All of a sudden an ASN is no good anymore

Nursing Students ADN/BSN

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I worked my behind off for this ASN. I'd been in college for years until then with the usual useless liberal arts degree because "if I did what I loved I'd never work a day in my life" and was completely useless when it came to getting a job. So when I started as a nurse I was beside myself with joy to have, finally, a real job.

Now fifteen years later, it appears the entire state is pushing for all nurses to have a Bachelor's- hospitals don't even interview without one.

I have experience. And no offense to those of you with advanced degrees, but you couldn't hold my penlight. I've been at countless BSN's side when they have to assist an MD and they fall apart- they can't understand a sterile field, they wonder whether they're actually supposed to hold open a wound, they don't know how to wrap a bandage. A wound vac is from a foreign planet to them.

And those Master's trained RNs, geez. I can see that in your graduate studies you never learned how to start an IV, nor an NGT, and you certainly don't know how to irrigate a foley. That last one becomes comical until that MSN is found trying to irrigate the bubble.

Forgive me for my insolence, oh advanced degrees. I have experience. If I were ill, I would want an experienced nurse, not a college kid who read books about nursing until he got all the answers right on the test. But as has always, always been the case in this country, experience means nothing. Only that little piece of paper. And I'm too darn old to go back to school. Say what you want, but there is a place where you want to enjoy life, and reading textbooks is not a part of that.

I just wonder whose pockets are being filled by making those degrees the law of the land.

I have my adn and yes coming out of the gate in my area we have more clinical experience than bsn students but what matters is how fast you learn and adapt in the real world. Give all new grads 6mths to a year before you judge their skills. The only bsn I really let have it was one who thought that they were on a better level than any adn because they finished twice the credits in college. That person came across as thinking they were better than any adn out there. I have issues with people like that. Dont resent people because of your own choices. Things change and people adapt or they do not. Think back to when the computer was introduced to the workplace. People had to adapt or be replaced by what the company was looking for. It happens in every field and is part of the game.

I am an ASN with a prior BA in psychology... Having a tough time getting a job... Can't afford to work on a BSN until I get working! Realized how important it is to have called upon references from coworkers even when they were not a part of my nursing life... Wish me luck... Big interview next Thursday and they called me based in my references... My resume got buried in emails...

Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.

I think we are all tired with the BSN/ADN/diploma......

this horse has been beaten to death th_beating_a_dead_horseemoticon.gif.

I grow tired of the disrespect from the BSN to the ADN as if "they" ( the collective they) are somehow superior and the ADN grad is inferior. We ALL pass the same testing, thereby making us ALL RN's that are capable of caring for patients, legally and ethically. I know that all the BSN students have been fed their superior education by the very people that have a vested interest on the enrollment to their program. That is just like every other big business/wall street/ponzi scheme you have the fox watching the hen house.

This argument is talking a whole generation of nurses and chucking them to the curb. ALL these ADN/ASN grads have valuable education and experience. Many of us have had extremely successful careers, and don't possess a "higher degree", LONG before the new wave of superiority......my degree is bigger than your degree........ reared it's ugly head. When I went to school they were going to "phase out" the diploma schools within 2 years. Here it is 34 years alter and there are still diploma schools here in the US. Still graduating graduates that can take and pass the boards.

My generation never tried to chuck all the "diploma grads" and treat them with disrespect because I had more "education" than they had......I respected them and their bedside experience and learned from them, and the LPN, how to be a good nurse. I respect those who came before me. I never scoffed at their education nor their experience. We are all on the same team after all.....right?

Somewhere in this argument I smell fraud for schools are still telling graduates that they will find jobs and the governing "advanced degrees" running the show....still accredit and approve these schools....graduate grads knowing full well they can't find jobs as the hiring bodies want a different medication. Then once they graduate and take their students money...they roll over and play dead saying....well they should have checked first. Come gives us your money.....well will get you a job, there is a shortage you know. What a bunch of baloney.....

I see another collapse from corporate greed and that will be the schools (charging thousands of dollars to a desperate public wanting to work) and the financial institutions doling out loans when these loans can't be repaid.

They are talking out of both sides of their mouths and THAT I find not only irritating, but disappointing. How sad that what is being advocated is lateral violence and bullying. Taunting someone with "my education is better than your education" "Your education is no good, mine is better" ......is being a bully. As better educated individual shouldn't we know better?

