"It shouldn't be that hard to be a nurse"

Nurses General Nursing

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Competition tough for nursing school

Earning a spot in nursing school can be tough, even in the midst of a nursing shortage.

Just ask Georgia State University student Rachel Edmundson, who has failed three times to win entry to GSU's program despite carrying a 3.29 GPA.

"I don't think it should be that hard" to become a nurse, the 21-year-old said over a chilled coffee drink near the GSU campus.

Interesting. I am sure that some of our pre-nursing and current nursing students may agree but after 16 years in this business, I am convinced that it should be that hard. Nursing is a tough field which requires smart, fast-thinking people. If there is a bright side to the nursing shortage, it's that nursing schools are forced to accept the highest quality students. And raising our standards isn't a bad thing IMO especially since people's lives rely on our skills.

Here's a little gem from her daddy:

We're not talking about medical school, we're talking about nursing school," her father, Chuck Edmundson, said

Yeah, it's only nurses and everyone knows you don't need to be that smart because after all our work isn't that critical, not like a doctor.

Specializes in Tele, ICU, ER.

Just my .02 worth. (Hey, didn't there used to be a cent sign on the keyboard? No, that's right ... you had to type a c and than backspace and type a slash. I am old enough to remember that ... :uhoh21: )

That was on the old manual typewriters LOL - thanks you brought back memories.

As for nursing school, I'm playing preceptor a lot these days - and I hope nursing school stays very competitive, but that said, GPA isn't everything. How bout picking the people with a work ethic as well as GPA! (NOT referring to ALL new grads, but a couple lately....)

Even my mother says things like that sometimes. I think a big portion of the public has no clue about what nurses really do.

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It's funny, but they do know exactly what you do when they see a family member have a sudden change of condition. But before that they seemed to think you were there to fetch drinks.

Specializes in SNF.
Competition tough for nursing school

Interesting. I am sure that some of our pre-nursing and current nursing students may agree but after 16 years in this business, I am convinced that it should be that hard. Nursing is a tough field which requires smart, fast-thinking people. If there is a bright side to the nursing shortage, it's that nursing schools are forced to accept the highest quality students. And raising our standards isn't a bad thing IMO especially since people's lives rely on our skills.

Here's a little gem from her daddy:

Yeah, it's only nurses and everyone knows you don't need to be that smart because after all our work isn't that critical, not like a doctor.

Unfreakin believable!! It needs to be that hard to get in. I am in my 5th quarter of 6 in an ADN. I have never critically thought as much as I have this quarter! Its awesome! Not everyone has the knack to be able to do it. But when you're in the ICU, and your patient isn't doing well, you don't have time to run through the renin-angiotensin feedback mechanism step by step to understand whats going on. You need to be at a much higher level of thinking beyond that to react quickly and turn that patient around.

Thats why it should be so hard to get into the nursing program.

I'm stepping off my soap box now.

Specializes in ER, Occupational Health, Cardiology.

i went to school with people who were "willing to settle" when it came to their grades-they settled for whatever the minimum was to pass. i have worked with nurses that were "willing to settle," also. they were willing to settle for the least amount of effort it took to get something done, seemingly mindless of the fact that someone's health and well-being depended on their effort, or lack of it. i swore to myself, as a student, that i would never be one of that type of nurses. i always have tried to treat my patients as though they could be one of my family, or me. (sometimes it isn't that easy!:wink2: ) i graduated with a 3.9 gpa.

to get into the class of 25, i was one of over 300 applicants. we not only had to apply to the school, we applied to the program, had to write an essay about why we wanted to become a nurse and then have a face-to-face interview with a member of the nursing faculty. some people had applied multiple times, but i was fortunate, and got in the first time.

gpas are not the only way to determine whether someone will be a good nurse or not, but they can be a reliable indicator of how hard (and thorough) someone is willing to work to get the job done.

I have heard from here that lots of nursing schools have waiting lists and competitive entrance but I don't think that is true for this region. For my school, it is a very good baccalaureate program (as good as the prestigious universities in the area, private college). And I got in right away with a GED. I made a 28 on my ACT but I still think that it was not that difficult to get into my school (and I have since heard of people getting in easily). I also think that its not that difficult to get into the other schools in my area. There are 5 other schools in my area with nursing programs, maybe thats why.

Anyway, I think a lot of this problem has to do with where you are-same as the nursing shortage. In some areas nursing jobs are hard to come by.

I do think that its pitiful that teachers get paid less than a floor nurse. I think I would really like to become a teacher, but the more I consider all of the additional school that I need and how they get paid less, the more I question whether or not I can even do it. Sad.

BTW-I'm doing great in school, will graduate soon, so they made a good choice :)

Specializes in ER.

