I want to know what nurses think about socialized medicine. - page 9

I'm doing a report on Socialized medicine and dont know much about how people feel about it as I live in Idaho.What are any of you Canadian nurses feelings about it? Good or Bad?... Read More

  1. by   c_beshore_rn
    i stole this from another thread. i wrote it and i think it applies here too.

    registered user
    age: 33
    years exp: 10 as lpn 3 as rn
    nursing specialty: psych, ltc, m/s, supervisor, mrdd,
    received 59 kudos from 26 posts
    join date: may 2009
    posts: 60 jun 24, 2009, 09:59 pm

    re: obama's health plan takes shape
    i think what president obama wants to do is make healthcare accessible to all americans. this means: everyone! rich, poor, middle-class, etc. most of the poverty stricken americans have better access to healthcare then us hard workin middle class folks. most of the people living below the poverty level in the usa can access healthcare and their are programs to help them like medicaid. larger citied have non-profit organizations that help them get meds, free clinic visits, etc. these people your so afraid of supporting are already being supported by you, me, and all other tax payers....that will not change! what the prez is trying to do is cover the rest of us. the healthy wealthy person is already set up, the poor medicaid recipient is already set up....what he's trying to do is fill in the gaps!!!

    newsflash:

    you can live a healthy lifestyle, work hard everyday for your family and their health insurance, and still be left without insurance if you were unable to work due to disability from accident of disease!!

    example: you can be the epitome of physical health...get in an accident and boom!!!---your unable to work due to a fx pelvis, head injury, c-spine fx with paralysis...whatever, you get the point...lets say you exhaust all your fmla, short-term disability, etc and you have to cobra out on your insurance through your former employer at about... 1,000/month(much cheaper now since obama agreed to pay 60%, but still expensive!). you have to do this because all your injuries are "pre-existing" so u dare not lose the insurance you have!!! your short-term disability is running out, your depleting your savings account, etc.

    due to the loss of your job and $175,000/yr salary, you get behind on mortgage, car, blah, blah, blah. you've exhausted savings and are now faced with losing your cobra because it'll only cover you for 1-2 years and you still need 2 more operations and extensive pt before your able to return to work, if you ever do return to work. so there you are!!! unable to work, unable to get better, losing your assets, exhausting all options!!! wouldn't it have been nice to have a health insurance plan that wouldn't have demanded all your savings and covered you with your big salary or without????? now, after all this you will probably qualify for medicaid.....does this make you a "leech on society" or another victim of our flawed healthcare system???
  2. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from c_beshore_rn
    i stole this from another thread. i wrote it and i think it applies here too.

    registered user
    age: 33
    years exp: 10 as lpn 3 as rn
    nursing specialty: psych, ltc, m/s, supervisor, mrdd,
    received 59 kudos from 26 posts
    join date: may 2009
    posts: 60 jun 24, 2009, 09:59 pm

    re: obama's health plan takes shape
    i think what president obama wants to do is make healthcare accessible to all americans. this means: everyone! rich, poor, middle-class, etc. most of the poverty stricken americans have better access to healthcare then us hard workin middle class folks. most of the people living below the poverty level in the usa can access healthcare and their are programs to help them like medicaid. larger citied have non-profit organizations that help them get meds, free clinic visits, etc. these people your so afraid of supporting are already being supported by you, me, and all other tax payers....that will not change! what the prez is trying to do is cover the rest of us. the healthy wealthy person is already set up, the poor medicaid recipient is already set up....what he's trying to do is fill in the gaps!!!

    newsflash:

    you can live a healthy lifestyle, work hard everyday for your family and their health insurance, and still be left without insurance if you were unable to work due to disability from accident of disease!!

    example: you can be the epitome of physical health...get in an accident and boom!!!---your unable to work due to a fx pelvis, head injury, c-spine fx with paralysis...whatever, you get the point...lets say you exhaust all your fmla, short-term disability, etc and you have to cobra out on your insurance through your former employer at about... 1,000/month(much cheaper now since obama agreed to pay 60%, but still expensive!). you have to do this because all your injuries are "pre-existing" so u dare not lose the insurance you have!!! your short-term disability is running out, your depleting your savings account, etc.

