momoftriplets

a quick question. has anyone considered law school after their nursing? I had been looking into MSN programs, but have always been interested law school. I just want to know if there are many nurse lawyers out there? Thanks.

try posting this in the ED forum, more er nurses would probably look at it.

I posted the article in the ER forum last week, under newsweek article,

I have done ICU and an currently doing ED, so, though there shouldn't be the attitude of "which nurse has the roughest time", this is a forum where ED nurses are here to vent. I am not disagreeing with Richard's post, but as both an ICU and an ED nurse, I have seen both places can be real s****y!!! but PLEASE let us ED nurses have a place where we can complain without being subjected to another poster telling us how politically incorrect we are. Thank you;)

How about the Busy Bee. That's the nurse who goes from task to task without actually getting anything done!!! They are the type that looks like they are working hard, but they can't complete anything. They are so busy doing nothing!!! Our ED has 2 of these types, and I am in constant amazement in how people are so busy at not doing anything:) This is a cute thread...

Here is the column, I hope this works, I have never pasted before, so forgive me if it doesn't. If ER Nurses Crash, Will Patients Follow? I'm so overworked that I go home at night praying I haven't made a mistake that might hurt someone Hazardous conditions: Paul Duke says the ERs he works in have too many patients, not enough staff' By Paul Duke NewsweekFeb. 2 issue - I was sprinting down the hall when a patient waiting to be seen by a doctor asked me for a blanket. She was in her mid-70s, cold, scared and without any family or friends nearby. Did I have time to get her that blanket, or even stop to say a few words to let her know she wasn't alone? No, I didn't. advertisement As an emergency-room nurse, I'm constantly forced to shuffle the needs of the sick and injured. At that particular moment, half of my 12 patients were screaming for pain medication, most of the others needed to be rushed off to tests and one was desperately trying not to die on me. Was that blanket important in the grand scheme of things? Not really. She wasn't going to die without it. So it got tossed on the back burner, along with my compassion. I often find myself hopping from task to task just to keep everyone alive. By the end of the shift I often wonder, did I kill anyone today? I go home tired and beaten down, praying like mad that I didn't make any mistakes that hurt anyone. For five years I have worked in one of the busiest emergency rooms in southeastern Michigan. For the last two I have picked up overtime by working in four other hospitals, including the busiest emergency room in inner-city Detroit. No matter where I am, I experience the same problem--too many patients, not enough staff. When I started emergency-room nursing five years ago, I would typically have four or five patients. I could spend a few minutes chatting with them and answering their questions. Let's face it, when you are in a drafty emergency room in just a flimsy paper gown and your underwear, it is nice to have someone actually talk to you. It's a scary experience to get poked and prodded in various parts of your anatomy. But now on an average day I have 10 to 12 patients. Once I even had 22. On that night I was feeling swamped, so I went to the charge nurse for help. She was as busy as I was, so she told me to take the five sickest patients and keep them alive, and get to the rest when I could. Now, here's a question: do you want to be one of the five sickest who get attention right away, or one of the others who have to wait maybe seven, eight or even 10 hours before someone gets to you? That night I staggered home grateful that nobody had died. But I wondered, do I really want to do this job? I love the emergency room, but I was so damn frustrated. Was it just me? I did an informal survey of the emergency rooms where I work. Every nurse I spoke to said the patient load had at least doubled in the last three years. None of them expected the situation to get better soon. Troubling, but hardly scientific, so I did a little digging for some real statistics. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, from 1997 through 2000 the annual number of emergency-room visits went from 95 million to 108 million, while the number of ERs decreased. So who picked up the slack? The staff at emergency rooms, like mine, that are still standing. The journal Nursing 2003 reports that approximately three out of 10 R.N.s believe their hospital has enough nurses to provide excellent care. Not exactly what you want to hear from the people responsible for your loved ones' health. The future doesn't look any brighter. Studies show that by 2010, 40 percent of all registered nurses will be over 50. That's when most of us are getting ready to cut back our hours or switch from direct patient care to chart review. By 2020 there will be an estimated shortfall of 808,400 nurses, partly because many will have retired or become so dissatisfied that they've quit, but also because fewer people are entering the profession. Yet the number of Americans older than 65 is expected to double from 35 million to 70 million over the next two decades. As someone who knows just how often the elderly visit ERs due to heart attacks, strokes and falls, I see trouble ahead. Don't get me wrong--my colleagues are some of the hardest-working and most professional nurses you will find. But when you're given 20 patients when you should have six, well, you're only so good. After all this you must wonder why I don't quit. The truth is, I love nursing. It's what I am good at. I love the challenge of not knowing what will come crashing through the doors. Emergency-room nurses rise to the occasion. But we are being steamrolled, stretched thin and beaten down, and the best of us are frustrated. At the end of my 18-hour shift I got that little old lady her blanket and spent a few minutes talking to her. She took my hand, smiled and said thank you. I'm frustrated, but I'll be back. Duke lives in Southgate, Mich. © 2004 Newsweek, Inc. MORE FROM COLUMNISTS George F. Will: The Parties' Temptations * My Turn: If ER Nurses Crash, Will Patients Follow?* George F. Will: The Parties' Temptations* Alter: The Doctor's Switch to Decaf* Bryant Quinn: Colleges' New Tuition Crisis* Sloan: A Sudden Disconnect* Zakaria: The One-Note Superpower* Columnists Section Front TOP STORIES * The Really Interesting Oscar Stories * Beware Criminals `Phishing' for Dollars * Is Bush's AIDS Relief Finally on Track? * Q&A: Living on McDonald's Food for a Month * Borowitz: Kim Jung-Il Frightened by Dean * At least 4 killed in Baghdad blast * Kay to testify about WMD hunt * N.E. storm delivers light blow * British probe clears prime minister * Kerry wins New Hampshire CURRENT ISSUE * Chasing Down Insurgents in Iraq * The Soft Sell: Pitching Impotence Drugs * Life off the Court: Serena's Next Game * Steven Levy: Okay, Mac, Make a Wish COLUMNISTS * My Turn: If ER Nurses Crash, Will Patients Follow? * George F. Will: The Parties' Temptations * Alter: The Doctor's Switch to Decaf * Bryant Quinn: Colleges' New Tuition Crisis * Sloan: A Sudden Disconnect * Zakaria: The One-Note Superpower

