the pay for nurses

Gromit · Jan 1, 2003

Stats can be made to say anything the people paying the statasticians want them to say, to prove the point of their agenda.

I rarely pay attention to 'blind stats'.

Genista, BSN, RN · Jan 1, 2003

If anyone read the posts in the general discussion area about nursing salaries, then you would recall it varies greatly from area to area. It is shocking how different the pay scale can vary! It even varies within one's own state. In California, where I live, I started out almost 5 years ago at $19/hr as a new grad RN (not counting shift diff), and now make over $30/hr. Of course, the cost of living out here is huge ("starter" homes average $340,000), so it doesn't go as far as you would think. But the pay out here is not bad for nurses. New grads start around $24/hr. It is even higher pay in the big cities.

Bet0326- Maybe I should go to Florida and be a teacher! LOL! ;-) (You said, teachers make as much as Engineers). Out here, the average engineer is making close to a three figure annual salary!

What kind of teaching is that anyway! ;-) Hee hee. Well, I admit wages differ from state to state (maybe engineers make less in your area). However, as someone who is about to enter a teaching credential program, I have done some research & new teachers here in CA (public school) start out at $36,000/year. Private school is paid less. Gee, I made $40,000 my first year as a nurse, and that was a part-time job, four 8 hr shifts/week, 5 years ago.

I think teachers & nurses have a good deal in common. We both lack respect and fair pay, for one. I know I work hard as an RN, but I also respect the hard work teachers do, and the long hours they put in "off the clock" during the school year. Let's not be knocking the hard working teachers. We need to support one another. We ALL deserve fair pay for our hard work.

:cool:

bet0326 · Jan 3, 2003

Originally posted by kona2
Bet0326- Maybe I should go to Florida and be a teacher! LOL! ;-) (You said, teachers make as much as Engineers). Out here, the average engineer is making close to a three figure annual salary!
What kind of teaching is that anyway! ;-) Hee hee. Well, I admit wages differ from state to state (maybe engineers make less in your area). However, as someone who is about to enter a teaching credential program, I have done some research & new teachers here in CA (public school) start out at $36,000/year. Private school is paid less.

Like I said, if you calculate it by hour.......with summer's off..........that's what I meant about the engineer stat. I actually got that from the state government here in florida. Considering that most people get paid salary (my best friend is an engineer and he started at $40,000 and worked 60 hours a week) and not hourly, pay by hour difers greatly depending on career. Most teachers work 8-3, five days a week for nine months.

bet0326 · Jan 3, 2003

I'm not knocking teachers in any way. I have good friends that are teachers and I plan on one day being a nursing educator myself. I definitely think that they deserve more money. However, most of the teachers I know understand that they make very good money hourly. I mean as a bank officer I make $15 per hour and I have a finance degree and an excellent annual salary. It's all relative.

bet0326 · Jan 3, 2003

$36,000 a year is $29 an hour for a teacher.

EmeraldNYL, BSN, RN · Jan 3, 2003

BellaTerra, that's a very good point. Our society rewards athletes and movie stars, not nurses and teachers. And your point about Drs. was good too. A lot of Drs. in Pennsylvania are quitting because they can't afford the malpractice insurance. Does Julia Roberts REALLY need $20 million a movie???

Genista, BSN, RN · Jan 3, 2003

I still disagree with those quotes about teacher pay. I happen to know a few teachers, and guess what... their job certainly does not end at 3 pm. There are many misconceptions about their job, just as many have misconceptions about nursing. My friends who teach work a 40 hour week (paid), but also put in several hours without pay each day and on weekends. Talk to some teachers, and you will find they put in 50 hours week with 40 hours of pay. The job doesn't end at 3 pm, like you may think. They still have to correct homework, make lesson plans, meet with parents, etc. Yes, this is the career they have chosen, but I hear many teachers resent the fact that others think their job is easy and ends at 3 pm. It reminds me of how many people think my day as an RN ends when my shift ends, when in fact, it might not...especially if I ran all day and didn't have time to do all that charting that is required and updating all those important care plans.