    due to the loss of your job and $175,000/yr salary, you get behind on mortgage, car, blah, blah, blah. you've exhausted savings and are now faced with losing your cobra because it'll only cover you for 1-2 years and you still need 2 more operations and extensive pt before your able to return to work, if you ever do return to work. so there you are!!! unable to work, unable to get better, losing your assets, exhausting all options!!! wouldn't it have been nice to have a health insurance plan that wouldn't have demanded all your savings and covered you with your big salary or without????? now, after all this you will probably qualify for medicaid.....does this make you a "leech on society" or another victim of our flawed healthcare system???


    no one is saying there are not problems. what we are saying is that we think having the government in charge will make things worse. we are disagreeing on the solutions.

    my husband is a private contractor with metabolic syndrome. i'm a rn to bsn student and work part-time in hospice. we have no medical insurance right now. we paid cobra for awhile but it got too costly.

    i agree there are problems - but i don't agree that obama's plan with solve them.

    steph
  3. by   nicurn001
    Quote from Spidey's mom
    No one is saying there are not problems. What we are saying is that we think having the government in charge will make things worse. We are disagreeing on the solutions.

    My husband is a private contractor with Metabolic Syndrome. I'm a RN to BSN student and work part-time in Hospice. We have no medical insurance right now. We paid COBRA for awhile but it got too costly.

    I agree there are problems - but I don't agree that Obama's plan with solve them.

    steph
    I'll take the approach , of the anti UHC crowd .

    Shock , Horror , you are not providing health insurance for yourselves because you have other priorities for where your income goes .So when one of the possible complications of Metabolic Syndrome strikes , makes a visit to the ER unavoidable , you expect us to pick up the tab for your poor choice , NO WAY ,no how !!!.Also don't expect any help from us , if you try to meet , your financial obligations and go bankrupt .

    I on the other hand realise that even those of us who have health insurance , who take good care of ourselves , in the present system are often one major health crisis away from bankrupcy .This present system will not only bankrupt the individual , but it will also bankrupt industry and eventually the country .

    So it would be nice if people who agree there is a problem , come up with a new viable solution , rather than write off a system ,UHC , which although it has some detractors in the countries it is used in ( never possible to please everyone ), but given the choice of using their UHC or US financing system of healthcare , show at least through opinion polls in their countries they will stick to UHC.
  4. by   HM2VikingRN
    I think that I would trust the work of the Commonwealth Fund for accurate information about UHC over the work of John Stossel.
    Last edit by HM2VikingRN on Jun 27, '09
  5. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from nicurn001
    I'll take the approach , of the anti UHC crowd .

    Shock , Horror , you are not providing health insurance for yourselves because you have other priorities for where your income goes .So when one of the possible complications of Metabolic Syndrome strikes , makes a visit to the ER unavoidable , you expect us to pick up the tab for your poor choice , NO WAY ,no how !!!.Also don't expect any help from us , if you try to meet , your financial obligations and go bankrupt .

    I on the other hand realise that even those of us who have health insurance , who take good care of ourselves , in the present system are often one major health crisis away from bankrupcy .This present system will not only bankrupt the individual , but it will also bankrupt industry and eventually the country .

    So it would be nice if people who agree there is a problem , come up with a new viable solution , rather than write off a system ,UHC , which although it has some detractors in the countries it is used in ( never possible to please everyone ), but given the choice of using their UHC or US financing system of healthcare , show at least through opinion polls in their countries they will stick to UHC.

    There are many viable solutions to this problem. So interesting that my econ class is studying this issue right now and we all have a huge paper due in two weeks about some aspect. And next week's paper is compare/contrast Michael Moore's Sicko with John Stossel's "Sick in America".

    I would NEVER ask y'all to pay for our health care. Right now my husband is taking good care of himself. But he also works at a very dangerous job. And a good friend of his from high school just lost her sister yesterday to a brain aneurysm so you just never know. If something happens to someone in our family, we have assets we can sell. But I'd never go on welfare (we'd never qualify). So you don't have to worry about picking up the tab.