Has anyone read this weeks newsweek? they have an opinion column each week where someone writes their own letter, this week was about an ER nurse in Michigan talking about the patient load. I thought it was a nice letter to get the public to start thinking and talking about the issue without blaming the nurses. What do you all think??

and I wasn't even going to read this post... I wonder if the nurses who have bad marriages are the ones at work who are the least assertive and aggressive in their job. I married a mamma's boy whose mother did everything for him, but, when we got together he was living by himself and was used to doing things for himself, like laundry, if he wanted clean clothes. We got married and I have been glad that we view our marriage as a true partnership. My husband is glad that he married someone independent and self-sufficient. I often wonder if that is why we have a good marriage, that I don't 'need' him and we both truly respect one another. After we had our triplets, my husband was fully there. I even went back to work one shift a week when the babies were 8 weeks old. I would be interested in looking into if passive nurses have bad marriages or not. I do think that only the people who live in those situations can really know what is going on. Maybe when these people go to nursing school and they are in a supportive environment with goal driven people, that they are able to get out of bad situations. I have met some wonderful fellow nurses in my day, and never a more supportive group. good thoughtful post with this one.

you are assuming he od'd on methadone....lol...I would've given the narcan, standard protocol, and our docs would've done the same thing. Also, our medics would've given the narcan as well. Just this week we had a 30something female found passed out, slurry words. Our new ED doc thought neuro, but we all thought something else (aren't we a suspicious bunch). Turned out her etoh level was 400!!! and she didn't even have the odor about her... She did stay in the hosp for that level.

I think your venting is right on the mark. When I was interested in CRNA school I noticed that they only wanted ICU experience prior to admission. I have ICU experience before I started ER and though it is like comparing apples to oranges, ER is much like critical care. You do get more experience in the ICU in using vasopressors and the like, but in ER, I all too frequently use many drugs to induce conscious sedation. Maybe CRNA schools should not negate all ER experience, but, if that's what they require...

This is one chance to use HIPPA to your advantage. Just say, " Sorry, due to federal guidelines and HIPPA, only 1 visitor, no phone calls, can't give out info, stay in the patients room, no looking at the pt board for your friends names, no more eavesdropping...etc...." I never hesitate to tell people to go to the waiting room, they are violating other patients privacy and such. and I don't ask them, I pleasantly "tell" them.

That's cute. I see a lot of stuff at triage where the patients just need to stop and think first before freaking out. Depending on the facility and the doc, she could've gotten a PE study to rule out emboli, lol...

I'm sorry, but it is amazing to me that most people do not have the common sense to take care of themselves. I just can't imagine someone not knowing at least a little bit about health. It is not that as ER nurses we don't want to take care of sick people, we do, BUT...this is our forum to vent about patients who can't seem to do the simple act of taking tylenol for a fever!!!! I do not want to get lectured about being "politically correct" about keeping in mind the people who do not have a doctor or any insurance. THIS IS NOT WHAT THIS FORUM IS ABOUT!! It is a shame that these patients are not utilizing an urgent care, because that would be the most appropriate place for them. In the past week, I have been called every name in the book when the patient is only prescribed tylenol and motrin and to go home and rest. They will state, "I could've just stayed home if I knew I wouldn't be getting anything for it." I know the media has focused on this flu and have scared a lot of people, but...no nurse wants to hear other peers in the profession that we are being inconsiderate of our patients. This past week at work, I just do my job, take care of my patients, I can only do one thing at a time (believe it or not). Everyone will be seen in my ER, you just might have to wait for 4-5 hours to be told, take motrin and rest. You just try discharging irrate people.. We will get through this flu season, head on into bronchitis and pneumonia season, and the dreaded slip-and fall-on-the-ice-crani season. So, everyone hang in there!!!

an update, I called work and asked what we had in place to protect staff, they are now having the patients wear masks once they hit triage (if they are having any sx). maybe that will help.

our ED is also having an increase in waits to being seen, usually it is around 1 hour, now we are up to 5 hours or so, all the patients are pissed, we are swabbing everyone for the flu and we do have positive's, just had a 13 day old yesterday. The patients then start freaking out and yelling because we don't really prescribe them anything, depending on how long they have had their symptoms, they might not even get the tamilflu. I am telling my patients up front that other than rest and fluids, there isn't anything we can really do for them that being in their own bed can't do. Also, most of our flu is body aches, headache and cough, cold type stuff, very rarely vomiting, what sx are you guys seeing? and no, we aren't using the CDC guidelines for isolation, the staff isn't wearing masks either, sounds like I will be asking these questions before my next shift, take care everyone!!!