Shooting at nurse's college in Tuscon, AZ?? - page 11
I am watching FOXNews and they just reported they have received a "bulletin" about a shooting at a nursing college in Tuscon. They will break in more more news as they get it. Two women have been... Read More
Nov 1, '02Occupation: RN, CLNC, Entrepreneur Joined: Apr '01; Posts: 6,312; Likes: 106Originally posted by abrenrn
I ask the question I asked before? Can something positive come out of this tragedy? It appears the killer hoped there might be a positive outcome for nursing education.
If nothing else, he knew his instructors. The school is claiming that he was unbalanced, suicidal, and, once before, had reported him to the police. They did not report him to the licensing board and when contacted by the police said they would counsel him. They are providing a road map, as he expected, for the lawyers to follow.
While it should not require murder to address the bullying attitudes of instructors, schools of nursing, and employers, it has happened. Even though it means doing what a killer wanted, perhaps nursing education can be changed.
Thank you colleagues for so eloquently expressing my thoughts...
Nov 1, '02Occupation: LPN, Actor From: US ; Joined: Aug '01; Posts: 635; Likes: 89So many people on this thread sympathizing with the shooter because of a letter he wrote. Or condoning the use of guns. And not a whole lot praying for the victims he shot who didn't EVEN have a chance to speak up for themselves because they didn't know death was coming for them. Once again a killer is getting the kind of attention he wanted but didn't deserve. I understand what's going on in this world less and less.
Nov 1, '02Occupation: RN, ICU Joined: Feb '01; Posts: 740; Likes: 2I noted that Oprah is doing a show today that discusses gun control. I only saw the preview....but knowing her shows it will probally present a balanced and unemotional viewpoint. Might be worth watching if you can. I will try to watch it.
I too have read the letter from the shooter. Many of us are so eagar to attach blame...... and really the shooter was the one who picked up the gun, drove to the school, aimed it and shot people dead. He was responsible for his actions. He did not sound crazy or insane and IF HE HAD LIVED, at his trial the letter would not have given him excuses...... he would have been put to death, since the US still has the death penalty.
Nov 1, '02Occupation: Patient Education Specialty: 7 year(s) of experience in LDRP; Education ; Joined: Mar '01; Posts: 7,470; Likes: 56Originally posted by Brita01
Once again a killer is getting the kind of attention he wanted but didn't deserve. I understand what's going on in this world less and less.
Agree. We've turned this killer into a martyr for all the poor, distraught nursing students out there who may be stressed out, telling them it's OKAY to be inappropriate and vent inappropriately, and that all your problems are the fault of someone being mean to you..even as an adult, and that basically, you lack the control or will to control your actions because your feelings were just so damn hurt.
I am at a loss of words.
One of the professors shot and killed in cold blood was a personal friend of one of my professors at school. I can't imagine telling her or the victim's families that maybe if the instructors had been more "loving" that their lives would have been spared. Let's not forget, we're assuming that they WERE rude to him. We're taking the word of a cold-blooded killer. Funny how the other nursing students found those profs kind and helpful....
Nov 1, '02Occupation: RN, CLNC, Entrepreneur Joined: Apr '01; Posts: 6,312; Likes: 106Do we only focus on one aspect of the patient when we provide care? I hope not.
We have this oppourtunity to create change. To make something so horrible into something for the greater good...
None of us, who stated we had sadness for Bob and empathy for his plight, stated that the professors deserved what they got. Violence has NO justification...
I am surprised, by the level of intelligences of the posters and the regulars on this board, that you are not looking at and learning from all the issues that are presented....Last edit by nightingale on Nov 1, '02
Nov 1, '02Occupation: Patient Education Specialty: 7 year(s) of experience in LDRP; Education ; Joined: Mar '01; Posts: 7,470; Likes: 56I am even more stunned that you are referring to the killler by a first name. Bob? As in Robert Flores? Unless I am mistaken.
Sometimes there IS no solution to people who are self-serving and who have no regard for human life. There is not much that can be done about it. Flores had many choices in life and made the ones he made: unfortunately he regretted those decisions. That is not my problem nor should I be concerned. As an adult he is responsible for his own life. Not me, and not you.
