Male Nurses/female Patients

[ern91]

I'm interested in knowing if anyone has the issue of male nurses refusing to perform certain nursing functions simply because they are male. Having worked in a large teaching hospital and smaller community hospitals, there seems to be a huge difference. In the teaching hospital, male nurses did everything a patient needed, regardless of gender. In the smaller community hospitals, the male nurses sought out female nurses to take care of all manner of female patient's hygiene, all gyn exams ,and anything else a female patient needed. Have we become such a litigous society that we base our practice on gender? Do you find yourself taking care of your male colleagues patients as well as your own simply because they are afraid to touch their female patients?

[West_Coast_Ken, BSN, RN]

Actually, I did for several years. And it was accomodated. Given my reasons for requesting the accomodation, most practitioners were okay with it.

And what do you do if a famale doc isn't available?

[caroladybelle, BSN, RN]

And what do you do if a famale doc isn't available?

Given my reasons, the male healthcare workers were amenable to finding a substitute.

And given my culture/religion, there were always female primary providers available.

[West_Coast_Ken, BSN, RN]

And given my culture/religion, there were always female primary providers available.

That statement doesn't make any sense to me and it doesn't answer the question "What would you do if there were no female docs available?"

...but I'm kinda beat following a fun, but long clinical day and a pharm test tomorrow so I say, good for you that you have found providers you prefer.

If you were on vacation in my area, as one of our pts was today, and you threw a PE, as she did, you'd have been tough out of luck as there are zero (0) female docs at that hospital. Lots of female nurses, though. :chuckle

[lvs2nrs3535]

After reading some of your posts I have a question, and comment.

Why is it that a woman can do the procedures on a male, and not have a witness but a male cannot do the procedures on a female without having a witness?

Isn't that racist of a kind?

Wouldn't it make sense that if a male needs witness to do his duties on a female, that a female needs a witness to do her duties on a male?

Hmmm, did we not notice somewhere that in our society there are two sets of rules? One for women and one for men?

I am NOT trying to be a smart@#$ but we have to recognize that this is the way it is. I dont agree with it, it really is racist or chauvanist or one sided, (dont really know what to call it, does anyone else?).

It should not matter what sex we/you are, we as nurses are all professionals. Unfortunately our patients are not. So we are stuck dealing with their predjudices, their preferences, their own personal problems.

I agree with the fact that as a male nurse, sometimes it is probably best and safest to cover ones butt. :uhoh21: Fair? No. But it is the way it is with some patients. I dont agree with the double standard, but it is there, sometimes.

[leslie :-D]

If you were on vacation in my area, as one of our pts was today, and you threw a PE, as she did, you'd have been tough out of luck as there are zero (0) female docs at that hospital. Lots of female nurses, though. :chuckle

did caroladybelle refuse care from male docs with all care or just personal care and procedures?

and does one differentiate been non-emergent and emergent care?

big difference.

[58flyer]

Hmmm, did we not notice somewhere that in our society there are two sets of rules? One for women and one for men?

I am NOT trying to be a smart@#$ but we have to recognize that this is the way it is. I dont agree with it, it really is racist or chauvanist or one sided, (dont really know what to call it, does anyone else?).

It should not matter what sex we/you are, we as nurses are all professionals. Unfortunately our patients are not. So we are stuck dealing with their predjudices, their preferences, their own personal problems.

I agree with the fact that as a male nurse, sometimes it is probably best and safest to cover ones butt. :uhoh21: Fair? No. But it is the way it is with some patients. I dont agree with the double standard, but it is there, sometimes.

Yes, I know what to call it...unprofessional. I agree that nurses should be, and for the most part are, professionals. And I am all for respecting the patient's preferences. But when the double standard, also known as discrimination, occurs within the medical community, that's when it becomes unprofessional. For example, a management rule that states that a male nurse cannot do personal cares on a female pt but a female nurse is exempt from that rule with male pts. Elsewhere in this forum you can read examples of male students experiences with instructors and staff in OB clinical rotations, etc. Sure, it's easy to say "that's just the way it is." At one time in this country women couldn't vote. What if the attitude was "that's just the way it is?" Maybe it was at the time, but a number of good people decided that women had much to contribute as equal members of our society and found it unacceptable. The "way it is" became "the way it was" and women got their right to vote. It took men and women to accomplish that. Perhaps one day the medical community will recognize the abilities and contributions of men as caring and competent professionals and officially eliminate any double standards. Men can't do it alone, it will require the support of our female counterparts. It will be a good day when "the way it is" becomes "the way it was."

Discrimination is demeaning to both the male patient as well as the male healthcare professional. Discrimination and professionalism cannot co-exist.

[Plagueis]

I am wondering if there are any laws or legal cases about these issues, specifically whether it would be legal for a hospital or nursing home to grant patients requests based on gender, or race, even. Has a nurse who is a male ever sued because a hospital had a policy that male nurses cannot have female patients, or if a hospital told a male nurse he couldn't perform his duties on a female per her request? I keep hearing about these kinds of policies, but what does the law say? There are laws against sex discrimination, so would these patients requests falll under them? What if hospitals granted the requests of patients who didn't want African American nurses, for example? Isn't that the same as granting patients requests based on gender?

