Staffs full, nurses struggle for work - page 7

The media seems to be catching on... When Katharine Barron enrolled in Boston College's school of nursing in 2005, everyone - family, friends, college officials - assured her hospitals would be... Read More

  1. by   mattsgirl
    :icon_roll
    Quote from Kabin
    I can't imagine anyone growing $100k in debt for a BSN. That's financially irresponsible and shows a lack of common sense. Maybe a sign of a nursing education/employment bubble.
    Well, kabin. Nice way to judge. I go to a private college, which is about $40,000 per year. I don't consider myself a person that lacks common sense. If I did, I doubt I would have gotten into nursing school. For me, my education is an investment. People blow that kind of money on houses and cars, and credit cards. After graduation, I plan to participate in programs that will help me pay off my debt. Since I am getting a masters degree, my education is expensive. Hey, I'm glad for all the students that got around paying the big bucks for school; I wasn't so lucky.
  2. by   83studentnurse
    I live in northern NJ, where there hasn't been a nursing shortage in years (even before the recession hit many new grads couldn't find jobs). And yet, nursing as a whole is doing much better than other professions -- think of auto workers, construction employees, bankers, architects, etc. (my husband is an architect and a LARGE percentage of his profession -- more than 15% -- has lost their jobs already. Image what the job market is like for new architecture grads!). Also, those of us graduating now chose this profession before the recession hit. It's bad timing, but we -- and our families, friends and schools -- had no idea we'd be graduating into this job market.

    I think a lot of private school undergrad degrees aren't worth their cost, but for years, it's been drilled into many people's minds that spending any amount of money on the best education possible is a great investment in your future. Some people are questioning that today (wisely, I believe, since I don't think a private school education is usually 3 times as good as a public university education even though it costs 3 times as much), but that's been the prevailing wisdom for years.
    Students come out of college with $100,000+ in debt and a B.A. in psychology, biology, English, etc. which prepares them to do what? Most people who get liberal arts undergrad degrees enter fields where they make about $25-30,000 a year, starting salary. Nursing looks pretty good compared to that, right? Overall, though, I think the cost of education is outrageous -- it's been going up at several times the rate inflation, which is unsustainable.

    Thankfully, the market is always cyclical. It will come back, jobs will be plentiful again and I think we'll at least see that nursing fares better than many professions overall.
  3. by   nminodob
    I also went to a private university that cost around 35K a year. You have to figure into that cost the fact that you will probably receive some scholarships, since to get into an expensive private school you have to have a competitive GPA, which means you already know how to study, take tests, and write a good paper. A good 20-25% of the students in my classes were getting straight As, so I know they qualified for at least SOME kind of scholarships. After 3 years, my loans were more like 50K, and although this cannot compare with the jc school's cost, it is a trade-off because you come out of it equipped for a job and a shot at an advanced degree, should you decide to go that route. Some of the RNs I have worked with that only had 2-year degrees decided they wanted further education, and had to take all the BSN classes one or two at a time - a lengthy and arduous task while working full time. So there are two sides to the story.
  4. by   Smitty08
    Quote from mattsgirl
    I can't believe some of the comments I am reading. I am one of "those" students with over $100,000 in debt and 2 more years to go until I get my DNP. No, I do not think it's a waste of money, nor do I appreciate the comments that my BSN/DNP education isn't worth the money. Oh, so only an MD is worth that amount of money? Um, no.
    Seattle has a nursing shortage. There are tons of jobs. I actually just turned down a job. And for the record, I didn't see some ad on yahoo that promised good wages/jobs if you become a nurse. I have been working on my degree since 2004, and have 8 years homecare experience as a CNA.
    Please stop stereotyping everyone!:angryfire

    I agree there are tons of jobs at the NP level (I'm a DNP student also) Nursing is so diverse and I think with the short term economic climate, the job seekers that are getting klunked are the new grads out of school, for reasons everyone has mentioned: partners losing jobs necessitating one's re-entry to the work force, nurses needing to keep working as their savings has been wiped out and etc...If you went into nursing and want to be here, you WILL find a job and move along in your career. This cycle repeats, have hope and forebearance, and best of luck to you...
  5. by   stephenfnielsen
    I CHOSE to go to a CC for economical reasons. Books and tuition for my program will total about $10,000. The hospital that I'm going to be working for has a $5,000 ADN loan repayment plan. Since my program took 3 years instead of 4 I will have an extra year of work ($33hr X 40hr a week X 52=~$68,000).

