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Obama's health plan takes shape



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No. 110
from RN4MERCY
Old Aug 04, 2009, 03:16 PM

Lightbulb Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
Originally Posted by K98 View Post
Of all of the bad alternatives, single payer is the absolute worst.
Why?
From my point of view, and, according to the American Association of the Colleges of Nursing,
here are the values that form the cornerstone of professional nursing:
AUTONOMY
HUMAN DIGNITY
INTEGRITY
ALTRUISM
SOCIAL JUSTICE

Americans want: guaranteed access, free choice of doctor or nurse practitioner, high quality, affordability, trust and respect

Canadians get: life expectancy two years longer, infant deaths 25% lower, more MD visits, hospital care, less bureaucracy; universal comprehensive coverage, quality of care equivalent to "insured" Americans', free choice of doctor/hospital, per capita health spending half of US level, access to all medically necessary preventative and restorative health care

Americans get: one third of population uninsured or underinsured, HMOs denying care to millions more with expensive illnesses, death rates higher than any other wealthy nation, costs double Canada, Germany, Sweden's and rising even faster, executives and investors making billions, destruction of the patient/provider relationship, denied admission, delayed treatment, early discharge, poverty/inability to pay prevents them from receiving the benefit of ongoing nursing care, insurers in charge of who gets care, if they get care or meds, instead of professionals

In what way is support of the for-profit insurance industry congruent with those values that are at the core of our profession?

Single payer is fiscally conservative and publicly accountable. It's the most reasonable and responsible health policy. Patients still have the choice to receive their care from any of the existing private or public clinics. The disparities and iniquity would be eliminated and we would have the opportunity to credibly assert that we are indeed one nation, with liberty and justice for all. We're all in this together; we're not just a nation of individuals competing with one another.
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No. 111
Old Aug 04, 2009, 05:55 PM

Default Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
The US Govt has mis-managed Medicare/-aid. It is insolvent. Now the Feds are trying to take advantage of the 'economy of scale' by adding all of the US citizenry, creating 'Medicare for All'. Why won't this work? The government chronically mismanages our tax dollars. And why is America so angry about this?? Partly because they realize they will lose the quality of health care they now enjoy, but ALSO because Congress is being disingenuous.
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No. 112
from CRNA2007
Old Aug 04, 2009, 07:50 PM

Default Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
were not all in this together. You have the few paying for the many. We will all be in it otgether when everyone pays their fair share for healthcare coverage. By the way Canadians have a higher death rate from cancer. You can't have low cost and quality without rationing or simply denying procedures period end of discussion!



Originally Posted by RN4MERCY View Post
Why?
From my point of view, and, according to the American Association of the Colleges of Nursing,
here are the values that form the cornerstone of professional nursing:
AUTONOMY
HUMAN DIGNITY
INTEGRITY
ALTRUISM
SOCIAL JUSTICE

Americans want: guaranteed access, free choice of doctor or nurse practitioner, high quality, affordability, trust and respect

Canadians get: life expectancy two years longer, infant deaths 25% lower, more MD visits, hospital care, less bureaucracy; universal comprehensive coverage, quality of care equivalent to "insured" Americans', free choice of doctor/hospital, per capita health spending half of US level, access to all medically necessary preventative and restorative health care

Americans get: one third of population uninsured or underinsured, HMOs denying care to millions more with expensive illnesses, death rates higher than any other wealthy nation, costs double Canada, Germany, Sweden's and rising even faster, executives and investors making billions, destruction of the patient/provider relationship, denied admission, delayed treatment, early discharge, poverty/inability to pay prevents them from receiving the benefit of ongoing nursing care, insurers in charge of who gets care, if they get care or meds, instead of professionals

In what way is support of the for-profit insurance industry congruent with those values that are at the core of our profession?

Single payer is fiscally conservative and publicly accountable. It's the most reasonable and responsible health policy. Patients still have the choice to receive their care from any of the existing private or public clinics. The disparities and iniquity would be eliminated and we would have the opportunity to credibly assert that we are indeed one nation, with liberty and justice for all. We're all in this together; we're not just a nation of individuals competing with one another.
Top
 
No. 113
from UKRNinUSA
Old Aug 04, 2009, 08:54 PM

Default Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
Originally Posted by WORKINGWOMANINTN View Post
The US Govt has mis-managed Medicare/-aid. It is insolvent.
The reason Medicare is insolvent is because the Medicare population is full of high-cost users -the disabled and the over 65's.
Expand Medicare to all, dilute the user pool with low-cost users and you will solve the problem.

Alternatively, we could have assisted suicide legislation passed in all 50 states and then we won't need to worry about reforming healthcare at all.
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No. 114
Old Aug 04, 2009, 10:16 PM

Default Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
Good one, UKRNinUSA! Nah, I'd don't suppose we need to go down the 'assisted-suicide' route. At least part of Medicare's problem is that anyone over 65 MUST use Medicare as their primary -- even if they have other options. So that's one 'easy' fix. The gov't has been trying to expand Medicare for years --- we need to reverse it and eliminate it.
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No. 115
from UKRNinUSA
Old Aug 04, 2009, 10:47 PM

Default Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
Eliminate Medicare? are you serious? Try running for public office on that platform!
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No. 116
from CRNA2007
Old Aug 04, 2009, 11:13 PM

Default Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
If you are going to eliminate good healthcare for people you don't do it outright you run on a good sound bite that fools people easily like maybe Change and Hope. Yeah that one would work great. Kind of like Changing your employment status to unemployed and then HOPING to get a new job before unemployment runs out.






Originally Posted by UKRNinUSA View Post
Eliminate Medicare? are you serious? Try running for public office on that platform!
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No. 117
from UKRNinUSA
Old Aug 05, 2009, 11:56 AM

Default Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
Originally Posted by CRNA2007 View Post
If you are going to eliminate good healthcare for people you don't do it outright you run on a good sound bite that fools people easily like maybe Change and Hope. Yeah that one would work great. Kind of like Changing your employment status to unemployed and then HOPING to get a new job before unemployment runs out.
Yes indeed -it was a great campaign. Obama won the election with a positive message in juxtaposition to the right who continued with their message of pessimism and paranoia, and lost the election.

YES WE CAN vs. JUST SAY NO -you choose -which mantra is more productive ?
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No. 118
from CRNA2007
Old Aug 05, 2009, 05:30 PM

Default Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
Obama's poll numbers are sinking faster than the titanic, democrats are getting pounded by citizens in their own districts when trying to talk about the health care reform scheme. The smoke and mirrors are starting to wear thin. Reminds me of 1994 when Hillary care cost the democrats the House and Senate.



Originally Posted by UKRNinUSA View Post
Yes indeed -it was a great campaign. Obama won the election with a positive message in juxtaposition to the right who continued with their message of pessimism and paranoia, and lost the election.

YES WE CAN vs. JUST SAY NO -you choose -which mantra is more productive ?
Top
 
No. 119
from UKRNinUSA
Old Aug 06, 2009, 12:23 AM

Default Re: Obama's health plan takes shape
Originally Posted by CRNA2007 View Post
Obama's poll numbers are sinking faster than the titanic, democrats are getting pounded by citizens in their own districts when trying to talk about the health care reform scheme. The smoke and mirrors are starting to wear thin. Reminds me of 1994 when Hillary care cost the democrats the House and Senate.
I wonder who is behind that -perhaps the health insurance company lobbyists that are spending $1.4 million dollars a day against the "scheme"? Hmmmm
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