RN-BSN Student Knows Too Much

  1. Just wanted to get others' takes on this:

    What do you do when your pathology instructor expects you to cite references but you literally can just rattle off symptoms, pathos and treatments without cracking a book? fake cite to make them happy or tell them you know this info by heart?




    *this is a discussion and not a formal paper
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  2. Poll: Do I cite information I know in my bones?

    • Yes, find the citations even tho' you got this! Appease the graders.

      84.62% 11
    • No, let them know that this information is part of your DNA now.

      15.38% 2
    13 Votes
  3. 12 Comments

  4. by   PeakRN
    I would make the situation as adversarial as possible. Why take ten seconds to cite a book when you can risk your grade and waste so much time!
  5. by   NurseDrizzles
    Whoa, friendly question met with some sarcasm. Ouch. Simply asking about a balance between displaying knowledge ive mastered and pulling a citation for the sake of pulling one.

    Thanks for your help.
  6. by   elkpark
    This is no different than being expected to "show your work" in a math class. In scientific settings, you cite your references. Information that is "part of your DNA" doesn't really count. Hence the term "evidence-based" (I'm sure you've run into that one in nursing school). I don't understand why this would be a surprise or big deal to anyone. And what on earth would "fake cit(ing)" be? Being prepared to support your position with evidence is in no way "appeasing the graders," it's how the scientific world works, and nursing is at least trying to be scientific.
  7. by   NurseDrizzles
    that's a more constructive explaination than the first.

    I guess I should have broken it down more clearly. When you're writing an informal post, and you feel well-versed with the material HOW do you choose what to cite? I feel like i'm arbitrarily picking some facts to add a citation to for the sake of having a citation.

    How does a student find a balance between adding the appropriate citations while also providing information that is learned on the job?
  8. by   NurseDrizzles
    Also, I'm disappointed with the level of bite I've received in response, so far. This is how a community shares information and educates newbies? Cool.
  9. by   meanmaryjean
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    Also, I'm disappointed with the level of bite I've received in response, so far. This is how a community shares information and educates newbies? Cool.
    Honestly, you have 15 months of experience and are too good to cite sources? " You literally can just rattle off symptoms, pathos and treatments without cracking a book? " Color me skeptical.
  10. by   chare
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    […]
    What do you do when your pathology instructor expects you to cite references but you literally can just rattle off symptoms, pathos and treatments without cracking a book? fake cite to make them happy or tell them you know this info by heart?
    […]
    If, by this you mean to randomly list a source, then no, I would not recommend this. If you do opt to do this, and your instructor finds out, be prepared to be dismissed from your program as this is academic dishonesty.

    Also, it might surprise you to know that instructors frequently check references, for this very reason.
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    Whoa, friendly question met with some sarcasm. Ouch. Simply asking about a balance between displaying knowledge ive mastered and pulling a citation for the sake of pulling one.
    […]
    Regardless of whether it's knowledge that you've "mastered" or not, the expectation is that you cite your sources. You will find, as you continue your education that this is going to be rule, rather than the exception.
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    […]
    I guess I should have broken it down more clearly. When you're writing an informal post, and you feel well-versed with the material HOW do you choose what to cite? I feel like i'm arbitrarily picking some facts to add a citation to for the sake of having a citation.
    […]
    Regardless of whether it's an informal post, or paper submitted as another of your class assignments, if the instructor requires that you cite your response, you cite your response. The reason for this is much more that merely having you do so for the "sake of having a citation." Doing so allows the reader to go to your source, so that he or she can either confirm the accuracy of what you've written, or further investigate the topic of they so desire.
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    […]
    How does a student find a balance between adding the appropriate citations while also providing information that is learned on the job?
    There is no "balance." If the instructor requires that you cite all posts, then you either do so, or risk failing the assignment.
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    Also, I'm disappointed with the level of bite I've received in response, so far. This is how a community shares information and educates newbies? Cool.
    The fact that you've come here and asked if it's acceptable to lie in completing an academic assignment, rather than actually take the time to cite appropriately might have something to do with the limited responses you've received thus far.

    Best wishes as you continue your BSN program, especially if you go tilting at this windmill.
  11. by   203bravo
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    I feel like i'm arbitrarily picking some facts to add a citation to for the sake of having a citation.
    You've missed your true advantage to this situation.. You don't pick some facts to add a citation for the sake of having a citation.. If you have knowledge that you know to be true from your experience, expertise, and education, then include that information and do a quick search for a legitimate source to support that information.. Then you're done... It will be a faster process than some of your classmates that must find sources related to the topic and read through those sources in order to construct their response.

    Use your knowledge to your advantage.
  12. by   FolksBtrippin
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    that's a more constructive explaination than the first.

    I guess I should have broken it down more clearly. When you're writing an informal post, and you feel well-versed with the material HOW do you choose what to cite? I feel like i'm arbitrarily picking some facts to add a citation to for the sake of having a citation.

    How does a student find a balance between adding the appropriate citations while also providing information that is learned on the job?
    You need to cite everything.

    If you write it, you cite it.

    or

    Check yo' self before you wreck yo' self


    Education is about challenging your beliefs. Are they true? How do I REALLY know that thing I think I know? One of the main ways you do this is by being forced to cite everything you state. You will find that some things you always believed were actually not backed up by science. That's good. That's what education is about.

    Of course, when you're working you don't always have the time to do that. But going back to school is the place it happens. We get new info, it gets tested, and then we do things differently if we need to.

    Never, ever, ever fake cite. Make less claims if you need to. That's okay. But do NOT fake a citation.
  13. by   nursetobex2
    Also, while finding sources to support your statements, you might even find a fact or two that adds to your knowledge! I know I tend to get very involved in reading article sources I cite.
  14. by   Apple-Core
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    Also, I'm disappointed with the level of bite I've received in response, so far. This is how a community shares information and educates newbies? Cool.
    With respect, your initial post comes off as arrogant and over-inflated. You're posting in a forum where some nurses have in excess of 40 years experience. You have less than 18 months. Hence, to say you "know it all" (which is pretty much what you said) is full of hubris and is going to get some heckles raised. A little humility would serve you much better because, despite your claim, there is so, so much for you to learn, just as there is for all of us.

    With regard to you actual question though, no - do not "fake cite" or just find something to cite for the sake of it.

    Given you already understand the subject, why not use this opportunity to take it to the next level and bring in some information that supports your position or thinking but it new information to you? How about something that challenges your thinking, or rebuts your position. Or something that is more in depth than what you learnt in your ADN?

    Could you perhaps give an example question and part of your response so we can see exactly what you mean?
  15. by   Tacomaboy3
    Quote from NurseDrizzles
    Just wanted to get others' takes on this:

    What do you do when your pathology instructor expects you to cite references but you literally can just rattle off symptoms, pathos and treatments without cracking a book? fake cite to make them happy or tell them you know this info by heart?




    *this is a discussion and not a formal paper
    Welcome to the game of school. School and earning the grade is more about jumping through hoops and following directions. Success in academics measures obedience and compliance, memorization/regurgitation (and sometimes creativity), not necessarily intelligence.

    It sounds like using citations in this informal discussion board isn't a hoop you want to jump through. Why?

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