Why do nurses constantly say they don't hire ASN?

Nursing Students ADN/BSN

Published

OK this is funny because every Magnet hospital I go to someone who doesn't work in HR or is NOT a hiring Manager just has to say they don't hire Associate Degree nurses. I have been asked to be hired at some other Magnet hospitals. Reasons like this, bullying, bad staffing, etc. have made me just complete my assignment and go to the next one. I started liking working where I am now, at a Magnet hospital, probably one of the ones who started the trend. It came up as a discussion because my contract was extended after only two weeks of starting. Then a couple of nurses who were overhearing the conversation said I would never get hired due to my lame degree status. Le sigh... :no: Some of the ASNs themselves. Just for the record. I am a 8 year experienced ASN with great references so it isn't like I am new at this kind of thing.

It just doesn't happen there, I have seen nurses do it on here to others. It is harder to get in I guess, but when you have experience it isn't so hard. At least for me. I am not sure about a New Grads, but hey what do I know. Maybe in the universe there is a New Grad ASN out there who did get hired with persistence at these Magnet hospitals! Especially, if they are enrolled or attending a BSN program.

Listen unless if you are not a hiring person don't say this. Why? I just don't understand it. Does it make you feel better? If someone has an Associate's Degree gets hire in a Magnet hospital, is willing to upgrade their education status, what they heck is it to you?

Just a rant I guess. Hopefully, this will be the last stop so I can continue on with my education. But, I won't ever be like, "They don't hire your kind here." :sarcastic:

Specializes in Pediatrics, Emergency, Trauma.

Shoot me for it if you must, but I believe that's part of the problem. Until the powers that be establish a pay scale reflective of the education attained like the rest of the working world has, there will be no changes made in the level of education required. Because I see THAT as one of the few arguements for this that holds water: there's absolutely no incentive to actually complete a BSN if your goal is to stay at the bedside - which is where we DESPERATELY need experienced nurses to stay!!

I would also submit that hospital management needs to change its opinion of and the way it treats its RN staff, or no one will bother with a BS degree. Who in the name of God wants to get a BS (or really, any degree - any RN!), go through the rigor and the expense, and be treated no different than the janitor?

I think part of the push behind the whole BS thing is this: the thinking, though it's never said, is that if we've all got BS degrees, this treating of RNs like chattel will stop.

I'm here to say it won't.

What will stop it is start putting RNs and NPs and other RNs with more advanced degrees in medical schools as instructors. Stop this ridiculous division between the 'classes' (because that's what it is, folks, it's a caste system in many cases), stop trying to set us apart (please, please don't let me get started on why I think all this nursing diagnosis garbage damages the profession), start INTEGRATING US AS PART OF THE TEAM, regardless of what our educational background is.

Stop letting med students get away with treating RNs - TRAINED PROFESSIONALS - like handmaidens. We know they do it. We've all seen it and we've all been subjected to it. I for one call them out on it! (It's one lovely thing about the military, really - I am now the same rank as most of the MDs - and I've actually looked at a few smartmouths and said, 'Really, Captain? Because you do realize we're both captains, right?' Surgical residents, who are notorious for this, hate it. Suck it up - you're no better than I and you're not even in my chain of command, so chill out, please. Especially if we're the same rank - you do not walk on water!)

Stop taking crap from physicians that is nothing but abuse, and stop letting management kowtow to physicians. We've given the administrators all the power. Why? No other profession lets this happen. Even TEACHERS are starting to say ENOUGH, and more power to them! (Google the system in Seattle who told the administrators to take their crappy standardized tests and shove them - and won.)

If we did this, the degree might matter a bit less. If we'd stop acting like cowering puppies and start acting like professionals, we might get a bit further.

^Agree!!! :yes:

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
I'm going to get flamed for this, but I read on a link someone provided elsewhere on the board - I think it was from the American Association of Colleges of Nursing or whatever the name of that group is, and it was recent - that 60% of the workforce holds an AD/ASN.

There's your answer. Sorry, but I think it's true.

*** I don't understand how 60% of the work force holding ADNs explains why there is no increase in pay for BSNs? Seems logical to me that if the cost of entry to the profession is going to take twice as long (4 years vs 2) and the cost is going to increase 10x (60K for BSN in my state vs $6K for ADN) then there should be some increase in compensation for the added time and money invested.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH THIS. Problem is I can't hit the 'like' button enough.

I was shocked when I learned prior to getting my BSN that there was no (at least starting) difference in pay for ANY RN. (I didn't care, I was still going, but that didn't change the fact that I was very surprised.)

Shoot me for it if you must, but I believe that's part of the problem. Until the powers that be establish a pay scale reflective of the education attained like the rest of the working world has, there will be no changes made in the level of education required. Because I see THAT as one of the few arguements for this that holds water: there's absolutely no incentive to actually complete a BSN if your goal is to stay at the bedside - which is where we DESPERATELY need experienced nurses to stay!!

