MA's Calling themselves Nurses

LorraineCNA · Jan 22, 2005

Nice

Sadly, True.

Lorraine

CNA

future CMA

Trauma Columnist · Jan 22, 2005

Plesae respect the TOS with respect to respectful posts. Thanks.

LorraineCNA · Jan 22, 2005

thank you. We all have our roles. No one is "better" than the next, but an MA is not a nurse and for her to say so it is misprepresentation, pure and simple, and possibly illegal. That is all we are saying; no one is condescending to anyone else here.

So, the poster who said that MA's probably don't "understand" ethics, licensing, etc. wasn't being condescending or arrogant? Or how about the statement that we're just "pulled off the street" with no education?

BTW, as I said before, misrepresentation is definitely wrong.

Lorraine

Student_Na · Jan 22, 2005

I am a CNA , I work in a long term care unit (2 wings)in an auxillary Hospital , our unit has 200 patients , 75 of which are sub acute care , 25 are trach , 50 think their at home , 10 think their jesus , and the other 40 believe its always time to eat .

how does our unit work , the majority of the "nurses" are (CNA's) certified nursing assistants , we have 1 RN for both wings, and 2 LPN's (1 per wing)

being long term , over 85% of our patients are total care , and most are what is called (heavy duty) 2 person mediman lift etc .

Maybe MA's / CNA's are not registered or licensed nurses , but really what it boils down to is , we provide basic and essential bedside care , meet and exceed emotional needs , and are always willing to help , and that does'nt make me a nurse ,yeah okay, try and see how a unit like this would run minus the 20 CNA's per shift , after all only a NURSE can help a patient !

SmilingBluEyes · Jan 22, 2005

Plesae respect the TOS with respect to respectful posts. Thanks.

thank you.

SmilingBluEyes · Jan 22, 2005

So, the poster who said that MA's probably don't "understand" ethics, licensing, etc. wasn't being condescending or arrogant? Or how about the statement that we're just "pulled off the street" with no education?
BTW, as I said before, misrepresentation is definitely wrong.
Lorraine

no I don't think that was meant that way; I have met aides who had NO clue what nursing was and what we do. And I have met MAs in medical offices who think of themselves as nurses and their doctors permit and even encourage them to call themselves such. I have met many more patients who have no idea, either and are being misled. It's wrong. I am sure that poster ran across this, too. But that was just how I read it. Not to be condescending, but to call a wrong practice, just what it is: wrong. I am sorry you feel you have to defend yourself so stridently here.

I respect all the roles in medical and health care delivery, but I will not sit still for non-nurses calling themselves nurses, either, just as I would not call myself a doctor. Nor, would I EVER dispense medical advice or info over the phone,on the internet, or to friends or relatives. When asked to do this, I state clearly it would violate nurse practice acts and I would be acting out of my scope. And I refer them to their doctor/NP or a pharmacist. I also know, if I did this, and was called on it, I would not jealously or angrily write that person off as condescending, but perhaps as informing me what is right to do!

You see, to me, It's not about who is "better", but who is licensed and covered to do what tasks, and who should dispense certain information/advice to the health care consumer. That is simple as that. :)

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Jan 22, 2005

Maybe MA's / CNA's are not registered or licensed nurses , but really what it boils down to is , we provide basic and essential bedside care , meet and exceed emotional needs , and are always willing to help , and that does'nt make me a nurse ,yeah okay, try and see how a unit like this would run minus the 20 CNA's per shift , after all only a NURSE can help a patient !

No one said only a NURSE can help a pt. That's not even what this thread is about.

People who are not nurses should not be refered to as nurses, nor refer to themselves as a nurse, because they aren't a nurse. This is fact.

LorraineCNA · Jan 22, 2005

I am a CNA , I work in a long term care unit (2 wings)in an auxillary Hospital , our unit has 200 patients , 75 of which are sub acute care , 25 are trach , 50 think their at home , 10 think their jesus , and the other 40 believe its always time to eat .
how does our unit work , the majority of the "nurses" are (CNA's) certified nursing assistants , we have 1 RN for both wings, and 2 LPN's (1 per wing)
being long term , over 85% of our patients are total care , and most are what is called (heavy duty) 2 person mediman lift etc .
Maybe MA's / CNA's are not registered or licensed nurses , but really what it boils down to is , we provide basic and essential bedside care , meet and exceed emotional needs , and are always willing to help , and that does'nt make me a nurse ,yeah okay, try and see how a unit like this would run minus the 20 CNA's per shift , after all only a NURSE can help a patient !

