rant

Pavu!! Congratulations!! You must be ecstatic - to succeed on your final try! I am so PROUD of you. I passed too! I passed! I can't believe it - I'm crying!

Oh, you guys, I'm smiling from ear to ear for you....... I'm SO HAPPY for you. I can't wait to get home and check. Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!

CONGRATS!!! Where in Ontario?

This wait, frankly, sucks.

No news yet in Toronto.

You are in my thoughts and prayers, pavu. Yours will be the first response I look for when people are posting their results on here. Please let us know what the outcome is. I can't imagine how stressed you must be -- if this was your last chance to write the exam. :S I'd be very scared, wondering. I'm sending positive thoughts your way!

Hi pavu, Sure. "Entitled to Practice With Restrictions" (and the restriction being: I can only work as a RN in the place of my employment, as per the regulations of a temporary licence holder). And this is the status of the licence (status is current, the date I activated the license, and the date it has become inactive [which is blank, meaning that I either haven't failed, or they haven't gotten the results processed yet]: [TABLE=class: details04] [TR] CategoryClassStatusFromToSource[/TR] [TR] [TD]RN[/TD] [TD]Temporary[/TD] [TD]Current[/TD] [TD] 26-Sep-2012[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE]

Nothing yet in Toronto. Probably won't arrive by mail until next week, unfortunately. One thing to do: I keep checking the CNO website. If you've registered in the temporary class, their website will be the first place that will be updated if you've failed. You'll no longer be entitled to practice. So far, my entitlement to practice has not changed. Good luck, everyone. My prayers are with you all during this highly anxious time.

Stressful. The exam was more challenging than I expected it to be. There were a lot of knowledge based questions, which didn't bother me (although I know that I certainly got several of those wrong) -- it was the vagueness, the ambiguity, the dozens upon dozens of questions that had two equally applicable/ ridiculous options to choose from. I was a straight A student throughout my degree. This is the first time that I have been completely shaken in my confidence after an exam. I've always been paranoid about the possibility of failure (it helped me be a better student, I think), but I've never been so completely terrified of it -- and humbled by it -- as I am tonight. And for those of us that wrote today in Ontario, this is a bad time to fail, what with the requirements to be eligible to write the exam changing in January (re: the jurisprudence exam). We HAVE to pass, or we get a whole set of requirements added to our plates that were not fully included in formal teaching. I am already having a nervous breakdown, waiting for November. I'm convinced I failed.

there is... elegance to this. sometimes, platitudes are in place for a reason. thank you. i am humbled. i hear what you are saying. i know it's true. but, i also wanted to do a masters, or perhaps np. my grades have seriously suffered in the year that is most important to these programs, where you need a b average or better in your last year in order to gain admission. and, i know. i have a b average. but, i would have been likely guaranteed admission prior. now -- not so much. but, i know. whining about something i cannot change. move forward. gotta pay rent, so no. but, maybe that movie thing would be a good idea. :) thank you. you have been so kind. aw, crap. this made me cry like a child. thank you. thank you. truly. i think this advice -- being kind to myself, and grntea's advice about letting go -- i have to do this, or die. you're right. i wish that i had something better to say, or more profound. but you're simply, truly right. thank you, all of you. this 'anonymous nursing forum' has given me exactly what i needed: validation, understanding, and the knowledge that it's okay to move forward at a crawl if that's what is going to get me to the end.

In my final year of my BScN. Been diagnosed with a bunch of stuff within the last year, namely borderline personality, major depression, anorexia nervosa. Finding that I cannot cope anymore. Was a straight A student. Now getting Bs. I know that I'm currently in the middle of a major depressive episode, but the knowledge doesn't make the symptoms easier to bear. My psychiatrist can only offer me SSRIs/SNRIs at this point, which I am not taking because of a horrible experience with SSRI discontinuation syndrome that almost made me drop out last year. My clinical rotation is extremely stressful; combining it with my other courses and my job on the weekends is threatening to rip my brain to tiny little pieces. I dread going to clinical, I feel dissociated and terrified whenever I am there, and my course work is falling apart. I can't concentrate, I can't get motivated; when I have to write my papers, I sit and stare at a blank screen for hours. Insomnia is rampant. I don't know what I'm asking for, here. Maybe some sort of reassurance that things will get better once the stressor of school is out of my life? I'm starting to become really frightened of the the possibility that I should not be a nurse. Not like this. Nursing is about passion, strength, intelligence, and grace. I'm just an exhausted and empty ghost wandering the halls.

Thanks for the reply, and the thoughtful answer. My question to you: What would you tell the daughter if she asked you what was wrong with her?

I've recently encountered a bit of an ethical dilemma at work. For the first time, I had to float on a pediatric oncology ward, and I read in the chart history of one of my patients that the nursing and medical staff had to deal with her parents asking them not to reveal the diagnosis of leukemia to their daughter. How it was resolved was not clear in the notes, and I did not have time to read the entire history. It occurred to me to come on the forum and ask: what would you have done? Here in Canada, the age of a child is until 16. This patient was 9. Putting the logistics of the daughter already being on a cancer ward and surrounded by other children with cancer aside, how would you deal with this request? Obviously, we need to advocate for the daughter, and gently remind the parents that children are very perceptive and generally immediately know when there is something wrong. But if they were adamant? Thank you in advance for any responses.:redbeathe

I have schizoid personality disorder. PD aren't talked about much in nursing, and I believe, in general (and also concluded from having read this entire thread), most of the mental health issues within nursing revolve around mood and anxiety disorders.