Teachers in California require post graduate credentialling at a minimum. Therefore, it is 1-1.5 year post grad eduacation to become a teacher, if not a Master's degree. Yes, teachers get two months off in summer. So, they work 10 months a year. At $36,000 annually, that is $3600/month, or $900/week, or $22.50 an hour entry level pay.

I guess that isn't terrible, but for someone with post graduate education, it's not great. ADN RNs, with a 2 year degree at least make that much starting out, where I live. My husband makes more than that as a journeyman carpenter.

Again, my point is I think we are both (teachers and nurses) undervalued by society, and underpaid. We need to stick together.

llg, PhD, RN · Jan 3, 2003

My sister is a teacher and she has always made more than I have, particularly when you also consider her benefits. Yes, she has a Master's Degree -- but 100% of her graduate education was paid for by the school district. I have a PhD, much of which was paid out of my pocket (some scholarships & government grants).

The biggest difference is in retirement benefits. In 2 years, my sister will retire at the age of 52 with 80% of her salary guaranteed for the rest of her life, adjusted annually for inflation. Assuming she lives to be 82, she will have been paid 2 years for every year she actually taught!

llg

llg, PhD, RN · Jan 3, 2003

Ohhh... and I forgot to mention ....

I figured out the other day that if I had simply come to my current hospital as a new grad with and ADN and stayed here that last 26 years as a staff nurse ... I would be making more money than I do now with a PhD in a leadership position.

At my hospital, the retention bonuses, shift differentials, etc. are so high for the staff, that many, many staff nurses are making more than those in leadership positions, who are not eligible for bonuses, overtime pay, etc.

In what other professions are people so blatently punished for furthering their educations and getting promoted?

llg

Genista, BSN, RN · Jan 4, 2003

llg-

You make a good point about how nursing doesn't reward education. At my current job, if you work as a staff nurse, there is NO wage incentive for education. There is absolutely no extra pay for an advanced degree. And as far as I know, the management positions pay is not that great, when you consider they are salaried and put in some looooong hours. At least as a staff nurse, you get shift diff (8% pms, 20% nocs), holdiay pay, and wage increases.

I am curious where your sister teaches & at what level, that she makes such good money? It seems that pay wise, I am better off as a staff nurse than a teacher here in CA. If I worked 40 hrs/week on my current wage (I don't), I would be pulling in $57,000/year. Beginning teachers make $36,000/year around here for 40 hrs/week (two months off in summer, though).

It's not all about money. But I do think that people deserve a fair wage. I think it's a shame that you with a Phd are making less than a staff nurse. There's no justice in that. You have a higher knowledge base & experience that should be compensated.

chelli73 · Jan 24, 2003

Originally posted by farmmom
However the hospitals here stay pretty full staffed. [/b]

I hope I can find work in Munster or Dyer!!! I am determined to move out that way ASAP!!!!!!

llg, PhD, RN · Jan 24, 2003

Originally posted by kona2
llg-
I am curious where your sister teaches & at what level, that she makes such good money? It seems that pay wise, I am better off as a staff nurse than a teacher here in CA. If I worked 40 hrs/week on my current wage (I don't), I would be pulling in $57,000/year. Beginning teachers make $36,000/year around here for 40 hrs/week (two months off in summer, though).

My sister teaches 2nd grade in a small town in Pennsylvania. When you look at the "cash per year," I have always made a little more than she has (currently, about $12,000 per year more.) However, she gets 3 months off in the summer,etc. so when you figure it out per day or per hour, we are paid approximately the same.

However, she got 100% tuition reimbursement for her Master's Degree and excellent health care benefits, etc.

Then you add in the big adjustment -- her retirement package. At age 51, she will reach her 30-year mark. Under her school districts contract, she will retire with 80% of her salary guarenteed for the rest of her life, adjusted yearly for inflation. At age 51! If she lives to be 81, she will have received 2 years of pay for every year she taught. Now, that's a lot more compensation that I'm getting.

When you compared your salaries to those of the local teachers, how much did you consider their benefit packages and/or their actual hours worked?

I don't feel all that sorry for teachers. Many (but not all, of course) have excellent benefits packages that they fail to mention when they complain about their low pay.

llg