"Shift goes to the lowest bidder..." - page 4
This is NOT an advertisement; it is a copy of an article. Maybe it's just me, but I find it disgusting: --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Online... Read More
Apr 22, '03If the pay was decent and if people agreed not to go to a lower wage I would do it in a heartbeat. I used to have to go floor to floor to sign overtime sheets if I wanted to pick up extra hours. I usually worked 50 to 60 hours per week. I needed to as a single mom. If the pay was good I would do it. Like I said I would not go below what a good wage would be. If someone undercut me so be it. Then I don't think it would work. Personally I can't see someone bidding below a reasonable wage. Paying a person who is on staff their hourly wage is cheaper than agency and much better for patient care.
Go ahead now people, flame me LOL.
Apr 22, '03I don't see why any nurse would bid so low that he/she was getting less than overtime pay. If the need is so great that they are willing to pay $50/h if necessary to cover each shift there must be enough shifts so that bidding below regular pay is unnecessary to get extra hours.
I can see that if there wasn't such a shortage of nurses that the pay might be poor, but we all know hospitals are crying for nurses. This new system could convince TPTB that if they raised their hourly wages by $5-$10/h they might get more people willing to become regular staff, and hve less of a shortage. Seems win-win to me.
Apr 28, '03Can anyone see this evolving into units with mostly LPN staff and one RN willing to supervise? I guess I see this to some extent already in my area. This is a good plan for the good LPN's out there, who CAN undercut our wage... and administration likes that, obviously. PRN RN's are canceled while FT or PRN LVN's are on OT....the only thing that stops this is when my fellow RN's stand together and say NO, we need more RN's on the unit tonight.
And what is to stop low bidder staff (who may be desperate to get the hours) from bumping the rest of us completely off the schedule with a lower bid at the last minute? We seldom are 'promised' shifts...so even fulltimers would not be immune to this.
I hope to see this plan fizzle when RN's stand together, or say no and vote with their feet. We shall see.
Apr 28, '03Mattsmom, I am just curious what type of unit you work on? (Is it an ICU?). I am working at a hospital with an all RN staff now, and even in other hospitals I worked in LPNs were not employed in specialty areas, so I have never worried about them undercutting RNs. Maybe this should be a pm because it's a little off topic, but I am just curious about how you ensure there are enough RNs on if management is trying to save money by using less of them. I would never feel comfortable in a "supervisory" role over a slew of LPNs.
Apr 28, '03I think many of us are missing the economic principles here... No one is going to bid below their standard rate. That would take a complete lack of financial sense on the part of the bidder. Ask yourself this... Would YOU work an extra shift at YOUR job for regular pay? No? Well, then why are you worried that overworked nurses elsewhere in the same hospital would rush to fill those jobs at regular pay? They won't. Since time and a half is required OT pay, if the bidders are even remotely intelligent they will bid AT LEAST 2x regular pay. If they don't then they need to go back to school and take a few economics classes, because they are obviously depriving some village of an idiot.
Also, no one is losing their "regular shift". The positions up for bid are to fill holes where no one is scheduled, not to bump regular staff from a position.
This is simple economics of supply and demand. Nurses are in short supply, and high demand. We command a higer price for our services. If you can't see that this is an opportunity for water to find it's own level, then God bless you.
And for those who think this is degrading, and that other professions would never stoop so low as to sell their services as a bid... You should take a few business classes, this is how the world works everyday with all sorts of professional services, from architects and engineers to real estate and lawyers... This is the basis of the American economy. You sell your skills and services for as much as the market will allow, but low enough to get the contract... That's all this is...
Apr 29, '03Sigh.....
Just another slight to nurses
My facility has a different way to deal with this...
We do use a lot of agency
But when one of the reg staff wants to pick up some ot they just go to scheduling and tell her they can pick up some shifts at such and such a time and she will gather together the shifts she needs covered and get back to them... It is treated as ot ....but the attitude is that if the need them they are wiling to pay
Apr 29, '03Personally, I've found that picking up extra shifts at my place of employment has led to burnout. I love when they try to "entice" you w/ really insulting bonuses, like a $25 gift certificate to Target or something. No thanks, I'll make my extra $$$ w/ agency where I have the added benefits of fresh surroundings, new experiences and less political garbage to deal with!
Apr 30, '03Originally posted by nurse2002
Why dont they just line us up so they can check our teeth before the bidding starts. You know, like livestock.
Sorry, I could'nt help that.
May 4, '03Originally posted by fergus51
Mattsmom, I am just curious what type of unit you work on? (Is it an ICU?). I am working at a hospital with an all RN staff now, and even in other hospitals I worked in LPNs were not employed in specialty areas, so I have never worried about them undercutting RNs. Maybe this should be a pm because it's a little off topic, but I am just curious about how you ensure there are enough RNs on if management is trying to save money by using less of them. I would never feel comfortable in a "supervisory" role over a slew of LPNs.
I work in a corporate hospital system (no big surprise there, eh?)
I've been the lone RN in an ICU and PCU too many times. It's never something we know of ahead of time. I've had supes tell me 'the other RN's were all PRN and they canceled', but the RN's they tell me THEY were canceled by the supe.
I was a supervisor once so I know firsthand about the money games. It definitely makes a supervisor look good to save a few bucks in the staffing mix, so they will if they can.
Usually the directors will present a staffing goal of example: 50% RN's, 40% LVN's but that is on paper only.
In self defense us ICU RN's made a special policy so we don't have to do extra paperwork for the LVN's. Before that we had to do all admission and 24 hr assessments.
My new ICU schedule just came out and there it is again..the LVN's are scheduled for 48 hour weeks. The FT RN's will likely get their hours if census holds, but the prn RN's will likely get bumped...IF the LVN's want more OT. ( I guess even on OT they are cheaper than me so I shouldn't be surprised.) Now I schedule weekly with the supes so I tend get bumped less than others. (they don't see me on the master schedule)
Being nonunion in a right to work state in a corporate hospital, I just tend to roll with the punches and pick up an agency shift if needed....not much I can do about this situation here I've decided. I've gone through 4 directors in 6 years (all good and all fired) so we tend not to get too attached, nor too outspoken. :stone
I like the NURSES I work with and that's what keeps me here.
Do other corporate hospitals not behave similarly? I guess I've just come to expect this and would be surprised to hear otherwise...but hoping somebody here may surprise me. :roll
May 4, '03here is quote from ad in todays paper, "Introducing..online bidding..designed for Registered Nurses only, this innovative website allows you to apply for positions and bid on shifts just like you would on any ot he online auction site." You know if I were young and confident I would take a shot at it just to see what I could squeeze out of them. I do wish they would start coming up with nurse centered solutions to the shortage. Instead the solutions always seem to be managment centered.
May 4, '03Thanks for the reply mattsmom. It's one of the BIG differences between Canada and the US.
May 5, '03Originally posted by oramar
I do wish they would start coming up with nurse centered solutions to the shortage. Instead the solutions always seem to be managment centered.
Dec 8, '03I just found a recent article (dated 12/7/03) about hospitals that are using "shift bidding" to fill holes. I have the link below for anyone who wants to read about this.