    I plan on doing a part-time BSN program while I work and finish it in two years. The cost of this program is ~$10,000; which will be offset by tuition reimbursements and loan repayments from the hospital.

    So if my friend went to a school that was going to cost him $100,000 and I follow through with my plan- five years from starting school we will have the same degree, I will just have $150,000 more than him.
  6. by   subee
    Quote from nminodob
    I also went to a private university that cost around 35K a year. You have to figure into that cost the fact that you will probably receive some scholarships, since to get into an expensive private school you have to have a competitive GPA, which means you already know how to study, take tests, and write a good paper. A good 20-25% of the students in my classes were getting straight As, so I know they qualified for at least SOME kind of scholarships. After 3 years, my loans were more like 50K, and although this cannot compare with the jc school's cost, it is a trade-off because you come out of it equipped for a job and a shot at an advanced degree, should you decide to go that route. Some of the RNs I have worked with that only had 2-year degrees decided they wanted further education, and had to take all the BSN classes one or two at a time - a lengthy and arduous task while working full time. So there are two sides to the story.

    Some of these posts are kinda scary. Imagine - paying so much money for an EDUCATION! I am so grateful to have had an extensive liberal education - its much more than a commodity that I simply bought. Its a big part of who I am. Yes, there is a place for technical nursing and technical thinking. But don't insinuate that I'm stupid because I paid more money than you for my education. It has allowed me a long and interesting profession in advanced practice nursing. Maybe my starting salary was the same as someone who spent two years in a cc. But I assure you that after 40 years I have enjoyed a comfortable life - without overtime.
  7. by   stephenfnielsen
    The way I look at it, I will receive the same education as you in the long run, I will have just payed a lot less...right?
  8. by   JStyles1
    wow! 100k in student loans for what i assume to be a BSN. Too bad she didnt take a class in logic and mathematics along the way b/c that was really a dumb move
  9. by   dec2008houRNgrad
    Quote from nminodob
    Everytime I read something like this I remind myself how lucky I am to have got a job 4 months out of nursing school. True, it is on nights and I am scared I won't hack the hours - but it is a job nonetheless. And I just received an email saying my student loans are coming due in July (considerable debt - I had to go to private university because jc's were filled and on a lottery system, and at my age, waiting 2 years to get into a 2 year ADN program without getting in made my 4 year BSN add up to the 7 longest years [with pre-reqs] of my life!)

    What I found the worst part of being unable to find work was the constant explaining to people (many of them seasoned nurses) that yes, there are some jobs, but no they will not hire new grads. I have heard it all -"You are not being proactive enough" (as if barging into a busy med/surg floor to try and make a "good impression" with a cold call to someone you already know isn't hiring makes any kind of sense whatsoever); being told to "think out of the box" (presumably, the lack of jobs is directly tied to my faulty linear thinking process); the endless advice to "Go into home health" (when these organizations require a nurse to act independently and are the LAST to take a chance on a new grad); and also to "Just go where the jobs are" (they usually say that they heard there are jobs in [fill in the blank] and why don't I just pick up and leave friends/family and trot off to a place where I will have no support system whatsoever to start a challenging new career - yeah, that's a recipe for success!)

