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Unreasonable Risks are not part of the job

Disasters   (1,963 Views | 20 Replies)
by ReflectiveRN ReflectiveRN (New) New Nurse

174 Profile Views; 13 Posts

Read, Reflect, Assess

https://www.nursingworld.org/~4ade15/globalassets/docs/ana/ascec_whitepaper031008final.pdf 

Adapting Standards of Care Under Extreme Conditions

American Nursing Association, 2008

https://www.nursingworld.org/practice-policy/nursing-excellence/official-position-statements/id/risk-and-responsibility-in-providing-nursing-care/

Risk and Responsibility in Providing Nursing Care

American Nursing Association Position Statement, Revised June 2015

When a health system is not prepared and puts healthcare workers at risk due to poor preparation to have PPE equipment available, and a virus's potential for harm is unknown due to his newness...only time will tell after scientific studies have been done. 

Is it a choice to provide nursing care in this setting when you feel unsafe? The second statement mentions nurses have a right to not provide care when faced with a moral dilemma and that is  a moral option whether or not to provide care, vs. moral obligation.  How do you feel about the current situation RNs are dealing with nationwide? 

Thank you for your sharing your thoughts and reading if you have time. Sending prayers to those on the frontlines taking a risk for the welfare of others. I hope we don't lose too many healthcare workers in the US.

I'm not promoting fear - I'm promoting Self-Care and Choice for RN's. Smart nursing, , because we are professionals who agreed to work in safe, prepared settings.

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306 Posts; 5,244 Profile Views

This one is pretty easy - according to ANA, unless you’ve got at least a bachelor’s degree, you’re not a “professional” nurse anyway - so, presumably they should have no problems if the poorly-educated LPN’s and ADN’s retreat to their caves and let the doctor-nurses show us how it’s done.  

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LibraNurse27 has 5 years experience as a BSN, RN and specializes in Community Health, Med/Surg, ICU Stepdown.

220 Posts; 3,240 Profile Views

I would hate to refuse to treat a patient, but if it really came down to it I would not want to care for a patient with covid19 without any PPE. If I got infected I would most likely not get sick as I am young and healthy but I would be quarantined and unable to care for any patients, or die! And I might spread it to others. But I really don’t want to ever have to make that decision. We need PPE now!

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OUxPhys has 4 years experience as a BSN, RN and specializes in Cardiology.

823 Posts; 9,671 Profile Views

I dont think it is wrong or immoral to refuse care if the hospital is not going to provide the proper PPE. Being a RN does not mean your well being does not matter. 

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RN-to- BSN has 6 years experience as a ADN, RN and specializes in SCRN.

218 Posts; 4,820 Profile Views

I think that once report is taken, the nurse has to care for the patient. Sadly, also true even if no appropriate PPE. 

This is why if I am at home, I have no patients, and ignore staffing office when they text: "Help to take care your patients". I have no patients when I'm home.

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CaffeinePOQ4HPRN has 10 years experience as a BSN, LPN, RN.

386 Posts; 10,270 Profile Views

On 3/22/2020 at 10:23 PM, rzyzzy said:

This one is pretty easy - according to ANA, unless you’ve got at least a bachelor’s degree, you’re not a “professional” nurse anyway - so, presumably they should have no problems if the poorly-educated LPN’s and ADN’s retreat to their caves and let the doctor-nurses show us how it’s done.  

Excuse me? LOL

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99 Posts; 311 Profile Views

No, the LPNS AND THE Cnas are gona be the ones taking actual care of the patients. In the room , assisting with bedside care, emptying bedpans  and urinals. 

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5 Followers; 37,429 Posts; 100,474 Profile Views

22 minutes ago, LPN Retired said:

No, the LPNS AND THE Cnas are gona be the ones taking actual care of the patients. In the room , assisting with bedside care, emptying bedpans  and urinals. 

Rzyzzy was being facetious! You don’t really think the degreed “professionals” are going to be rendering actual patient care, even to be instructive to the lower castes do you? 

🤣

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waufah has 13 years experience as a BSN, RN and specializes in ICU,Tele,Interventional Radiology,PACU,Research.

1 Follower; 35 Posts; 1,504 Profile Views

It is sad that in a time of like this we are fighting about our qualifications. If you havent read my post about the Nightingale Pledge, please do.If you are okay going to work without PPE,or you don't feel safe,that is a personal choice not moral/ethical obligation. For others like me who have refused to work in such conditions, I am human being first,and my contract as a nurse is not eternally binding. Some my not agree, but I will wait for the check from Uncle Sam,use my savings,borrow and as last resort apply for unemployment or social welfare for the first time in my life until this passes. You have options,we all do!

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306 Posts; 5,244 Profile Views

2 minutes ago, waufah said:

It is sad that in a time of like this we are fighting about our qualifications. If you havent read my post about the Nightingale Pledge, please do.If you are okay going to work without PPE,or you don't feel safe,that is a personal choice not moral/ethical obligation. For others like me who have refused to work in such conditions, I am human being first,and my contract as a nurse is not eternally binding. Some my not agree, but I will wait for the check from Uncle Sam,use my savings,borrow and as last resort apply for unemployment or social welfare for the first time in my life until this passes. You have options,we all do!