As a Canadian citizen, I wish you well on this quest. However, I would caution you to rethink your statement. While politics and religion may not as superimposed as they may be in the States, the connotations and mores of each as a unified concept do exist, and can be significant. As a fellow LGBT nurse, I have experienced this in the Canadian setting. Gender, sexuality, and religion are just as entwined here as they may be in the States; it is for this very reason that I have never come out. I have seen troublesome outcomes occur to my LGBT colleagues after publically stating their orientations; please exercise caution. It doesn't matter what flag flies over your head -- people are people everywhere.

Thank you for all of the replies and insight. Karenmaire, I am sorry to hear about the situation your Irish friends are facing. I have British citizenship by descent, so I am wondering if, because of that status, I would have a bit of an easier time getting work in England. I would be able to bypass the need for a sponsor/work visa. Silverdragon has mentioned that unemployment in the UK is high, so the question now becomes this: Do you think my chances would be hurt by having only Canadian experience? I am currently a LPN/LVN/RPN who is bridging to get my BScN, which I will have in 2012. By that time, I will have had 3 years of LPN experience, and intend to work as a RN for one year before attempting to work in the UK.

Silverdragon, I think that would be a fantastic idea, and would advocate for it. As someone who is newly looking into international nursing, this thread holds a wealth of knowledge that, while incredibly useful, now carries the possible detriment of being outdated. I feel uncertain of which posts to trust, and while I completely understand that the accountability lies with only myself to get the information correct, I extensively use this forum as a springboard to direct my thoughts and queries. As the questions and ideas in this thread become outdated, so do the questions of the new seekers. If it would be possible to put in the title of the thread that it contains valuble pre-2010 information, as well as linking the old thread in the new thread; I think this would help new readers. Thank you so much to all of the contributors of this thread, you have answered many of my questions.

Hello, lovely UK nurses! I've been reading the boards all afternoon, trying to get information about overseas nursing. There have been a lot of threads which have addressed my questions (especially the ones answered by Silverdragon102), but the average dates on the threads have ranged between 2002-2008. So I'm here to ask for an update on the current nursing situation in the UK, specifically in England and Ireland. How is the job environment there? Is it still difficult to find a job as an overseas RGN? Thank you in advance for your comments.

I feel a little saddened by this post. Fiona, I can -- within an intellectual realm only -- understand your frustration with the students/new graduates that you work with. I can imagine their newness, percieved unprepardness, and insecurity must become very old and tiring, fast. It is only through the goodness of the older, more experienced nurses that we can get through an hour, let alone a shift. I owe my (very small) success to nurses like these. Without them, I would be dead in the water, long ago. I can conceptualize that the unexperienced nurses are frustrating to deal with. However, we are truly doing the best we can with what we have. We don't have the years of experience behind us that you do. Often, we don't have the wisdom of thought to think ourselves through tough situations. We need to rely on you to make it work. So when you call us idealistic, you are very right. Because all we have, in the beginning, are our ideas.

thank you for the link to the cna document. i agree with your assessment that the pathway into the different "levels" of nursing will be smoother and easier to implement. it may make the lines less blurred whilst experiencing nursing within an academic setting, which may indeed be my current problem. however, i have many, many questions about the feasibility of this plan. for example, i wonder about the ease of transition and difference in scope of practice for nurse i and nurse ii (option 1 of the nursing education models) in a practical setting. they describe the 2020 lpn as becoming a community-based nurse, and the rn as being primary-care based and as a coordinator of community health. what implications does this bear on the current nursing paradigm? does this mean that lpns working in primary care may lose their jobs within this new construct? and what of the rns working the frontlines in community care? how does the cna plan to incorporate currently practicing nurses into this paradigm? i have to wonder if this microcosms-within-macrocosms nursing philosophy (having a specialized nurse for each type of health care, equaling dozens of nursing "specialists") isn't complicating our profession further and, in fact, narrowing our ability to be holistic healers. regardless, your post made me realize the immaturity of my argument. the cna document has answered many of my questions, but has also opened up many new ones. for the future of the clarity between the lpn and rn roles, i have less fear. the new nursing education models seem to take care of that very well, if they can be properly implemented. so thank you. i appreciate it. you're going to make an excellent nursing student and nurse, by the way. you're already well-versed in intellectual humility and evidence-based practice. :redbeathe

That's why I included LPN.. I hoped that might clarify. I apologise if it didn't!