    I read the article and in fact I think I posted it here by Atul Gawande . . .I did disagree with the same point John does:



    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/art...too_96917.html


    steph
  6. by   leslie :-D
    Quote from HM2Viking
    I think that I would trust the work of the Commonwealth Fund for accurate information about UHC over the work of John Stossel.
    well, well, well....
    very interesting about mr. stossel, viking.
    pffffffft.

    leslie
  7. by   Spidey's mom
    I watched it during class and just pulled out my notes "David Gratzer" and "The Cure" and I came home after class and looked him up and found out he was a conservative, just exactly as he came across on the interview. Wow, big whoop. Are conservatives not allowed to have opinions? John didn't hide anything.

    Also, another woman he interviewed started "The Galen Institute" which was also in my notes and I went online and checked it out and it also has conservative ideas.

    http://www.galen.org/

    I also posted both these authors websites days ago on one of these socialized med threads.

    It is not a secret where they are coming from.

    Michael interviews people who are liberal . . . . John is rebutting him with conservative or libertarian thought.

    As to WHO . . . .we learned in class that each country has different ways they interpret information and that is why the US doesn't stack up well in some areas because other countries leave things out or skew it. Like infant mortality.

    Just an example we learned in class is that other countries don't try to save as many premies as we do. We count those babies. Other countries don't. In Cuba, if a baby dies within a few hours of being born, they don't count that baby as a live birth. There is NO universal standard way all countries share for counting infant mortality. Our professor showed that we are really 10th - not 29th . . and some of the reasons are we have a huge market for infertility and multiple births here in America and it is not that big elsewhere.

    My stats prof taught us to look with a jaundiced eye and research stats.

    step
  8. by   leslie :-D
    Quote from leslie :-D
    well, well, well....
    very interesting about mr. stossel, viking.
    pffffffft.

    leslie
    you know viking, this really bothers me about j. stossel.
    i have always liked him and now, feel totally deluded.
    i found another piece by mediamatters, that speaks to stossel's distorted and misleading views on public schools.
    this is just so unacceptable on many levels, but mostly because he has received awards for his journalism...
    and now, to find out that what he reports on, is slanted to reflect his ideals.

    *sigh*...whatever.
    sorry to go off topic.

    leslie
  9. by   HM2VikingRN
    Equating access to effective and affordable health care as welfare just doesn't connect logically.

    Insurance by definition is a social product. We collectively pay into a risk pool to cover the risks that we cannot afford to absorb as individuals.
  10. by   HM2VikingRN
    Quote from leslie :-D
    you know viking, this really bothers me about j. stossel.
    i have always liked him and now, feel totally deluded.
    i found another piece by mediamatters, that speaks to stossel's distorted and misleading views on public schools.
    this is just so unacceptable on many levels, but mostly because he has received awards for his journalism...
    and now, to find out that what he reports on, is slanted to reflect his ideals.

    *sigh*...whatever.
    sorry to go off topic.

    leslie
    I think the lesson is that we have to be willing as individuals to evaluate data and evidence as we seek the path to better practices for ourselves and as a society. You weren't off topic as you pointed out the importance of thinking things through.

    Steph,

    I was pointing out that Mr. Stossel doesn't always hit the mark. Whether other countries count live births differently than we do does not erase that WHO and the Commonwealth fund have both given our health care system less than stellar grades for quality, affordability and accessibility.

    http://www.commonwealthfund.org/~/me...TheRoad_02.gif





    at http://www.commonwealthfund.org/Cont...imeliness.aspx
    Last edit by HM2VikingRN on Jun 27, '09
  11. by   leslie :-D
    Quote from HM2Viking
    I think the lesson is that we have to be willing as individuals to evaluate data and evidence as we seek the path to better practices for ourselves and as a society.
    i understand that, and agree...
    but he is supposed to be a consumer reporter!!
    i would expect UNBIASED reporting, and not misrepresented data to reflect his agenda.
    i soooo dislike deception, and he is deceitful.
    i am reading some hair-raising stories about him.
    i would now advise folks to read up on his proven and bogus antics he has pulled.
    i will never believe him again.

    leslie
  12. by   blue note
    Quote from HM2Viking
    I think that I would trust the work of the Commonwealth Fund for accurate information about UHC over the work of John Stossel.
    How true. That John Stossel is a hack corporate shill is not news. Remember the 20/20 organic food story he did, which resulted in ABC reprimanding him for lying about tests conducted and he was forced to apologize on air? He has about as much credibility as his fellow pornstache club member, Geraldo.
  13. by   HM2VikingRN
    Without personal credibility he has failed as a journalist. :<<

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