Amen.

I worked the same type of scenario, pretty much the same ratios.

I guess I "impersonated" a nurse all the time since when a resident would call out "nurse, nurse", I was the one who went to make sure they weren't falling out of bed.

Lorraine

CNA

future CMA

SmilingBluEyes · Jan 22, 2005

that is not what the original intent of the thread was. No one is discounting for ONE minute what CNA's contribute to health care delivery, and you know it.

ayndim · Jan 22, 2005

I don't think anyone here thinks CNA's or MA's don't contribute to the medical team. It is just that they all have different qualifications or roles. If you can reasonably say it is okay for an MA to be called a nurse then by the same token a nurse, NP, CNM or CRNA can call themselves drs. Of course not because it just doesn't make sense. What I don't understand is why a MA would want to be called a nurse. They should be proud of their own title. Right now I am a pre-nursing student and darn proud of it, just like I will be when I am a nursing student, RN and so on. I know a great MA and when I first went to that drs I called her the nurse. She corrected me immediately.

This is some info for any MA who wants to pretend they are a nurse.

http://www.fsmaonline.org/officenurse.htm

OFFICE NURSE" TITLE FOR MEDICAL ASSISTANTS IS LEGALLY DANGEROUS

By Donald A. Balasa, JD, MBA, CAE

AAMA Executive Director and Legal Council

In some circles, the term "office nurse" has come to be used interchangeably with "medical assistant." This practice is fraught with legal peril, and should be avoided at all times by medical assistants and employers.

Most states license two categories of nurses: registered nurses (RNs) and licensed practical (or vocational) nurses (LPNs or LVNs). State nursing practice acts frequently forbid any person not licensed as a nurse to practice nursing or to use the term "nurse" in reverence to themselves. If these laws are not obeyed, the persons calling themselves nurses may be subject to criminal penalties. Furthermore, an employer who calls an unlicensed employee a nurse, or knowingly allows an employee to use the title, may also be courting legal sanctions.

It is unlikely that prefacing the term "nurse" with "office" will provide a safe haven from the legal quagmire. The titles of RN, LPN, LVN and nurse are legally protected; "office nurse" has not gained legislative recognition as a title distinguishable from RN, LPN, or LVN.

Malpractice exposure can also be increased by a careless use of the title "nurse" or "office nurse". An allied health worker is held to the standard of care exercised by a reasonably competent practitioner of the profession. If it can be proved that a medical assistant held herself or himself out to the public as some sort of nurse, a civil court could hold the medical assistant to the standard of care of a nurse, which is different than that of a medical assistant.

Aside from the ethical and professional considerations, it should be apparent that legal factors strongly militate against medical assistants using the term "office nurse." In addition, employers should be told politely not to refer to medical assistants as nurses Take heed, for this is one situation in which ignorance of the law is no excuse!

Trauma Columnist · Jan 22, 2005

I'm going to close this for a little cooling off period.

LorraineCNA · Jan 22, 2005

Lorraine, I am not sure I understand who has been condescending to you. Could it be that you are feeling insecure? Let me just state, doctors do not like nurses calling themselves doctors, and nurses do not like medical assistants calling themselves nurses. It is all withing the scope of not representing yourself as something you do not have the education or license to represent yourself as, okay? Stating that fact has nothing to do with a lack of respect, just fact. And for the record, nurses really do deserve a great deal of respect, and I hope you will understand all the reasons why someday.

SOME nurses deserve a great deal of respect. I've worked with nurses I've respected and I've worked with nurses whom I didn't respect. Title has nothing to do with respect. You don't "deserve" respect. You earn it.

as far as the "and I hope you will understand all the reasons why someday". Well, I'm not exactly what you mean by that. I'm not sure if you're inferring that I'm incapable of understanding now? Are you assuming I'm some wet behind the ears kid speaking out of turn? I can assure you I'm not. Like I said respect isn't an entitlement.

Lorraine