Nothing to fight about here, just pointing out that ANA doesn’t consider me to be a “professional” - they didn’t when I got my LPN certificate, and they still don’t with my ADN.  
 

They are the ones who created the division, not me.  Further, by actively denigrating the abilities of non-BSN nurses, they impaired our ability to find and maintain employment in times that didn’t involve a crisis. 
 

They are the ones touting, quoting and re-quoting the one weakly-supported study saying that those without a bachelor’s degree are “less-safe”, because magic beans.  
 

And now they’re largely the ones in nursing leadership roles, telling us that we don’t need N95’s - thus actively causing the spread of something that looks like it’s going to kill a lot of patients and more than a couple of us.  

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CaffeinePOQ4HPRN has 10 years experience as a BSN, LPN, RN.

386 Posts; 10,270 Profile Views

4 hours ago, rzyzzy said:

Nothing to fight about here, just pointing out that ANA doesn’t consider me to be a “professional” - they didn’t when I got my LPN certificate, and they still don’t with my ADN.  
 

They are the ones who created the division, not me.  Further, by actively denigrating the abilities of non-BSN nurses, they impaired our ability to find and maintain employment in times that didn’t involve a crisis. 
 

They are the ones touting, quoting and re-quoting the one weakly-supported study saying that those without a bachelor’s degree are “less-safe”, because magic beans.  
 

And now they’re largely the ones in nursing leadership roles, telling us that we don’t need N95’s - thus actively causing the spread of something that looks like it’s going to kill a lot of patients and more than a couple of us.  

I started off as a diploma RPN. Currently, I am a BScN-RN, but I still maintain and am very proud of my RPN license. This rank-ism is total ***; it's completely disgusting and unacceptable any any given time, and especially baseless during a bloody pandemic. I currently practise in Ontario, Canada. The professional body here for RPNs is called RNPAO, and they have been repeatedly sending out the call for RPN volunteers to help with COVID-19 efforts; all we're being told is that the RPNs will be deployed to bedside/frontline roles.

The professional body here for RNs is called RNAO; and they've been very clear to their RN constituents about how/where/in what capacity RNs will be used. Presently, RNs who have "answered the call" to volunteer are mostly being used for "virtual healthcare services". READ BETWEEN THOSE LINES🤦‍♀️🤬

Our regulatory college (College of Nurses of Ontario, aka CNO) is remaining silent on this matter. Surprise, surprise.🙄

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Willcont2montr has 9 years experience as a LPN.

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I am an LPN who works from  home and also does prn detox ( think homeless, hep c and hiv, not med compliant)

My mother is an NP getting her doctorate who teaches at a University. 

I have three Master Level aunts 1 in ICU in GA 

One Manages the nephrology department in another hospital 

One last aunt who works outpatient ECT  treatements in NC

I have 2 cousins in in Florida both ER nurses

COUNTLESS RN BSN friends in Boston Hospitals ( where I am ) working the front lines leaking me information not in the news. 

We ALL agree that this not what ANYONE expected when they became a nurse. 

MARTYRDOM was not  on the admission requirements. 

My mother and I are very fortunate BUT we hear first hand the conditions people are working in. My aunts in GA both say they are not telling the reality on the news. 

Half our family shouldnt be wiped out because of a lack of ppe. I would gladly leave my house and go work where needed if guaranteed proper ppe. Like another person said, they are wear WHOLE HAZMAT SUITS SOME PLACES!

The fireman example has been used many many times. I agree. Those firemen also  lifted one another up during 911 too something that I'm not sure nursing will be able to say after this. 

Lastly, 

This will probably be my one and only comment on here because it seems the toxic nursing culture thrives in this forum and its embarrassing. 

I'm not sure if some nurses just dont have family, kids a spouse or just dont care about others but to tell nurses who are fighting the front lines to basically "quit whining" is exactly why we are in this situation. 

You can say whatever you want. But my WHOLE family has agreed. If they are not peoperly protected they will have to walk away. That is a lot of knowledge leaving nursing but when you understand that they have people at home that love them theres just not choice. 

THE IDEA THAT NURSES ARE SUPERHUMAN AND WEAR CAPES INSTEAD OF PPE NEEDS TO BE DESTROYED. 

BULLYING NURSES TO DO DISREGARD THEIR OWN WELLBEING NEEDS TO BE DESTROYED. 

Some of you "caring at all cost self sacrifing hero angel nurses" are exactly the reason people choose not to work the bedside. 

Yes we are in a pandemic but cant you see people that tell you that you will be fine are never the ones standing next with no protection? They are writing you a letter from their home? 

Its so funny how a career can boast care but treats its collegues with distain when they try to care for themselves. Calling nurses out of retirement is an example of that. Arent those the people we are protecting? These nurses better be doing telephone triage! 

Again these forums have disgusted me with their attitudes but "I'm just an LPN" I'm sure youll say to LOL 

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