My only question to the BSN bandwagon is ........What are your thoughts going to be that after 30 years of bedside nursing, it is decided that having an MSN is the "only bedside education to have" and you are being laid off, downsized with kids in college and you can't find a job as you are no longer "good enough". YOu are paying for you children education, have a mortage, had a great job abd benefits until the hospital downsized and now you can't get a job, you just aren't good enough any more. YOu have had all your continuing education and struggle hard to keep current, but then again you are active in the field right?

How will you feel then?

Re-read this whole thread.....fast forward, thirty years from now you are in the position of the ADN grad being addressed by the fresh "better educated" new grad MSN.....how would you feel to be told you just aren't any good any more.

There but for the grace of GOD go I........we can all debate this subject but please be respectful and nice to each other.

So many things that I could say, but I'm too busy trying to figure out what's so special about OP's penlight that it's harder to hold than mine...

Academia is the next bubble to burst. People cannot afford college as is, and as states cut budgets there will be more of a push for quick certificate programs, and more hands on education giving us even more of a ruling and worker class set up. College tuition has risen 440% in 25 years. It is an unsustainable rate.

Bedside nursing does not require a BSN, however it does require a commitment to education. I'm not sure why people don't address issues as they arise. When someone is rude to me, or condescending I just say, "You know what you said there was a little rude," and they apologize, and the problem is solved. Many times people speak before they think so you have to retrain them to think.

Of course it also helps that I don't compare myself to anyone to even allow for a feeling of inferiority or superiority.

Just to help dispel the rumor...

I had stats (scored VERY high) and two chem classes (don't remember exact grades, but scored an A in both)...

oh and I'm and ADN-RN.

Paper pencil from which ADN program did you graduate?

Specializes in Hospital Education Coordinator.

get over it. Go back to school.

Specializes in CRNA, Finally retired.

I went through BSN in the 70's and the writing was already on the wall as to increasing entry to practice as health care would increasingly become more regimented and level of education more important. That was 40 years ago. If someone is denied a position because of lack of BSN, then remove your head from rectum and get back to school. And don' t use family or money as excuse. I went to an inner city college and ate pizza and Rice-a-Roni for years and worked part time. Nursing seems to be the only trade/profession whose members complain about educational standards. Low educational requirements and poor workimg conditions are inexcorably li ked.

My only question to the BSN bandwagon is ........What are your thoughts going to be that after 30 years of bedside nursing, it is decided that having an MSN is the "only bedside education to have" and you are being laid off, downsized with kids in college and you can't find a job as you are no longer "good enough". YOu are paying for you children education, have a mortage, had a great job abd benefits until the hospital downsized and now you can't get a job, you just aren't good enough any more. YOu have had all your continuing education and struggle hard to keep current, but then again you are active in the field right?How will you feel then? Re-read this whole thread.....fast forward, thirty years from now you are in the position of the ADN grad being addressed by the fresh "better educated" new grad MSN.....how would you feel to be told you just aren't any good any more. There but for the grace of GOD go I........we can all debate this subject but please be respectful and nice to each other.
Well, Esme, when I was getting ready to go to nursing school, I had a choice between an ADN program with no debt or a BSN program with debt. I live in a very tough job market that is even tougher for ADN new grads than it is for BSN new grads. So I picked the debt and the BSN.

In 30 years, hopefully I would have been watching the trends in healthcare hiring as closely as I was in the years leading up to nursing school. Hiring trends don't change over night. They just don't. I don't take continued employment for granted, and expect to need to invest more in my education down the road. But I'm not going to be ranting about how stupid and worthless nurses who already got their MSN are. Or suggesting that they must not know financial struggle because they found a way to pay for school with kids and mortgages.

Specializes in geriatrics.

Agreed. We as nurses, especially the collective body on AN do not set the standards. We can debate all we like, but the attacking and generalizations need to end. It isn't healthy. Education standards change in all professions. Once upon a time, a high school diploma was enough. Not so anymore. Where I live, the MSN is now required for advanced practise. Sure, I can disagree or complain all I like. Doesn't change anything. So, if you want the opportunities, the option is clear. Go back to school.

I have to be honest; I too am tired of the ADN vs BSN debate but I even more tired of the older people speaking poorly of younger people. Not every young person is lazy. Also, I don't have like 15 years experience because guess what? Fifteen years ago, I was in elementary school. My point is a young person doesn't have the experience a lot of times because they are physically younger than you. I am finding more and more, it's the older people who are disrespectful. There are hard working older people and hard working younger people and there are lazy older people and lazy younger people. Age does not necessarily equal wisdom or experience (there's some people who went into nursing in their 50s) and definitely does not automatically mean you deserve respect and your younger counterparts do not.

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