not chosen carefully, we let EMOTION overcome Objective thought and having a science background in the form of a Doctoral Degree, we learn that folks that use emotional based ALL INclusive or ALL Exclusive words to make a point have immediately on the spot, usually let emotion do the thinking before the objective thinking occurs. Why? Because ALWAYS and NEVER or ALL of THEM or NONE of THEM are rarely true when compared to words like "often, sometimes, usually, on many occasions, some of the time,.most of the time," etc. And using these words to make a point often has far more weight in academia and research and it wreaks of objective thinking compared to emotional first- based thinking.

With all of that written above, I agree we have to be careful on forums as people can and sometimes do lie, but certainly not everyone lies.

Understood and you have a great point.  There are many people with a substance use diagnosis and in recovery, who are doing well.  And not everyone in substance use recovery lie. 

But when someone is claiming on here and on Reddit, that they "used only hand sanitizer" but have a positive Peth test, let's get real.  It's not a lie if you believe it.  

I wouldn't listen to every "claim" on here that they were only positive because of hand sanitizer, pumping gasoline or using mouthwash.  

RNigothis said:

Actually, this isn't fully accurate.

ETG/ETS tests can be affected by multiple environmental alcohol exposures, and this has been documented both in toxicology literature and in guidance from multiple state monitoring programs. 

A few facts:

1. Hand sanitizer CAN raise EtG/EtS levels

There are peer-reviewed studies showing that frequent use of alcohol-based sanitizers (especially in healthcare settings where nurses sanitize 50+ times/day) can produce detectable EtG/EtS.

Usually it's low-level, but levels under ~500–1,000 ng/mL have been reported as incidental exposure.

This is why many monitoring programs specifically warn participants to minimize ABHS use when possible.

2. Mouthwash IS a known cause of false positives in sensitive ETG tests

Because mouthwash contains 15–30% alcohol, even swishing (not swallowing) can spike EtG.

Again, usually low levels, but enough to register on a very sensitive cutoff like 100 ng/mL.

 3. Gasoline contains ethanol additives

While pumping gas generally doesn't cause a high EtG, multiple studies and program advisories acknowledge that heavy exposure to ethanol-containing solvents can produce low-level positives  which is why many monitoring programs advise avoiding repeated prolonged exposure.

4. This is WHY modern programs look at level + pattern, not just presence

Most monitoring programs no longer punish based on low incidental levels because they understand these issues.

They look at:

• the actual EtG number

• EtS confirmation

• the trend over time

• the cutoff used

• the person's explanation

So the idea that "environmental exposure NEVER affects EtG" isn't accurate. The science is more nuanced than that.

People in monitoring aren't lying they're dealing with extremely sensitive tests that pick up even trace exposure, and that's widely acknowledged by toxicologists and by the programs themselves.

 

The mouthwash study shows that you have to swish 60% alcohol mouthwash for 15 min, 3 times, each 1 min apart to have any noticeable urine ETG levels - that means you are swishing mouthwash for 45 min total time.  Nobody uses mouthwash in that manner.  

The study involving gasoline and causing a spike in urine ETG are for people who work in the gas industry and are around solvents the entire day for days at a time and multiple weeks.  

Not for Healer555 who spends 5 minutes putting regular unleaded fuel into his/her vehicle and then is on their normal daily schedule.  

Be careful but let's not get out of control here with this kind of stuff.  And this DEFINITELY includes avoiding entire genres of foods because you are in monitoring - that's ridiculous.

PassportCruiser said:

 

The mouthwash study shows that you have to swish 60% alcohol mouthwash for 15 min, 3 times, each 1 min apart to have any noticeable urine ETG levels - that means you are swishing mouthwash for 45 min total time.  Nobody uses mouthwash in that manner.  

The study involving gasoline and causing a spike in urine ETG are for people who work in the gas industry and are around solvents the entire day for days at a time and multiple weeks.  

Not for Healer555 who spends 5 minutes putting regular unleaded fuel into his/her vehicle and then is on their normal daily schedule.  

Be careful but let's not get out of control here with this kind of stuff.  And this DEFINITELY includes avoiding entire genres of foods because you are in monitoring - that's ridiculous.

You literally just reiterated everything I just said! LOL! Don't be "that nurse.” Saying people that people in recovery lies is the the pot calling the kettle back because if you are in this page, indeed, you are just like us! You got caught, got monitored, and recovered. Don't belittle people. Or you're just passing by and snooping on people's issue to go and judge? Please get out of here with trying to teach people a lesson! Leave for your unit drama that you probably cause!