Think I could get fired for this..... - page 3
Our facility is currently short of CNAs (i am an LPN in LTC). Much to my surprise when I went to work over the weekend I find that I have been pulled to work as an aide. Needless to say I didn't want... Read More
Oct 11, '06a. in a nonconforntation forum discuss with don that these duties should in
all fairness be rotated between the lpns, that you should not be
expected to take up the slack all the time. if you don't receive a
satisfactory answer i would surely consider another job
b. one facility that i worked at all lpn-rn new grads were expected to work
a week as an aide before the floor orientation
c. what would the level of care for your patients have been if there no
aides were available..if this is coming up frequently than there should
have been some hiring and firing to assure that you have people who
d. don't walk out w/o notice only your pts would be hurt...but don't be the
push over . this is not a case of seniority or the experience in cna that
you may have
good luck in what ever you may decide
Oct 11, '06I thought that basic pt care, as provided by the CNAs, was everyone's responsibility. I know this isn't a popular answer, but it is true. If you did have those injuries and they didn't know that upon hiring you, they can possibly fire you for falsifying your employment application-that's a standard line on just about all applications. I wish you the best of luck though.....My back is usually always hurting, and Heaven knows, transfers, lifts, and turns, etc. just about kill me. We have NO CNAs where I work, we do Team Nursing, and you always have a few "team members" who don't want to share the responsibilities evenly.....
Oct 11, '06Quote from luvmy2angelsI find this part of the original post very interesting - personally, I wouldn't be thrilled to be pulled to be a CNA (making my normal $$ would sweeten the pot, however ) but I would do it - I would also expect that ALL of the LPN's take turns - did they really tell you that you are used because of your prior CNA experience?There are other LPNs that were hired the same time I was that have never been put on an aide assignment, I was told they like to use me because of my experience as compaired to the other LPN that never worked as an aide.
That's not fair - is that legal for them to actually tell you that's why you get the short end of the stick just because you were an aide in a previous life instead of something else? Can anyone else answer as to the possible legalities - could that be construed as some distorted kind of discrimination?
Oct 11, '06I guess I am sort of in the minority here. I love working as a CNA...I'm not all that good at it anymore, but I really enjoy the one on one contact, getting residents out of bed, soaking myself because I haven't given a shower in so long that I can't do it without making a mess, etc. Physically, it is a lot harder than what I do as charge...if I weren't able to do it, I think I would have spoken up when I was hired. If I were in your situation, I would have taken the assignment and explained to the other nurses and the CNAs what my limitations are...most of the time they are very accomodating. I just don't have the physical strength that I once did and if I tell our CNAs that if they will get someone in the shower chair for me I will shower them, they are usually happy to help. It's sort of like working short, but still having a little extra help...that is better than nothing.
Oct 11, '06My advice? Choose your battles with care and don't burn bridges. As with many others, our facility uses RN's (we have no Lpn's) as CNA's, ward clerks or patient sitters if needed. It is not an ideal situation and I'm sure mgmt would prefer not to pay RN wages for these positions. You want to be a team player but certainly if the trend occurs more and more often, you will want to speak with whoever doles out the assignments to make sure that these duties are spread out amongst the staff. If its just happened this once, don't sweat it! Should you refuse the occasional CNA assignment-they may well have reason to terminate you. Fair? no -real life? yes. My feeling is that the more "hats" you can wear within the facility = job security. I have the ability to fix copier jams, therefore I'm in good shape in that department. Good luck-MVan
Oct 11, '06When you have a patient that has to pee so bad he's going to wet himself, I promise he doesn't give a damn what you went to school for.
Oct 11, '06Quote from lovingtheunlovedAbsolutely, and there are plenty of circumstances in which a nurse could and should perform duties that are usually handled by CNAs. But there's a difference between toileting a patient here and there, and being expected to work solely as a CNA for eight (or more) hour shifts on a semi-regular basis!When you have a patient that has to pee so bad he's going to wet himself, I promise he doesn't give a damn what you went to school for.