[leslie :-D]

I am wondering if there are any laws or legal cases about these issues, specifically whether it would be legal for a hospital or nursing home to grant patients requests based on gender, or race, even. Has a nurse who is a male ever sued because a hospital had a policy that male nurses cannot have female patients, or if a hospital told a male nurse he couldn't perform his duties on a female per her request? I keep hearing about these kinds of policies, but what does the law say? There are laws against sex discrimination, so would these patients requests falll under them? What if hospitals granted the requests of patients who didn't want African American nurses, for example? Isn't that the same as granting patients requests based on gender?

i would think gender biases are r/t either modesty/social or past trauma issues.

racial biases are r/t prejudices, for likely unacceptable reasons.

[caroladybelle, BSN, RN]

That statement doesn't make any sense to me and it doesn't answer the question "What would you do if there were no female doctors.

If you were on vacation in my area, as one of our pts was today, and you threw a PE, as she did, you'd have been tough out of luck as there are zero (0) female docs at that hospital. Lots of female nurses, though. :chuckle

For most of my care, I have nurse practitioners. Medical care is not limited to doctors.

In my religion, it is common to have female MDs, and other female care providers and modesty is common...why does that not make any sense to you?

I believe that we as nurses are taught to be sensitive to cultural differences, and that patients are given the right to have those respected.

As far as "throwing a PE" in your area, that didn't happen at the time that, I preferred care from one of my own gender for some very sound reasons. And I do not speculate on useless what ifs, prefer to spend time on real life and real issues and not wast energy on what if.

Furthermore there is no inherit "right" of a nurse to give care to those that decline it. Nor can I see why anyone feels the need to force the issue, unless one wishes to be sued for assault.

If you review my posts, I have long respected the rights of males to have care done by one of their own gender.

And for the individual that asked, there are several threads here about patients that have refused care by someone of a different race or nationality, and had hospitals that permitted substitution.

Not that I consider it right, but it has been documented as occurring.

[Corvette Guy]

IMHO, a patient's personal preference regards to same gender health care should be granted. With that, if a male patient request a male nurse such be granted, too. Several factors must be considered; religion, past personal issues, emergent care v. chronic care, availability of staff, etc.

I really don't think this debate should be about male discrimination, but more along the lines of patient education, as well respect & acceptance... on both sides of the coin.

[walkiez]

my 2 cents. when caring for a female patient i was always assess the situation and if there is any doubt in my mind that she may be uncomfortable with me i'll ask if she would prefer a female nurse. not many patient mind, but some do and i respect that. its the materialistic upbringing most of us have that render the care from a female more comfortable.

even me, as a male nurse would prefer a female nurse to attend to hygiene...im only 19 so i guess have alot of growing up to do, and it's not that im homophobic but my mum always attended to hygiene when i was younger, my mum was female, hence im conditioned to feel comfortable with females performing those tasks. that's not to say id make an issue out of a male doing it, i wouldn't say no, id just be more comfortable with a female...personally id feel less "manly" having a male clean myself up, something about dominance, feeling weak...can't explain. my thoughts are kind all over the place.

those kinda things have made me question whether i should be doing nursing but recently i was in hospital for a week and think more male nurses were assigned to be than female and it was good. i felt comfortable asking them questions i otherwise would be too embarrassed to ask a female.

i think of it like fear and dogs. if a dog can sense fear they're more prone to bite. if a female patient can sense that a male nurse is uncomfortable they're more likely to be uncomfortable. (sorry to link you girls with dogs ).

i dunno if any of that makes sense to you guys...

[bigjay]

my 2 cents. when caring for a female patient i was always assess the situation and if there is any doubt in my mind that she may be uncomfortable with me i'll ask if she would prefer a female nurse. not many patient mind, but some do and i respect that. its the materialistic upbringing most of us have that render the care from a female more comfortable.

even me, as a male nurse would prefer a female nurse to attend to hygiene...im only 19 so i guess have alot of growing up to do, and it's not that im homophobic but my mum always attended to hygiene when i was younger, my mum was female, hence im conditioned to feel comfortable with females performing those tasks. that's not to say id make an issue out of a male doing it, i wouldn't say no, id just be more comfortable with a female...personally id feel less "manly" having a male clean myself up, something about dominance, feeling weak...can't explain. my thoughts are kind all over the place.

those kinda things have made me question whether i should be doing nursing but recently i was in hospital for a week and think more male nurses were assigned to be than female and it was good. i felt comfortable asking them questions i otherwise would be too embarrassed to ask a female.

i think of it like fear and dogs. if a dog can sense fear they're more prone to bite. if a female patient can sense that a male nurse is uncomfortable they're more likely to be uncomfortable. (sorry to link you girls with dogs ).

i dunno if any of that makes sense to you guys...

i don't think the dog analogy is that bad. i notice i have almost no problems with female patients and care now vs when i started out. i also can usually identify it quicker and handle it much more smoothly now that i'm more confidant in my own practice. i also don't personalize it as much.

i've never really given a lot of thought to which gender i'd prefer take care of me if i needed it. i think my biggest issue would be allowing anyone else to take care of me. i almost tried to draw my own blood last week because a tech was a bit snarky with me so i can't imagine what i'd be like as a hospital patient....