We have allowed the "silly", "sexy", "looking for a doctor husband", mentality to permeate our culture via TV, books, magazines, etc. There have been some recent gains with letter writing and boycotts of certain programs and ads, but by and large we are still looked at as disposable, not career oriented, just looking for a date types.

The more men who come into nursing only improves our quality of life as a whole, and for that I am thankful.

I was an AS nurse graduating at the tender age of 19 to become an RN in 1973. I returned for my BSN years later. It pains me to see programs that allow someone to go through nursing school without going to nursing school. I work with such a nurse, who is very book smart, but has no practical application skills. He is struggling. He never had an opportunity to see what nursing was really like before becoming one.

RN's face increased demands on our time and knowledge as more acute patients are admitted to the hospital. We are living longer because of good medical care, but we are also seeing sicker patients because they would have died in their early years in times past. We do not have "simple" patients to help lighten the load like we did in years past. When I was in school, we may have had more patients on the floor, but many of them were in for "tests", "physicals" or "exhaustion". They required little intervention or expendature of energy on the part of the nurse. Those days are gone, and acquity is sky high,

I now think that a BSN should be an entry level and you must have been a CNA, LPN, EMT/Paramedic, etc. before being allowed in.

Yes, it may make the shortage somewhat worse in the beginning, but it would quickly improve the quality of the nurses. Obviously, current RN's should be grand fathered in without question.

One more rant that I think fits here is there is a book now called, "Nursing made incredibly easy". Does that get under anyone elses skin? The first time I heard of it, I got a flyer in the mail advertizing it, and it made me mad then and it makes me mad now. NO, a book can not and will not ever make nursing "incredible easy". Nursing is NOT incredibly easy, and never will be. The idiot who made up that name should follow me around our busy Level 1 trauma ER some night and tell me how incredibly easy my job is or can be with that stupid book!!

Rant off....I would not have the book with such a stupid title in my library.

Thanks and hats off to all the young nurses out there. It is demanding job, no doubt about it. It is frustrating, horrifying at times, physically and mentally draining, filthy and disgusting at times, and increasingly dangerous.

You have to dot every i and cross every t, many times after your shift, to keep the lawyers at bay. You spend many shifts without a sufficient break, eating greasy fried chicken strips at the desk because that is all the cafeteria has in the middle of the night, and they are portable and filling.

You go hours past when you should have emptied your bladder, but since you don't have time to drink much either, it works out.

There is new technology we must learn at every turn, new machines to check blood sugar, point of care electrolytes, traponins, UA, UPT's, ABGs, etc done by nurses now and not sent to lab. There are new IV pumps that are more difficult to program, but do more to ensure a safer delivery of life saving but dangerous meds.

More and more, we are expected to be able to intrepret EKGs, x-rays, and lab work and present our findings and concerns to the docs. We see the results first and it is our responsibility to take the appropriate action.

We are using computers for charting which will never be as fast as pen and paper, and many times things get missed because it is just too cumbersome and time consuming to document it. That is a shame. I look at printouts of computer charts and can't tell what happened to the patient. Yes, there is a med list, a check list of pulses, meals, vital signs, and a check list assessment of sorts, but I do not have feel for what has happened to that patient. There is no good narative flow to let me know what he has been through. I hate computer charting. It was designed by whom for what?? Oh, yeah, yeah, better communication between providers, I forgot.

Should nursing be easy? NO, could it be made better, safer, more efficient, more nurse and patient friendly, YES it could. And that is what we need to strive for.

Why do I go back to work everyday? Sometimes I say I will not, I will go to work in the garden department at Lowes and water flowers when I get stressed.

Why do I stay? I stay for that one patient whose life I make a difference in. It may only be one per shift and it may be several. It may be the 53 year old MI, who comes in near death and after we get him stabalized with meds, get him to the cath lab, he goes home 2 days later, when he could easily have died.

It is the scared parents of a kid who has been bitten on his face by a dog, and we can give him some Ketamine, monitor his every breath and heartbeat while he sleeps while the plastic surgeon puts him back together.

Is it the little old lady from the nursing home who falls out of her wheelchair and needs a CT scan and some TLC to be assured that she is going to be OK.

Is it the guy with the kidney stone who is near tears with pain, pale and vomiting, that you get to quickly with fluids and meds, who drifts off to sleep and his wife is telling you thank you, thank you, thank you.

Is it the scared first time mother with a child who won't stop crying and you are able to give her tips on coping and getting thru the early weeks.

Is it someone who is having a miscarriage, and all you can do is give her reassurance that she did nothing wrong and lend a shoulder to cry on.

