The use of such rhetoric, opponents of the new laws argue, underscores a nationwide push by conservatives to make education a political wedge issue by equating certain teaching materials and educators with Mediaography and even pedophilia. This latest trend is another volley in the country’s ongoing culture wars, during which conservative lawmakers also have opposed the teaching of “critical race theory” and proposed bills requiring schools to post all course materials online so parents can review them.
I think this is just another example of conservative Americans getting agitated by right wing rhetoric and propaganda.
Here's a video compilation and represention of how emotional and aggressive these agitated people are.
Here is a list of books under fire from conservatives. Does anyone know of any other compilation of those titles?
Thanks for helping WW out. He seems to want to make claims and accusations without offering any actual evidence or facts. He has yet to provide one example of that which he accused me of ignoring.
The reality is that there aren't liberal parents or community members loudly protesting at school board meetings to have literature removed from schools, regardless of how WW feels about it. He seems to want to conflate any loud protest with the nonsense forwarded by angry conservatives at school board meetings... some protests are founded in ugly facts while others are just founded in agitated animus. For instance...millions loudly protested a policing system that slowly murdered an unarmed black man, on the street in the full view of onlookers... ugly facts. The next January thousands loudly protested beliefs based upon a lie about election fraud and attacked our Capitolin an attempt to stop the transfer of power. Now we're talking about similarly agitated conservatives at school board meetings also loudly animated by lies and/or misrepresentations... this time about books.
WW ought to be able to back up his claims that I'm ignoring something by providing evidence of that something that he insists that I'm ignoring. Where are the loud and angry liberals demanding something from school board members? I suggest that WW is making a false equivalence.
Fair enough. He made a statement and you asked for examples and WW chose to give a reason why they weren't going to give you examples and that is kind of lame.
Usually though when things get heated at these meetings isn't it liberals and conservatives going back and forth with each other? Or is it just conservatives making noise. I don't really know.
Banning books is different than not wanting certain types of book being readily available to children.
Banning books from the school library isn't the same as the banning/book burning in history. I think you know this but choose to use such terminology purposely to inflate the parents requests and to associate them with that terrible act in history.
Are you serous? I'm trying to "erase an entire people's history"? You can't be serious with that comment.
Wow, you really are transparent in your attempt to avoid answering a question. I want you to list books with graphic sexual content in an elementary or middle school library. Show me.
Usually though when things get heated at these meetings isn't it liberals and conservatives going back and forth with each other? Or is it just conservatives making noise. I don't really know.
Thank you for bringing this out. Unfortunately, as long as what is being presented are edited clips we won't know.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
2 hours ago, Tweety said:
Fair enough. He made a statement and you asked for examples and WW chose to give a reason why they weren't going to give you examples and that is kind of lame.
Usually though when things get heated at these meetings isn't it liberals and conservatives going back and forth with each other? Or is it just conservatives making noise. I don't really know.
Are you asking if liberals shout back when conservatives shout out their opposition to what liberals are saying? Everyone makes noise but the conservative noise around books is founded in irrational fears and feelings rather than facts or evidence.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
25 minutes ago, chare said:
Thank you for bringing this out. Unfortunately, as long as what is being presented are edited clips we won't know.
Only one side of the discussion has brought any video clips of evidence of any kind... the opposing viewpoint seems to be based based upon feelings, fears and beliefs...but supporting documentation could be offered. Can you find any recent reporting of liberal parents disrupting school board meetings because of their grievances about books or "grooming" of children? In 2020 and 2021 was it angry liberal parents shouting their opposition to masks and vaccines in school board meetings?
Please feel free to show me other evidence that this is a "both sides" phenomenon.
Only one side of the discussion has brought any video clips of evidence of any kind... the opposing viewpoint seems to be based based upon feelings, fears and beliefs...but supporting documentation could be offered. ...
[...]
No, I'm not going to. I believe you posted video regarding this, and if memory serves me it was an edited video from The Young Turks; hardly a non-biased source. This highlights my post that, absent unedited video, it is difficult to make an informed decision.
23 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
... Can you find any recent reporting of liberal parents disrupting school board meetings because of their grievances about books or "grooming" of children? In 2020 and 2021 was it angry liberal parents shouting their opposition to masks and vaccines in school board meetings?
Please feel free to show me other evidence that this is a "both sides" phenomenon.
No, I won't. My comment regarded heavily edited video and the ability to make an informed decision. Would you be so kind as to explain how you came to this?
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
26 minutes ago, chare said:
No, I'm not going to. I believe you posted video regarding this, and if memory serves me it was an edited video from The Young Turks; hardly a non-biased source. This highlights my post that, absent unedited video, it is difficult to make an informed decision.
No, I won't. My comment regarded heavily edited video and the ability to make an informed decision. Would you be so kind as to explain how you came to this?
Yep... it was a TYT video... I never made claims about bias and you are free to offer up video or reporting which shows the video in question to be falsely depicting the events. Do you know anyone who was in that Dearborn school board meeting? I do. My informed decision is supported by the video but the video didn't serve to inform my opinion... it simply provides visual evidence to support my point.