If shooting nursing instructors became a widespread problem, I could see starting to look at the similiarities. But an isolated incident of a self-serving luzer does not justify analyzing colleges, or starting to criticize instructors for not diagnosing and treating aggressive behaviors in school and simply enforcing rules. If it does, then maybe I aught to rethink being an educator if that kind of responsibility is going to be placed on me. Heck, I may be afraid to fail a student because of some depression characteristics that I may not have seen. If he hadn't killed me, would I be sued?
This man made a choice. He obviously felt justified in it, so let's let him "live" with it.
Nov 1, '02Occupation: Patient Education Specialty: 7 year(s) of experience in LDRP; Education ; Joined: Mar '01; Posts: 7,470; Likes: 56Originally posted by abrenrn
I've known a few people who have taught for years and who have never had tires slashed. I only taught one semester, my tires remained intact. How is it you seem to get all these destructive students?
Nov 1, '02Occupation: RN, CLNC, Entrepreneur Joined: Apr '01; Posts: 6,312; Likes: 106Originally posted by Susy K
I am even more stunned that you are referring to the killler by a first name. Bob? As in Robert Flores? Unless I am mistaken.
I doubt he would like being called Flores...
Once again.... we are not looking at the full spectrum....
Who was it that said... "Those who do not learn from their mistakes are destined to repeat them" (okay okay.. it may not be quoted perfectly... but you know the gist of what it means..
Hmm maybe that was Winston Churchill....
Nov 1, '02Joined: Oct '00; Posts: 10,236; Likes: 64Originally posted by nightngale1998
If you read the letter, you would have known his preference was to be called Bob...
I'm sure those instructors "preferred" not to be murdered.
Originally posted by OBNURSEHEATHER
Um, as far as I'm concerned he lost his right to have his preferences catered to.
I'm sure those instructors "preferred" not to be murdered.
Exactly. He lost his rights to request ANYTHING the moment he started plotting to kill unarmed women over failing a class. And I read the letter. He's lucky that I refer to him as Flores. He's a self-serving luzer of life.
I am in such disbelief over this whole turn of this sympathy towards a cold killer, calling him Bob as if you are talking to him over a cup of coffee...... It kills me. Frankly, I would be embarrassed if students or families of U of Arizona saw this thread. We're not even referring to the profs by their damn first name and yet we're calling the killer BOB because he preferred that. And you're honoring that, AFTER he killed 3 people???!!!
Nov 1, '02Occupation: RN, ICU Joined: Feb '01; Posts: 740; Likes: 2My personal feeling is that he is a SHOOTER. In my previous post this is how I addressed him.
I agree with Suzy and Heather..... he lost his rights when he SHOT those people. Killer- shooter, either name is right, in my opinion.
Nov 1, '02Occupation: RN Case Manager Joined: Apr '02; Posts: 4,945; Likes: 27Originally posted by lisainaz
....I read the letter, and my impression is that he sounded like a totally self-centered megalomaniac who had a distorted idea of his importance and how others should respond to him. Totally selfish and unwilling to admit he failed or was wrong. According to him, he was always right, and others were always wrong. Sickening...printing it in the newspaper in its entirity is an insult to the victims' families. The killer says terrible things about the professors. The professors cannot respond. They are dead. Also, printing this in the newspaper gives other potential killers the message that they will gain attention and become famous after their actions. That is not a good message.
Nov 1, '02Occupation: Registered Nurse Joined: Aug '01; Posts: 997; Likes: 23I'm in agreement with Suzy and Heather on this one. I too am dismayed to find that nurses are calling a cold blooded killer "Bob". I posted this on another thread, and I'll repeat it here. Instead of writing a 22 page letter in APA format contemplating murder and complaining about how everyone treated him badly, he should have used that time to actually study. Maybe he would have done better in his courses. The man was able to afford to buy 5 guns and 200 rounds of ammunition, but heaven forbid he pay his child support and student loans. His choices were his own fault. There are what, 2 million nurses in the U.S.? We all managed to pass nursing school without killing anyone. I find it hard to empathize with a cold blooded killer.