ADN's being pushed out - page 8
by pammc000 113,164 Views | 650 Comments
I work for a large Magnet hospital. As nursing becomes more popular, and nurses not in short supply, I have noticed something ominous has being going on lately. Several of our older and very seasoned ADN nurses are being fired.... Read More
- 2Aug 12, '12 by redhead_NURSE98!Quote from RN In FL"Many?" She mentioned one that does this. My ASN program had more clinical hours than the BSN program from the same college, and our NCLEX pass rate was better. Sad but it seems it's school by school.I didn't realize many ADN programs utilized the simulation labs opposed to actual clinical rotation.
- 8Aug 12, '12 by VivaLasViejas GuideAfter reading this thread, I've come to the conclusion that I must be a throwback to the "good old days", even though I graduated from an ADN program in 1997 and never went further. I've been able to go as far as I wanted to with my associate's degree; last winter I was even offered a position as the national Director of Clinical Operations for my company, despite their knowledge that I'm "only" an ADN. The VP of Clinical Ops put it this way: "We don't care if you've got two initials or twenty behind your name---you know your stuff and that's the only thing that matters!"
I turned down the position because I'm not a big fan of spending my life in airports; but the point was driven home that my life experience and competence as a nurse were what had induced the company to offer me this opportunity for advancement. Don't get me wrong---I'm all for education! Indeed, my advice to nursing students nowadays is to go straight for the BSN (or even the MSN) because it's so much easier than going back for it later (or not at all). But those of us with ADNs and years of experience, who are too tapped out financially and physically to even want to go back to school, should be allowed to finish out our careers without being forced to wrestle with O-Chem and Statistics in our twilight years. Just saying.
- 1Aug 13, '12 by DoGoodThenGoQuote from redhead_NURSE98!More and more programs of all stripes are relying upon increased use of simulation labs for various reasons.Everything from shortage of qualified clinical instuctors to available facilities with open slots for students are being blamed (if that is the proper word) for nursing schools having to use labs more than bedside for learning skills."Many?" She mentioned one that does this. My ASN program had more clinical hours than the BSN program from the same college, and our NCLEX pass rate was better. Sad but it seems it's school by school.
If facilities lack stable census numbers to keep staff nurses busy what is there for students to do? With the push for ever shorter hospital stays before pts are either discharged to home, LTC or rehab also reflects in the hospital census so instructors can be hard pressed to find enough to go around.
For many areas hospitals and other facilities closing left and right and or reducing inpatient beds but the number of nursing programs has remained constant if not grown, this can lead to a surplus of schools all trying to get their students into the places that remain. Here in NYC schools are sending students to LTC and anyplace else that suits besides hospitals in order to meet clinical time requirements, that simply is where the patients are to be found. Some hospitals here also are starting to limit themselves to working with only certain programs.
- 3Aug 13, '12 by DoGoodThenGoReasonable minds can agree that by and large the difference between the average ADN and BSN programs isn't that vast of a difference, especially in terms of clinical and or skills content. So therefore what remains are the gen ed and other classes that round out the credit requirements for a four year degree, and what do hospitals moving towards "BSN preferred" see in them.
Nursing arts/skills can be learned nd or taught by hospitals. Lord knows they did so for over one hundred years via their diploma programs. So what if anything does the extra sciences, math, English and so forth bring to the table? It would be interesting to find out what a hospital such as NYP or NYU feels they are getting from a BSN grad with a 3.0 or 3.5 GPA that cannot be found in an ADN prepared nurse with the same average.
- 3Aug 14, '12 by chucksterQuote from nursel56There are five diploma programs in the Phila area where I'm located. All appear to be going strong and have excellent NCLEX pass rates. As the [paraphrased] saying goes, you can't swing a dead cat in Philly without hitting a diploma grad.. . .
Kay, a diploma grad! I'm glad there are still at least a few still around! I have a soft spot for those schools, and there are very few out here on the West coast!
- 4Aug 14, '12 by chucksterQuote from foreverLaurWow - that is borderline insane. I take that back, it's really simply insane. This is the first time I've ever heard of something like this. I would love to hear the tortured logic behind this one.One hospital I was interested says:
"Graduated from an NLNAC or CCNE accredited nursing baccalaureate program (BSN). Candidates graduating from an Associates Degree-to-BSN or LPN-to-BSN programs are not eligible"
- 2Aug 14, '12 by DoGoodThenGoQuote from chucksterNow that is just wrong. So basically the place would take a new ABSN grad with zero experience over an ADN or LPN to RN who could bring anywhere from one to twenty years of current nursing practice to the table?Wow - that is borderline insane. I take that back, it's really simply insane. This is the first time I've ever heard of something like this. I would love to hear the tortured logic behind this one.
Someone needs to contact the EEOC and or start some lawsuits as this is getting just stupid. So basically we 've got if you're:
too much experience
too little experience
don't have a BSN
don't have an undergraduate BSN
didn't graduate with a GPA average >3.0
are too slow
are too fast
aren't pretty enough
are too pretty
Hospitals are saying don't what cha, don't need ya. And yet there is so much noise about a nursing shortage. *LOL*
- 0Aug 14, '12 by DoGoodThenGoQuote from chucksterPersonally think many diploma grads are great, and if such grads could be assured of a spot they could hold for say ten yearsor so (until they got their BSN and or AP degree), or dare one say it *gasp* lifetime employment at a particular hospital/heathcare system you would get much greater interest.There are five diploma programs in the Phila area where I'm located. All appear to be going strong and have excellent NCLEX pass rates. As the [paraphrased] saying goes, you can't swing a dead cat in Philly without hitting a diploma grad.