Oct 11, '06I'm an RN in a hospital and I have no problem helping pts. go to the bathroom, eat, empty Foleys, etc...but if I was told after I came to work one day that I was ONLY to do aide work, I would be upset. You're right-you did not go through nursing school for nothing. You were hired as an LPN who does meds, assessments, treatments, AND who can/should also pitch in with basic patient care when you have the time for it. Just my two cents worth.
Oct 11, '06This is interesting, because my sister in law had that same situation years ago, where she was a graduate RN, had her LPN license, but they made her work as an aide. She did it, because it gave her time to fully assess her patients, but she didn't do it again after she received her RN license.
Oct 11, '06Quote from kranken_schwesterI'm not talking about that kind of circumstance. Here's a for instance. A few years ago, I got called in to work, as none of the aides showed up for my floor. I wasn't able to come in. They pulled an aide from a different floor, and a LPN agreed to come in and take the other half of the hall. For 12 hours. Of course, at her LPN pay rate. The 16 residents she was responsible for that day did not care if she was a CNA, LPN, or US president.Absolutely, and there are plenty of circumstances in which a nurse could and should perform duties that are usually handled by CNAs. But there's a difference between toileting a patient here and there, and being expected to work solely as a CNA for eight (or more) hour shifts on a semi-regular basis!
Of course, in the OP's situation, where she is physically unable to do aide work for a whole shift, she should not be expected to. Heck, I'm in nursing school because my body won't take it for many more years. The nurse who thinks she's above aide work is what my comment was in response to. Like the OP said, they are short on CNAs right now. SOMEBODY has to do the job, and the nurse is ultimately responsible for the total care of the patients whether s/he has aides or not.
Oct 11, '06Quote from jojotooBecause of the "other specified duties" phrase (i've yet to see a nursing job description that didn't include that phrase) that's why i'm thinking that the employer might say that the OP lied about being able to physically do the job.
A couple of things that need clarification. As an LPN, doesn't your scope of practice encompass all duties that a CNA would be responsible for? Just as my scope of practice as an RN would cover all tasks that an LPN or a CNA would perform? What would you do if you came to work and there weren't any CNAs for that shift? You'd have to suck it up and do your job AND the CNA's - right? And I know how hard that is because we all very much depend on the CNAs/ Techs. I know that I do! In fact, I'M going to have to suck it tonight because we don't have a Tech scheduled.
Now, having said that, the question is - SHOULD you have to suck it up? I bet if you looked up your job description for your facility it would have your LPN duties all spelled out nice and neat: then at the very bottom of the page (and probably in very small letters), it would say: "And other specified
duties". As long as those "other duties" are within your scope of practice I think that your employer can require you to perform them.
If your management had any sense, they wouldn't risk losing or alienating a licensed person by making them work in what is essentially a non-licensed capacity. But since when did anything that management does make good sense?
One last thing, if you accept an assignment in a CNA capacity, you will still be held to the higher standard of your LPN license/ scope of practice.
Oct 12, '06Quote from luvmy2angelsi would say you should look at your official job description. that will say it all. if your job description has anything about you providing nursing care in it, then i would say the answer to your question is "yes". insubordination is what they would get you for if they wanted to fire you.. . .can the don fire me because i feel that i can't work as an aide?? after all i was hired as a lpn, so can they legally fire me for not accepting an aide assignment??
anyway, the way to handle this is to have gotten a couple of aides together and worked out a plan with them. as an lpn and leader already, they would have followed any suggestions you made to change the way things were going to be done as cnas that day. that's what leaders do. i've seen cnas accommodate another cna with a physical problem lots of times. i would have jumped at the chance to not be responsible for meds and treatments for a day and still get my rn (in your case, lpn) pay! and, i have a bad back. i would have recruited one or more cnas, put our heads together and come up with a game plan to get the patient care done.