DoneMostAll

I too apologize if I took the meaning out if context. This is also a subject I'm very passionate about. I absolutely love nursing, even when it rears its ugliness and I've always wanted to end my career teaching. I don't think there is an easy answer to this problem, as it isn't back and white but instead has a bunch of other muted colors. Schools need to do better, higher only truly qualified instructors - ones that have actual experience and not just obtained their degree. Facilities need to do better by having adequate staff during the times when they know they will have students. They get the schedules ahead of time. Nurses need to do better by eating at home and NOT eating their young once they are at work. Lastly l, students need to do better in realizing they are still, in fact, learning. Just because they've had some experience as a tech, EMT, CNA or whatever - important roles true - but it does not, will not, cannot equate to being the nurse. Thanks for your apology and I hope you accept mine as well. I love good discussions.

IIg, I completely understand where you are coming from and I do agree with what you are saying. I've often wondered why a school would out themselves in that position - hiring an instructor without a knowledge and skills base. I've worked hard to get where I am and I keep up with my skills and certifications and I realize the hospital does not know me from Adam. I do know the concerns are real. I've worked with other instructors that have little to no experience before becoming an instructor and I just literally have to shake my head. Yes, you need an advanced degree to teach but you also need to have worked to gain experience. How can one think they can accurately and appropriately teach if they, themselves, do not have the ability to do what they are requiring from students. I think every nurse needs to work a minimum of, idk 5 years or more, before getting an advanced degree and)or to teach. Just because one graduated and passed the NCLEX, doesn't mean they are a good or bad nurse...it simply means they passed the requirements to work in this field.

JKLL, when I went to nursing school, many, many moons ago and in a different part of the US, all the students went to one, maybe two on rare instances, unit. Our instructor was right there. Or at least, that's how I remember it. We also did more clinical hours. Now, they can get by with one day per week, which to me is not enough. No, I don't agree with CIs being hands off but I've worked hard to develop a relationship with the staff and they do come to me with concerns, which does help to offset the negativity from this type of arrangement.

JKL, actually I wish I could. I say this, not with sarcasm either but because I've been fighting it for two years. I have even called my BoN, as well as BoN in three surrounding states, along with about 10 schools that do their clinical the same way. I have been told by ALL, not one or two or here and there, but ALL that this was the way the BoN requires it and therefore cannot be changed. In regards to the facilities, I've spoken to the educational department heads and they do not want to give CIs access to computers or allow us to "put hands on patients" for liability reasons. To me, it doesn't hold water because we are there for the students, the students are technically supposed to be in my license...not the staff RN, not the hospital, but mine. So...I have NO choice but to do it like they want. That is why I make myself as visible to my students. Yes, I've helped with meds and procedures, but that is also dependent on the staff and facility. Regardless, I'm there to help the students learn and so far, knock on wood, I've a good track record.

Well, you obviously haven't either been following my comments, or had difficulty understanding. Not once did I say it should be the sole responsibility of a staff nurse. Not once did I say a preceptor could not refuse a student, you're correct it happens frequently. Also trust, NOT once did I say I couldn't keep up. What was said is that this isn't just the way the school does it. It is the was the State Board of Nursing REQUIRES it to be done, as well as the facilities. So, unless you know how to change the BoN recommendations and requirements or how to let the facilities know this is not always in their best interest, then you might want to hold up on the negativity. As I said previously, I don't agree with this module and see both pros and cons, but at this point, it is what it is and I have to teach to the best of my ability, with what I am given. To do this, yes I make myself VERY available to students, both during and outside of clinical, I am with them on the units as I round and making sure they are okay, have any questions, need assistance, what have you. I, and may CIs I know, do NOT leave it up to the precepting stuff RNs to do our job. What it seems is you've had some rough experiences and perceive it to b me that way across the board - and all I'm saying is it isn't.

Rionoir, when I was in school, my instructor stayed with the students and did like you described. However, the school I am teaching at now has the instructors on-site, but the students are with a staff nurse. I make rounds every hour or two, help them with procedures as needed, meds, review the patients with them, grade care plans and other clinical assignments. We have a pre and post conference. My students come to me all the time and I'm very interactive with my students. That's the way the state BoN says it has to be done, and it is the way the facilities like it. The students seem to like it and they say they feel more confident andlike they are more included with the staff when it is done this way. I see pros and cons both ways.

Scorio, the bottom line is you seem to have a good attitude about the whole situation. Yes there could be some adjustments made on your part, as well as adjustments made on your preceptor's part. However, as it has been stated, nursing is unfortunately and eat your young profession. I have always hated that term and have really dislike working with some of the nurses that had that mentality. One response was get out of it now while you can, and they don't refer anyone to choose nursing as a career; I can't get on board with that mentality either. If you get into nursing for the right reasons, to help people and to enrich someone else's life, nursing can be very rewarding. I can honestly say with 100% certainty I still like what I do. I truly hope everything works out for you and you get through the semester holding your head high.

When I was in nursing school way back when, it was the same way. All the students were on the same unit under the direction of our instructor. From my understanding, it is under the discretion of the State board of nursing as to how clinicals are done now. I do think that there are less errors, less confusion, and more understanding when it's done the way it was when we both went to school versus this way.

MotoMonkey, I completely agree. Some facilities do not have an actual preceptorship program and just assign students to nurses without ever telling them first. I've often run into nurses that are not looking forward to working with students, merely for that reason and because it does slow down the flow of their work. I truly wish there was some form of communication across the board to help alleviate this, thereby alleviating resent towards students. I have also had my fare share of "know it all students and new grads". These students make it very hard to precept them, without knocking them back a step or two. As I tell students, there is the book world and the real world of doing things. The book world works well for passing the NCLEX, but not as much for actually working with the patients.

I've read the original post and all the comments and I can see both sides. First, if the interactions went verbatim, then the instructor needs to go to preceptors and see if there is an underlying factor. As an instructor, I've noticed nurses will put down "doing great", when that's not necessarily the case. I will be told other things when I ask directly how students are doing. It does a disservice to the students because they think they are doing a great job, when in actually they have area for improvement, and fortunately, now the student may be hearing things correctly. IDK, wasn't there. If the original post was the student's take on the situation, then maybe you do need to look at how your overall body language. It's as I've told my own students, it's not always what you say, but how you say it and the other person's perception. To the poster that said...those that can do and those that cannot teach/coach...yeah okay - most of the instructors I know can do both, myself included and that's what makes us good at what we do. I got into teaching because I got tired of seeing a good bit of students not developing the right skills; not because I couldn't do anything else.