I know this has probably been discussed a fair amount on this forum, but as a RPN/LPN that is currently bridging to become a RN, I wanted to share my experiences, questions, and conclusions about the inherent differences between the two nursing roles. I completed my RPN program in June 2007, and immediately enrolled into the bridging program at McMaster University in Ontario, Canada in September 2009. I have since completed my first year of university towards my BScN. Before I begin, I would like to note that I have not yet experienced a clinical rotation in the RN role (that begins this year). So the viewpoint that I will be representing is purely from an academic perspective, and not a practical one. I realize that this may be severely impacting upon my bridging experience. It is my belief that there should not be two types of nurses. And when I say this, I do not mean to say that one is better than the other. Upon the contrary, I believe that RPNs and RNs have a similar breadth of knowledge and that there should no longer be a segregation in pay, entitlement or recognition between them. I acknowledge that this may sound like some sort of "RPN paranoia" against RNs, but please be assured that is the farthest thing from the truth. I am not saying RPNs are "better" than RNs, at all. But I am not, as yet, willing to concede that in their base ACADEMIC knowledge, RNs are very much more superior than RPNs. Having gone through one year of RN training in the science-based aspects of the discipline, I can honestly and truthfully say that there wasn't much that I learned this year that went beyond the scope of the RPN. Our physical assessment course was identical to that of the one I took in my RPN program. The anatomy and physiology course was identical, as well. Pathophysiology with a pharmacologic inclusion was a new course that I had not taken, but (and perhaps it was because of the professor and her choice of course planning) I do not feel as though I walked out of the course feeling like I had a superior amount of knowledge prior to the amount that I had walked in with. The course material was very basic, and very rushed. I anticipated that I would be learning common and complex disease states for each system of the body, and how to treat them pharmacologically. However, we focused on basic/common concepts like inflammation and common CV/resp diseases. Pharmacology barely came into it, and I felt very disillusioned. I felt, truly, that I had learned much more in the first year of my RPN program than I had in my first of the RN program. Many of the RPNs that I have worked with have clinical skills that equate that of the RNs. I have been told many times that the only true difference to be found between RNs and RPNs are leadership skills. I am starting to believe this is true. Because although many RNs have superior disease/pharmacology knowledge to RPNs, I believe this only because of exposure. RNs are granted access to more complex and unstable patients, and it is THIS that gives them the superior knowledge. It is, from what I have seen thus far, not because of an inherent difference in their education. It seems to me that there should no longer be two types of nurses. But I don't know what to do with that feeling. Because to suggest that we should remove RPN education seems ridiculous. And doubly so to say that we should remove RN education. But I feel as though this dichotomy is causing a rift in our profession. RPNs get paid almost 40% less than RNs for the same clinical skills. RNs get replaced with RPNs who don't have as much knowledge simply because institutions can pay them less. I don't know what to do, or how to feel. And it hurts and saddens me greatly. I would appreciate any thoughts on this matter. It is deeply appreciated.

It's a RN briding program, for RPNs to achieve a BScN.

Hello! I was wondering if there are any nurses out there who have done/are doing the McMaster 3 year Post RPN program? Not the ones offered through Mowhawk/McMaster or Connestoga/McMaster, but the one offered through McMaster alone? And if so -- how did/do you enjoy it? Was the PBL hard to get used to, or excel at? Thank you!

I'm a RPN student, just entering pre-grad. I've been assigned to a step-down ICU (acute respiratory), and I've been having some serious personal identity and self-doubt issues since the commencement of this placement. I've never been in such an acute setting. And I thought it was what I wanted. I thought I would be up to the task. But the reality is -- I'm not. Not only are all of my patients dying or coming close to it, I screw up on the most basic of things (like, ugh, leaving a side-rail down and leaving the room), and it seems as though these screw ups keep happening. I'm so terrified of doing something wrong that I have to ask clarification from my preceptor all the time, and I can see she is getting annoyed with my constant need for affirmation of the most basic of directives. The nurses keep asking me if I've ever had a placement in a hospital before, which should give you a pretty good understanding of just how idiotic I am. One of my patients has severe hypoxia and shortness of breath secondary to pulmonary fibrosis and dementia. She was satting at 92% on room air during my shift yesterday. I wrote this down on the vitals flow sheet, and left it because I had read in the physician's orders (or so I thought) that she was to be kept between 88% - 92%. Today we got onto the floor, and she was drowsy, completely out of it, and deteriorating quickly. She was on 2L of 02 via nasal prongs, and satting at 96%. My preceptor was very shocked while we were assessing her, and said that it was because I hadn't informed her that the patient was satting "so low" yesterday, and that was why the patient was deteriorating now. I was ready to throw myself out of the window when I heard that -- it made me want to die, to know that it had been my actions that created this downward shift in her condition. Also, my preceptor doesn't like how I perform patient care -- she implies that I am slowing her down. Today I changed two patients who had become incontinent of stool and had leaked all over their bedsheets. I had changed them earlier in the shift, and when my preceptor saw what I'd done, she got very angry and told me that, in an acute setting, there was no time for that to be done twice. If I'd already changed them, and the amount of excrement was livable, I was to leave them sitting in it because there were more important things to be done. This is just a small incidence of the philosphy I have been exposed to on this unit. I feel this isn't what nursing means to me. And I feel like it's time to drop out, get an $8 an hour job, and turn my back on this wretchedness once and for all. I guess I'm just not smart enough to be a nurse.