Huge Dilema RE: Nursing School Long!

purplemania, BSN, RN · Sep 30, 2004

I would approach the instructor PRIVATELY and state that you learned the test items were copied from the NCLEX book. As for "fair", if the questions covered your material then the test was fair, regardless of who wrote the questions. You actually have two advantages: (1) you are really learning the material, not just memorizing answers and (2) you are getting experience with NCLEX-type questions. Those same questions are not likely to be on the NCLEX exam, so the person who is memorizing will not be as prepared as you. If the whole thing really bothers you, I still recommend talking to the instructor, politely, to get his/her side of it. Don't be confrontational, as that won't help your nursing school career. Remember, you are in school for YOU, not your classmates, and you are preparing for a career, not just to obtain a license. There will come a time when you will need to apply your knowledge clinically. Good luck!!

UM Review RN, ASN, RN · Sep 30, 2004

*donning flameproof suit*

OK, here's my advice:

Look at the big picture. Are you in school to learn how to be a nurse or to pass your instructor's version of what constitutes a test?

No matter what kind of tests your instructors give, you still have to pass them in order to become a nurse. No matter how you prepared for them, you still have to pass the NCLEX to become a nurse.

But just becoming a nurse should not be your goal. Becoming the best nurse possible should be.

Therefore, I wouldn't give a good ta-hoot where the instructor got the tests from. I'd just do the readings, study my butt off, practice my clinical skills, then pass the tests and be done with it.

Oh wait a second. That's right, I already did, and that's how I did it.

Get the point?

Best of luck to you, Jen!

llg, PhD, RN · Sep 30, 2004

I agree with purplemania that a polite, respectful conversation with the instructor is probably the way to go. You need to hear her side of the story. I would also be sure that she understands that some students own the book she took the questions from and that the test, therefore, did not reflect their true understanding of the material but rather their good fortune of having easy access to the questions and answers ahead of time. I would then be sure to ask her if she is going to continue to use that book or others in a similar fashion -- because if so, you want to buy the book so that you can have the questions and answers ahead of time, too. I would say all of that very politely and respectfully, not in a sarcastic or smart-a** way, but in a sincere way that shows you want to do well in the class and are willing to buy an additional book if that is what she actually basis her tests on and not the required texts listed.

Let her see the flaws in her required methods for herself -- don't shove them down her throat in a way that will cause her to get defensive.

llg

LPNalmost! · Sep 30, 2004

We had an instructor doing the EXACT thing the first quarter of my LPN program in addition to other inappropriate behavior. We even had the NCLEX-PN book as a required text, but she "forebade" us to remove the plastic from it!!! Anyway, long story short: after taking all we could take from this instructor (including screaming obscenities at students and asking the male students if they "shake or wipe"?), a group of us finally went to the program director. She was let go. On what grounds? Plagiarism. It's as illegal for an instructor as it is a student. And since it could be proven, it was a documented breech of conduct where the other behaviors were her word against ours. I wish you luck, but in my experience if she is stealing (and that's what it is) test questions, there will be other problems with this teacher too.

Hello! I decided to post this in the general nurse forum in hopes to get more responses and to also get some much needed professional opinions on this. Here it goes:

Last week we had our first test this semester. I truly do not think that the test was all that bad and I am actually expecting to get around a %90 on it (They wait a week to give us our test back). Anyways one of the students in our class brings in an NCLEX book the next day and the first 35 out of 50 questions were taken directly from this book word for word. Not a thing was changed. The questions were even in the same order, the answers were exactly the same and even the a,b,c,d, were in the same words and order. I am livid.

Even though only like 5 students in the class have this book it is unfair. I am not saying this because I failed the exam, because I actually think that I did really well. I am just upset becasue instead of being tested on our lecture material that was given to us in class this instructor chose to steele answers word for word from a published NCLEX book. What upsets me even more is that I studied my rear end off for three weeks in a row, did all the required readings and a person majoring in basket weaving could have passed this exam if they had this book.

I can understand an instructor using a book like this to guide them to make up questions that pertain to our material, but just copying them down word for word and them putting them on a test is absurd. Whether I pass or I fail I want it to be because I did it with the material that they teach us, not material that comes from a $30 book. I have over $500 wrapped up in required nursing texts that I studied from and I could have paid $30, memorized these questions the night before and passed this exam (the one person in my class even admitted that they did not study anything other than this book).

Our whole class is now just torn on what to do. I don't know what to do myself. I no longer have any respect for this instructor at all. I mean if I copied a careplan from a book I'd get kicked out of school, and if I forgot to cite something in APA format on a paper I'd get kicked out of school. What do you all think? All suggestions/opinions are very welcome? Thanks so much!

kate930 · Sep 30, 2004

I believe it's called copyright infringment. I believe it's punishable, first offense, $200,000 fine and/or 7 years imprisonment.