    Obviously, I feel for those of us who went into nursing on the cusp of a depression. We are facing challenges that others who were sucked right out of nursing school before their final exams never faced. All I kept telling myself was to have faith in whatever you conceive your Higher Power to be - "this too shall pass"...and we have the rest of our lives to practice our profession.
    Good luck to each and every one of you out there going through this!
    Wow, I thought I was the only recent grad having a hard time finding a position at a hospital. I am a recent ADN grad in the Hou. area and waited to search for work after I passed my NCLEX. I passed w/ only 75?'s (Not sure why I was so worried :0), and I am still searching (4months later)! I finally got my 2nd interview (1st one was cancelled b/c the hosp. had no more positions avail.) for a position at a hosp. about 45 mi. away from my home, and as much as I don't want to travel that distance, I am at my wits end and willing take the job if I get the offer. This is crazy!
  10. by   Kabin
    Quote from mattsgirl
    :icon_roll
    Well, kabin. Nice way to judge. I go to a private college, which is about $40,000 per year. I don't consider myself a person that lacks common sense. If I did, I doubt I would have gotten into nursing school. For me, my education is an investment. People blow that kind of money on houses and cars, and credit cards. After graduation, I plan to participate in programs that will help me pay off my debt. Since I am getting a masters degree, my education is expensive. Hey, I'm glad for all the students that got around paying the big bucks for school; I wasn't so lucky.

    Education is an investment but not all investments are good especially when it sets one back to levels close to med school. We all have choices and some don't make the best. I'd bet most would agree $100k for an entry level nursing degree is a an extremely poor idea. Sorry I hit a nerve with you.
  11. by   mattsgirl
    Quote from Pineapple devil
    wow! 100k in student loans for what i assume to be a BSN. Too bad she didnt take a class in logic and mathematics along the way b/c that was really a dumb move
    That is REALLY insulting.
    By the way- I live in a city that has almost ZERO options for nursing school.
    When I started my nursing degree, I already had a (worthless) AA. My end goal is to have an MSN. To get that, I need to apply to a 4 year university. Having cleared that up, the "inexpensive" school, at $8,000 per year, was turning away almost 300 nursing applicants, with only 40 spaces available. Try a wait list of 2 years to boot. the only other options for me were PRIVATE, expensive colleges . Like I said- I think my education is an investment. My opinion differs from yours. Why do I have to be insulted for spending more money? It's not like I enjoy being in the financial hole for a degree that I know will make my life enriched and easier in the long run. Seems to me that *some* people on this thread make some assumptions and are on their high horse since they went to community college. Hey, I could turn around and say that a 2 year RN degree isn't worth your time or money- but I won't because I know better. I also want to add that 2 year cc programs here aren't that great- I know because I sat on the ethics committee for one and I was horrified at what I heard. The grass isn't always greener.
  12. by   mattsgirl
    Quote from Kabin
    Education is an investment but not all investments are good especially when it sets one back to levels close to med school. We all have choices and some don't make the best. I'd bet most would agree $100k for an entry level nursing degree is a an extremely poor idea. Sorry I hit a nerve with you.
    I just don't agree. There are many ways to help eliminate the debt of nursing school, and I will be taking advantage of those. What I also find insulting is that several people on this thread are insinuating that I am stupid/irresponsible/fiscally challanged because I chose to go to a private college.
    Do you judge your patients the same way when someone comes in as an obese smoker that has CHF? Oh, those people, if they just did the responsible thing like I do...
    Just try walking in someone elses shoes before you judge another persons motivations.
    (I am not speaking to you personally, kabin)
  13. by   Kabin
    Quote from mattsgirl
    I just don't agree. There are many ways to help eliminate the debt of nursing school, and I will be taking advantage of those. What I also find insulting is that several people on this thread are insinuating that I am stupid/irresponsible/fiscally challanged because I chose to go to a private college.
    Do you judge your patients the same way when someone comes in as an obese smoker that has CHF? Oh, those people, if they just did the responsible thing like I do...
    Just try walking in someone elses shoes before you judge another persons motivations.
    (I am not speaking to you personally, kabin)

    Why are you so defensive? I say good for you to have acknowledged your mistake and to already have a plan to correct your problem. But let's not muddy the waters so others make the same mistakes. These forums aren't all about you.

    The bottom line here - it's one thing to seek a bsn from a private school if you have a scholarship or your parents can afford it but anything else makes little sense. I have two bachelor degrees and one master degree and never accumulated debt.

close