bluenote

dutchgirl, no worries. i was reffering to traumahawk about misunderstanding the post though i'm certainly glad you didn't!

i think you may have misunderstood my post. i didn't say he was another scott peterson. still, the liklihood that any who knew peterson before his crimes actually thought he would ever commit them is probably zero. my point was just that we cannot ignore the fact that for people with the sort of mind-set evidenced in this case, the distance between a cad and a violent abuser can be frighteningly short. therefore, yes, immediate action is certainly warranted.

No need for thanks. And by the way....I love italian greyhounds...but my boston terriers own my heart! Well....what's left of it after my 4 kids take their portion!!

I would just add this....with time, pathological narcissists are far more likely to make that leap to violence. It isn't a very large one and takes minimal effort on their part. Granted, they do not start out that way in the vast majority of cases which is probably one reason why it's so easy to underestimate the dangers they pose. An example...when researching Scott Peterson's history the number of times he was referred to as narcissistic was equalled only be the number of times he was referred to as charming. Pretty frightening when you think about it. We all need to stop ignoring the warning signals.

Im glad you found some comfort in my words. You know...sometimes it takes more than seeing the writing on the wall to make a person take steps they fear and know will cause pain. It's a self-defense mechanism and one that all of us put to use at various times. Also, it's often true that women look at the faults of men as though there is something wrong with THEM for not being able to FIX the faults of those men. "If I were good enough he would love me enough to want to be a better person." You see things clearly in this situation it seems to me and I suspect that when it's all said and done you and your daughter will be closer than ever. Just know that the road is likely going to be long. You can handle it, though! Best of luck...don't hesitate to write me anytime.

Hello, As a new member here I hope I am not butting in where I shouldn't! I wanted to respond to your post for a few reasons. First, I am entirely sympathetic and empathetic to what you are dealing with. It's clear that you love your daughter and grandson and want the best for them and when it's all said and done, that counts for a lot! Here's what I see in your son-in-law, and let me just say from the outset that my opinions are based on advanced education in human services, careers in counseling and now writing, and my own personal observations and experiences over time. There are many people who would disagree with me and I never rule out the possibility that I'm wrong! That said, your son-in-law sounds to me like a narcissist with a drug addiction that he has absolutely no interest in breaking and I suspect only got back together with your daughter because it allowed him an easier ride. I know that hurts and I hate being so blunt about it but it seems to me that at this point beating around the bush is completely unhelpful. You listed some revealing aspects of this man's character. You said he speaks in a way so as not to actually lie or deny things, but to avoid answering yes or no. When you think back on asking a person a question and realize you have no idea if they answered it or not, there's a huge problem. This is not the normal speech of a person who isn't hiding something! It is a HUGE red flag and one you should not underestimate. When the same guy swears on the life of his wife and child that he isn't using, you must realize it means absolutely nothing. If ever backed into a corner he will find a way to talk his way out of this one too. The truth is of no interest to him as he has already proven via past behavior and deception. I actually have no problem believing that your daughter loves this man though I also believe she too sees the signs. We're experts at denying the obvious! It's important not to beat yourself up over that too much but at the same time, it's vital now that you've put down in writing for all the world to see what you "know" in your gut to be true about this guy that you no longer observe without acting. I don't agree with those who say both he and your daughter need a dose of tough love. Unless I read your post wrong, your daughter has not been hostile or defensive of his wrong action in your home. If that's true, I would do as someone else suggested and kick him to the curb while continuing to support your daughter. It's easy to throw out terms like "enabling" when you aren't in a particular situation. I believe that intent is a huge factor here and only when you can get to the root of a person's true intention can you determine whether they're enabling. Furthermore, it's clear that much enabling is a result of actions the enabler has no clue they are even taking part in. Most importantly, enabling is NOT a crime. Using illicit substances is the crime. Don't misplace the blame here. I am rambling and apologize for that! You asked for advice on how to handle the situation now. Here's what I would do in list form: 1. With or without a positive drug screen I would get this man out of my house. He's been disrespectful, abusive, and is a proven liar. Personally, I would go for the d/s though he will never agree to it. The fact is there is a difference between knowing something and really KNOWING something. Your daughter is in for a long and painful road and she would do well to have proof. Even then she'll be torn about staying away from this guy. 2. If your daughter stays, I would strongly encourage her to obtain counseling. While it's true that she has issues that need to be dealt with in light of how much power she's given this man, those issues are nothing to be ashamed of and likely nothing that the large majority of females in this country do not struggle with. She needs to deal with them sooner rather than later and will need the support of someone who can walk her through the steps. Frankly, you could use it too. 3. Again assuming she stays, I would consult an attorney about drawing up a separation agreement which ensures that your daughter does not have to consult with the child's father in the event of medical emergencies or other catastrophe. If this isn't done and he's got half a brain, he'll discover that it can be used as ammunition in court. Have his drug history documented. Keep everything in writing and keep details. This is not to say that you can keep the child from seeing his father and that should never be a long-term goal. Short-term is different. He will use that child as a tool to worm his way back and you need to guard against it. Ask about supervised visitation. The supervision should not be done by your daughter! Ask about legal vs. physical custody in your state. I have some experience with this but am not an attorney so don't want to go into too much detail. You need to find an attorney who knows what he/she is doing in order to protect that child. It is absolutely possible if you are persistent and know your stuff. Research the statutes on your state's website. 4. Accept that your daughter will be angry with you even if she stays. Understand that this is a result of fear. If she does let him leave alone, recognize that for the statement it likely is: "I'm scared. I'm embarrassed. I'm humiliated. I'm hurt. I feel stupid. I'm a failure. I'm lonely. I never thought my life would end up like this. I don't want this to be happening. Help!" The list goes on and on. Reassure her and keep her busy. She's 24 years old and yes that's an adult and old enough to have a child but it's uncanny how situations like these can bring even 50 year olds to their knees with feeling like a kid again themselves. As long as she's working towards the goal of a fulfilled and healthy life on her own, love her through it. If she refuses to detach from him...realize that sometimes life deals out what seems impossible and that you cannot allow your life to be ruined just because she makes such a choice. Let her go and pray that one day she'll come back. It happens. 5. Be firm. There's no room for compromise. The man is out and she stays in your home only as long as she stays apart from him. 6. Make sure you don't forget to laugh every once in a while! I think those are the most important at the moment. I can analyze from here to the moon as you can see but I'll make myself shut up now! I wish you and your daughter and grandson much success and peace. C