I've seen this happen at my own school. I've heard some instructors brush it off saying it's "for educational purposes" it's ok. That's not true, especially since the school (and the instructor's job) are financially benefitting from their "stealing" of the material. By us paying tuition and the instructor recieving pay, they are "stealing", plain and simple, and it is copyright infringement.

Sheri257 · Sep 30, 2004

I believe it's called copyright infringment. I believe it's punishable, first offense, $200,000 fine and/or 7 years imprisonment.
I've seen this happen at my own school. I've heard some instructors brush it off saying it's "for educational purposes" it's ok. That's not true, especially since the school (and the instructor's job) are financially benefitting from their "stealing" of the material. By us paying tuition and the instructor recieving pay, they are "stealing", plain and simple, and it is copyright infringement.

Not necessarily. I'm not condoning what happened here, and obviously this varies on a case by case basis, but the education exemption is pretty broad:

The following are not infringements of copyright:

(1) performance or display of a work by instructors or pupils in the course of face-to-face teaching activities of a nonprofit educational institution, in a classroom or similar place devoted to instruction ...

http://assembler.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode17/usc_sec_17_00000110----000-.html

:coollook:

mariedoreen · Sep 30, 2004

I'm a "keep my head down" kind of person when it comes to nursing school and my interest in actually getting through it so.... while I'm not saying I'm right (because most likely I'm being too much of a wimp here) what I would end up doing is keeping my mouth shut, do all the studying that I had been AND I'd go over the NCLEX book as well... especially knowing the potential for the instructor to pull questions from it.

Flames for the above opinion are received between 2358 and 2359 daily.

SarasotaRN2b · Sep 30, 2004

I'm a "keep my head down" kind of person when it comes to nursing school and my interest in actually getting through it so.... while I'm not saying I'm right (because most likely I'm being too much of a wimp here) what I would end up doing is keeping my mouth shut, do all the studying that I had been AND I'd go over the NCLEX book as well... especially knowing the potential for the instructor to pull questions from it.
Flames for the above opinion are received between 2358 and 2359 daily.

No flames! I totally agree with you, mariedoreen. When I took A&P 1, I found that there were many questions in the study guide, old tests and quizzes, that were on my test. By processing each of the questions with their answers and understanding why, I got an A. The fact is that any student would have that same opportunity, but very few thought outside of studying just their notes.

Jen, don't stress it. Just think of it as another study aid, and think about the fact that when it really comes to your taking the NCLEX, you'll do much better than those students that are only using the NCLEX and memorizing the answers. I know that I definitely would prefer you as a nurse than one of those classmates.

plumrn, BSN, RN · Sep 30, 2004

I guess we all just think differently, of course, but I just don't see the problem with this. I would just feel great that I was able to absorb and study enough information that I did well on the test. I don't think it would bother me in the least where the questions came from. I would even feel better knowing that I have found another resource to study. I don't see why these questions from this book are not considered 'okay', if they covered material the class was responsible for. No one knows what questions will be used for the next, or any future tests, and will still have to study hard.

You have enough on your plate right now, and I'm sure you don't need anything extra to do, or stress about. I would drop it. Keep up the good work, and forget how much, or how little anyone else studies. In the end, you are the only one you have to see through.

Drysolong · Sep 30, 2004

Did the students who own the book know that the teacher was going to use questions from the NCLEX practice book? If not, they didn't have an unfair advantage. But I would mention it to the teacher that those who have the book may now have an advantage. Although you never know what questions the teacher will use.

I am finding something new in studying to be a nurse. In other coursework I've taken, we studied and skimmed, etc. based on an outline basis of what we would be tested on. Now, I'm finding that my tests are based on any and everything from my textbooks, lectures, critical thinking skills,etc. I used to ask "where was that in the book?" or say, "but, the book says this" We do win some of our challenges, when the test questions are way off the mark or ambiguous. I kind of like it though, because it is making me really study. (I went off the subject a little. sorry)

mickeymouse1205 · Sep 30, 2004

Hey,

This is so funny my psych teacher did this but, in our psych book at the end of each chapter were questions, she took the questions from there and put them on the test, so you could study from the questions. The only problem was you didn't have the answers to the text book questions so you had to be sure you were right.Anyway I say let it go if people are just studying the nclex book and not really learning they will pay when they go for their boards. Most questions on the boards have 2 correct answers ,BUT what is the better answer, your only going to understand that by putting what you've learned together if thye are just skinnning by they will probably fail.

Cheryl