Is it the frantic parents who run into the ER because they heard their beautiful 16 year old daughter was in a car wreck and you have to send them out with the chaplain because the trauma team is busy trying to save her life?

Are those the reasons I go back night after night, week after week, year after year. Yeah, I think it is. It is sure not the hours or the money.

Thanks for listening to an old opinioned ER nurse who used to have all the answers, and am now realizing that I am not even sure what the appropriate question should be.

Specializes in ICU, PICC Nurse, Nursing Supervisor.

only 3 times....ive been trying to get into rn school since 1994 this little girl needs to pack it up and take it home to daddy...i applied several times in the 90's didnt get in, so i retook some classes to get better grades. had babies, had crisis's but finally got in and out or lvn school. started trying again ,did get into a lvn to bsn program but failed college algebra by 1 stinking point, so they kicked me out.had more babies . since then i have been trying to get into a bridge program somewhere and get turned down every time. don't want to hear about another little twit getting mad cause she doesn't make admission...i'm on the edge of physically taking out the competition so i can get a spot (jk,lol)..

competition tough for nursing school

interesting. i am sure that some of our pre-nursing and current nursing students may agree but after 16 years in this business, i am convinced that it should be that hard. nursing is a tough field which requires smart, fast-thinking people. if there is a bright side to the nursing shortage, it's that nursing schools are forced to accept the highest quality students. and raising our standards isn't a bad thing imo especially since people's lives rely on our skills.

here's a little gem from her daddy:

yeah, it's only nurses and everyone knows you don't need to be that smart because after all our work isn't that critical, not like a doctor.

Holy cow. I'm a student myself. Had a high gpa as well. I am struggling through nursing school. And ummmm - heck YES IT SHOULD BE THAT HARD!!!! I am going to be taking care of people! DUH. Granted, I can't wait to be done with these hard classes, but geez! I want to know if what I'm doing could potentially hurt a patient and if it could, what I need to do to avoid that??? My gosh, I sure do wish people would understand that!!

Yes I agree, it is very sad and disappointing. I am on a wait list to get into the nursing program at my school. This profession is in serious need, and it isn't the lack of students but yet the lack of schools, teachers, etc.

I think nursing education needs to be seriously overhauled and the definition of nursing as a profession needs redefinition.

We have to acknowledge the history of nursing, which contributes to the confusion about the difficulty of today's nursing. Traditionally, the nurse focused on patient comfort and hygiene and carried out basic tasks. A majority of inpatients on the general floors were stable. Yesterday's nurses are today's Nursing Assistants, Medication Aides, Medical Assistants, etc.

Today, I think we should differentiate "acute care nursing" as it's own nursing specialty. Today's hospital nurse has much more direct responsibility for the medical care and monitoring of patients. The term "acute care" implies the delivery of more than just basic hygiene and routine medications. "Emergency nursing" and "critical care" nursing are already understood to be specialties that demand extra expertise. Regardless of today's reality, the term "Med-surg nursing" brings with it the history of it being entry level, thus presumably the easiest position in nursing. Maybe some other name than "acute care nursing" but something that emphasizes that today's nursing care isn't "basic."

I could even argue that we should come up with a new term to describe what acute care nurses do... because, in my opinion, they provide a lot more than "nursing care." I do think such terms make a difference. Imagine if nurse practitioners were called "advanced office nurses." Most people understand that NPs are "mini-doctors" and are confident in their abilities to diagnose and prescribe. On the other hand, "advanced office nurse" in my opinion doesn't inspire such confidence because the term "office nurse" already holds a meaning which doesn't include someone with extensive enough education to diagnose and prescribe.

Well, I could go on and on. But I'll stop! : )

Whoops - posted twice!

I think another point that can be made is that a GPA doesn't tell the whole story about a prospective student - maybe that 3.29 is comprised of a whole lot of basket weaving and some poor science grades - or maybe she lacks maturity - or maybe she picked her nose during the interview! (Or maybe she brought her Dad along!)

I don't think trend is unlike what is being seen in colleges across the nation - a high GPA/SAT isn't always a guaranteed ticket to the school of your choice.

I had a 3.8 and have no idea how I got in to anywhere, especially when I found out who my classmates are (biochem engineers, genetics specialists with oodles of experience - people with a lot more science background than someone with a BS degree and some prereqs). I would think a 3.29 wouldn't cut it in most places now, given the competition. I don't think a 3.29 is considered "high" in some places (please, please, please don't crucify me for saying that...PLEASE...consider the context....) and it's taking higher and higher GPAs to distinguish yourself.

Our admissions people said the competition here this year is FIERCE, and they're having to take GPAs out to thousandths of points to make determinations.

I would give my (personal!) opinion of her father, but I'd be warned about it.

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