is it fair to negotiate after contract has been presented?

NedRN · Feb 19, 2015

It is hard to negotiate without a proposal in front of you! It is also difficult to negotiate if you don't have other offers. Do you know this is a bad offer? If so, are you prepared to walk away? If the answer to both questions is no, you don't have a lot to negotiate with. Your only asset is that the hospital has interviewed and accepted you and if you don't take the assignment, the agency will lose their share of profits.

As as far as per diems go, the GSA rate is a maximum that can be paid without additional tax consequences. There are tax consequences to the agency and none max out per diems to the GSA rate. Some agencies will add additional tax free money but it has to come from somewhere and that would be your hourly. I gather you are just searching for a reason to raise your pay in general.

Bluebolt · Feb 19, 2015

Wow, I've never let them set up housing for me, so that number of $3,400 a month sounds terribly low. Even for the Southeast where you get paid the least usually you could negotiate $5,200 and I've even negotiated 48 hr/wk contracts with take home of $7,800 a month in Georgia. If you haven't signed the contract then of course negotiate. Let them know you're a valuable asset to their team and have another offer that is offering more. Agents will offer as little as you let them. Of course negotiate within reason and don't put all your eggs in one basket so to speak. Good luck!

michlynn, BSN, RN · Feb 19, 2015

I mean honestly I have no clue if this is a bad offer, I don't know if this is considered low for a traveler or not. It's only slightly more than what I make at my current job. I haven't looked around with other agencies because I feel like just dealing with one as a new traveler is already extremely stressful and I think I have a decent relationship with my recruiter so I get what you're saying by me not really having an argument. I basically just want to know if this rate seems OK as a first assignment and then when I prepare for a 2nd assignment I'll at least have one under my belt.

NedRN · Feb 20, 2015

The actual pay would be the last factor I would consider in a first assignment. A recruiter you have a decent relationship with is the first step. Second is if the assignment is a good fit. Hopefully that first thing, the recruiter, helped you with a good fit.

I see no harm done to ask your recruiter very directly if this is a good offer or will I be bummed if I shop around. Or, "Is this the best you can do? I'd like to work with you for a long time, and want to be assured that we both benefit."

michlynn, BSN, RN · Feb 20, 2015

Also, she gave me a quote for OT pay which the hospital agreed to, $100 for every ten hours past the contracted 36 hours/week and then time and a half past 40 but its not in the contract and she told me not to worry about it bc it's through the hospital but I feel like I should make her redo the contract with OT rates included. Right?

trinitymaster · Feb 20, 2015

Unless this is a premium assignment (Great location, Great Hospital etc.), then I would look for other offers. I lost $10,000 on my first assignment by accepting the first offer that I received.

It is basically up to you to make a decision.

Personally, I would call the recruiter and tell them that I was shopping around.

They always try to take advantage of the newbies.

raindrop · Feb 20, 2015

My current recruiter is easy and I never try to negotiate with him bc I feel like he is being extremely fair. But in thd past, my recruiters act like there is no room for negotions bc this is what the hospital is offering. I once told my recruiter, no this is what YOU are offering, the hospital has no idea what YOU are paying me. She said that is not true.

NedRN · Feb 20, 2015

You are right. The hospital doesn't see your contract. All they know is your all inclusive agency bill rate.

PacoUSA, BSN, RN · Feb 21, 2015

Also, she gave me a quote for OT pay which the hospital agreed to, $100 for every ten hours past the contracted 36 hours/week and then time and a half past 40 but its not in the contract and she told me not to worry about it bc it's through the hospital but I feel like I should make her redo the contract with OT rates included. Right?

I now know which agency you're negotiating with, because my agency offers the same thing: $100 bonus after every 10 hours of overtime. That is not in my contract because it started after my assignment started but it's an agency-wide bonus program. I thereafter once worked an extra 12 hour shift one pay period and indeed the $100 was paid to me automatically on top of my time and a half.

My opinion: get the first assignment under your belt without being too picky. You'll see things get easier after that.

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NedRN · Feb 21, 2015

$10 an hour bonus only after you get to 10 hours of overtime is pathetic. Let me explain why. Most travel assignments pay between $40 and $50 an hour when you include all your compensation including housing and per diem. The OP said her base is $24 an hour so I assume her OT is $36 an hour. This represents a drop in pay for working overtime!

I am not impressed with a $10 an hour bonus either. $46 an hour may still be a drop in the effective pay rate. And it sounds like the way this bonus is calculated, it will only be $10 an hour if exactly 10 hours are worked. Otherwise it is less!

Some simple math shows how much the agency is profiting here from our extra labor. $60 an hour is a typical bill rate sufficient to support the above offer and give the agency a healthy and fair profit margin. While OT bill rates vary, time and a half on the bill rate is still fairly common. So that is $90 an hour. The agency has already paid for housing and per diem and is now making $40 an hour pure profit (adding ten percent to the cost of paying the traveler for payroll taxes)!!!! That is huge!

Even a flat rate contract (which are exceedingly rare) would support a traveler OT rate of over $50 and still leave the agency with "found" money over and above what they had already calculated was a fair profit for the entire assignment.

You can choose to be exploited if you want to, but simply fair OT pay benefits the agency as well. If they provide sufficient incentive to the traveler to work extra hours, they will make more too. Otherwise, why work overtime for less?

I'd be interested to know what agency this is. I've not heard of this particular scheme before. I know of two agencies, Emerald and Supplemental, that offer extra shift bonuses of over $200 a shift. I don't like that either (it cuts me out of a lot of fair rate overtime working late in the operating room) but is definitely better than your agency's scheme.

michlynn, BSN, RN · Feb 21, 2015

Well thanks for all of the advice, everyone! I think I'm just as confused as ever lol! I've got some people saying suck it up and some saying request more. So I guess I need to think about it over the weekend and let them know for sure by Monday. I think this is a great assignment, great location (oceanside for the whole summer) so I guess if I'm going to try and negotiate for more then I don't really want to go overboard. I guess now I'm just wondering how much I should really be asking for? Do recruiters usually tell you no? Feel free to PM me if you feel uncomfortable sharing info publicly.