I would also submit that hospital management needs to change its opinion of and the way it treats its RN staff, or no one will bother with a BS degree. Who in the name of God wants to get a BS (or really, any degree - any RN!), go through the rigor and the expense, and be treated no different than the janitor?

I think part of the push behind the whole BS thing is this: the thinking, though it's never said, is that if we've all got BS degrees, this treating of RNs like chattel will stop.

I'm here to say it won't.

What will stop it is start putting RNs and NPs and other RNs with more advanced degrees in medical schools as instructors. Stop this ridiculous division between the 'classes' (because that's what it is, folks, it's a caste system in many cases), stop trying to set us apart (please, please don't let me get started on why I think all this nursing diagnosis garbage damages the profession), start INTEGRATING US AS PART OF THE TEAM, regardless of what our educational background is.

Stop letting med students get away with treating RNs - TRAINED PROFESSIONALS - like handmaidens. We know they do it. We've all seen it and we've all been subjected to it. I for one call them out on it! (It's one lovely thing about the military, really - I am now the same rank as most of the MDs - and I've actually looked at a few smartmouths and said, 'Really, Captain? Because you do realize we're both captains, right?' Surgical residents, who are notorious for this, hate it. Suck it up - you're no better than I and you're not even in my chain of command, so chill out, please. Especially if we're the same rank - you do not walk on water!)

Stop taking crap from physicians that is nothing but abuse, and stop letting management kowtow to physicians. We've given the administrators all the power. Why? No other profession lets this happen. Even TEACHERS are starting to say ENOUGH, and more power to them! (Google the system in Seattle who told the administrators to take their crappy standardized tests and shove them - and won.)

If we did this, the degree might matter a bit less. If we'd stop acting like cowering puppies and start acting like professionals, we might get a bit further.

I sound like Jimmy Hoffa. We all know what happened to him....:uhoh3: And they are building a new parking deck over on the Air Force base...

*** Well said.

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Because why would the majority want a raise for a minority?

And thanks, BTW.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
Because why would the majority want a raise for a minority?

And thanks, BTW.

*** I don't think what nurses want has much effect on our rate of pay. It used to, back when there were a lot of open nursing positions, but not now.

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I think it does.

I think if we told hospitals to stick it, regardless of how many people are in line for a job, they'd change. What if we all said uh, no, I'm worth more than 20 bucks an hour? It would actually change. You want a BSN? Then pay me for it.

Even when it was a nurse's market, no one did this.

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And yep, there are RNs in this country starting for just a couple of dollars more than that. With BSNs.

In 2008, I made $19.34 an hour. And every hospital in the area was paying exactly the same, give or take a few cents - which to me reeked of price fixing. The only place not paying that was the VA.

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Specializes in CVICU.

Uh, I have a BSN and a BS in Applied mathematics so I'm not sure what you're on about as you said nothing to convince anyone that a BSN is necessary for a staff nurse not wanting to go to grad school.

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Specializes in OB-Gyn/Primary Care/Ambulatory Leadership.

How about learning for its own sake? Is it *necessary*? No, but that doesn't mean it's stupid or pointless.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, Emergency, Trauma.
How about learning for its own sake? Is it *necessary*? No but that doesn't mean it's stupid or pointless.[/quote']

I think (I hope) we can agree that being knowledgable and continuing and/or expanding education and knowledge as a nurse to help better serve our patients is prudent...I think it comes down to the fact that in some (more likely most) instances the "investment" benefit in the scheme of our profession has not occurred for a long time...In some of the more recent posts, it's looking like healthcare as a whole will be nurse driven...it will happen, but it doesn't mean we have to sit and have these discussions and scoff at expanding knowledge at any capacity...the system can be tweaked and improved by the benefit of US...the nurses at the bedside.

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Uh, I have a BSN and a BS in Applied mathematics so I'm not sure what you're on about as you said nothing to convince anyone that a BSN is necessary for a staff nurse not wanting to go to grad school.

My last comment was a response to an earlier comment, an extension of the conversation. I've actually said quite a bit.

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I think (I hope) we can agree that being knowledgable and continuing and/or expanding education and knowledge as a nurse to help better serve our patients is prudent...I think it comes down to the fact that in some (more likely most) instances the "investment" benefit in the scheme of our profession has not occurred for a long time...In some of the more recent posts, it's looking like healthcare as a whole will be nurse driven...it will happen, but it doesn't mean we have to sit and have these discussions and scoff at expanding knowledge at any capacity...the system can be tweaked and improved by the benefit of US...the nurses at the bedside.

IMO that comes full circle to my rave :) about how nursing is regarded by the rest of the health care staff earlier, when I said I sounded like Hoffa.

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