You are engaging in suggesting that there is evidence somewhere that this disruptive, angry and agitated behavior demonstrated by conservative community members at school board meetings occurs equally across the political spectrum. You are suggesting that somehow or somewhere there is equity in that angry behavior, right? Isn't that why you celebrated the notion that maybe liberals somewhere were also engaging in agitated presentations to school boards requesting that books be restricted? Show me some evidence to support that belief.
I get that you don't like TYT... that shouldn't prevent you from providing something that gives credence to your beliefs about liberals disrupting school board meetings.
Are you asking if liberals shout back when conservatives shout out their opposition to what liberals are saying? Everyone makes noise but the conservative noise around books is founded in irrational fears and feelings rather than facts or evidence.
I was asking, not presuming because I said "I don't know". What I do know is that based on the video you provided both liberals and conservatives are present. From what I know from being in protests myself, queer people in particular, don't always take being yelled at quietly.
I think the problem is rock meets a hard place in some cases. A book that exposes children to a transexual for example is blasphemy to someone that thinks there are only two genders and transwoman is a man in a dress.
Ypu can't have a discussion unless you are going to bring something to the discussion besides your fears and thoughts and beliefs. Having an earnest discussion also involves facts and evidence but you don't seem to have any.
No, there is not a liberal balance to the conservative anger, animus and agitation about books in schools... you are imagining that there is a liberal contigent of anger that matches that of conservatives.
Nope...not going to start yet another thread so that you can express your fact free feelings and beliefs and pretend like you don't know what evidence is. Instead you can present some evidence to support your "both sides" claims right here in this thread since you've accused me of ignoring the evidence that you have carefully avoided providing.
Yeah...Trump tells conservatives attending his rallies that he and they are all victims. Do you ignore what Trump says? If you really want to have a discussion bring facts to the table rather than BS accusations and whining about perceived insults.
Okay then. No, I do not ignore anything. Yes. Conservatives are evil and liberals are as pure as the driven snow. Nothing they do is as bad as conservatives. You really should start another thread dedicated to bad conservative behavior, I think you'll enjoy it!
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
2 minutes ago, Weetywill said:
Okay then. No, I do not ignore anything. Yes. Conservatives are evil and liberals are as pure as the driven snow. Nothing they do is as bad as conservatives. You really should start another thread dedicated to bad conservative behavior, I think you'll enjoy it!
Use of hyperbole isn't really a good way to have a discussion and get taken seriously. Start your own stupid thread, you are the one that seems to want to make those kind of overly broad statements. You "think" quite a few things that don't appear to have basis in facts or evidence... what you think about me, however, isn't a topic for discussion or relevant in any way.
Please feel free to show me other evidence that this is a "both sides" phenomenon.
I think I will agree with you on this point. For the topic of banning books in school it does seem to be driven by conservative concerns. It's not a "both sides" phenomenon although both sides are showing up at meetings, and perhaps both sides are behaving badly there.
Quote
Book bans accelerated across the United States during the 2021-2022 school year, largely because of advocacy groups that called on public schools to remove more than 1,600 titles, the writers' group PEN America said on Monday.
There were 2,532 separate book bans affecting 1,648 titles at 5,000 schools with 4 million students, according to the report. The research found 1,000 more book bans than were documented in the group's initial April report.
PEN America said the rapid rise came as a growing number of groups have targeted books largely dealing with race or LGBTQ issues. The report identified at least 50 groups pushing for book bans, the vast majority of which have formed since 2021.
I was asking, not presuming because I said "I don't know". What I do know is that based on the video you provided both liberals and conservatives are present. From what I know from being in protests myself, queer people in particular, don't always take being yelled at quietly.
I think the problem is rock meets a hard place in some cases. A book that exposes children to a transexual for example is blasphemy to someone that thinks there are only two genders and transwoman is a man in a dress.
Yes. This is why we discuss and collaborate. We had LGBTQ people at a school meeting where my children go. It wasn't a committee meeting but a meeting we all agreed to attend.
There were no accusations of grooming or hemophilia and we were all able to communicate successfully. Some of the "Bible thumpers" for lack of a better word, were able to hear directly from the LBGTQ people that were there. At the end of the meeting, the "Bible thumpers" walked away with a better understanding of what the LGBTQ community really is. Not the hyper inflamed crap you see in media. Likewise, the LGBTQ people walked away understanding that it's possible for people to have certain beliefs and be respectful at the same time. It went really well. We now have a coffee meeting x2 per month. Religious people and LGBTQ people. We have made friends because we saw eachother as human beings, not political opponents.
Tweety, BSN, RN
36,359 Posts
Fair enough. He made a statement and you asked for examples and WW chose to give a reason why they weren't going to give you examples and that is kind of lame.
Usually though when things get heated at these meetings isn't it liberals and conservatives going back and forth with each other? Or is it just conservatives making noise. I don't really know.