I am outraged at how bad things are getting for the pre-nursing students at CCAC. They change policies about the classes in the middle of the night and don't tell anyone and trying to get correct information from advisement is not gonna happen. I am posting this information to empower those who have been done wrong.
The students who applied for the 2012 fall nursing program and where rejected need to ban together and file a class action lawsuit against the school. The current flow chart that was just revised around the end of 2011 shows that the only classes needed to apply to the nursing program are as follows:
math 80 and 90
English 89 and 100 (if applies)
college reading (if applies)
into to biology
chemistry 109 or 110 or if you passed with a "C" or better in high school you don't have to take it
These classes are all to the left of the solid black line so this would mean that the classes listed above are you prereqs and the classes to the right of the solid black line are classes that you can take along with the nursing classes. Most students who applied believed that they met the above criteria and had a GPA of at least a 2.8 or better. They only had 300 seats so here's what they did and this is where the lawsuit comes in. They secretly gave credit to the students that already took microbiology, a&p 1 and a&p 2 and gave them extra points depending on the grade they received. So for example if your GPA was a 4.0 and you recieved an "A" in those three classes you got .75 points x 3. So this means your GPA went from a 4.0 to a 6.25. That 6.25 GPA was there starting point for applicants. If you had anything less than maybe a 3.6 GPA or so you never had a chance. I believe those rejection letters can be chaallenged based on students not being properly informed on the application requirements.
The students that took the Pax test and passed it right before they eliminated the test and received rejection letters based on there GPA should also ban together and sue. When they eliminated the Pax they raised the GPA requirement up from I believe a 2.7 (I'm not 100% positive) or what it was to a 2.8 and those students received rejection letters because they were not told before they applied that they changed the GPA requirement. Again, they secretly changed the application requirements. Here's what they should of did and this is where the lawsuit comes in. The students should of been given a waiting period where the new requirement would not effect them because they already met the old requirements when the changes where made, giving them a chance at getting into the nursing program.
I'm guessing the number of seats vs the number of applicants may be the motivation behind these practices and future applicants should consider other schools. Those students that are in the two categories above, I strongly urge you to stand up for yourself. Don't allow CCAC to get away with this because its wrong.
May 8, '12
I don't know if you really have a lawsuit there or not. I know schools give bonus points for admissions if you complete what they call co-requisites (e.g. Microbiology, Pharmacology, etc.) It's not required for admission to the program, but if you don't take them, it's highly unlikely you'll get accepted. Also, you won't have to work on those classes in addition to all the nursing courses & clinicals.
The only thing I can see is that there was a lack of communication on the school's part when they changed their admissions criteria. Just because the minimum GPA is 2.7 for admissions doesn't mean they have to take you. If there are 500 people competing for 300 seats, they're going to take the highest GPAs first, plus those who have completed the co-reqs. Better chance of succeeding when all you're focused on are the nursing courses.
I'm not trying to be discouraging and I completely understand your frustration. It's difficult to be given a set of criteria, work towards it, feel you have completed it, only to have it changed right when you're done. I'm surprised they didn't "grandfather" the criteria for students who had an established academic plan in place.
Think about it this way...do you really want to go through the trouble of suing an institution and then having to take classes there if you win the suit? It's going to be a cold reception, to say the least. It will also take years to complete a suit like that. You're better off either finding another program and transferring your existing credits or fulfilling the new admissions requirements at your current school.
Last edit by SopranoKris on May 8, '12
: Reason: Corrected spelling errors
May 8, '12
You still have to inform students of changes. You can't change the rules after they apply. If students were properly informed they would of better prepared themselves for the fall 2012 term and the students who took the PAX had no shot at all. If students just keep walking away and not making the campus accountable then the same thing will happen to students who apply in 2013. It's not about winning any money is about putting the schools conduct in the application process on blast. It could take 50 years in court but at least all future students would know what CCAC is really about, and to seek other options because the chances of getting into there nursing program are not good. And only a fool would still attend a school that they sue. Its academic suicide.
May 8, '12
Their website lists the pre-reqs for students prior to the 2012 application and current 2012 applicants. I'm still failing to see how they didn't inform students of the changes. It specifically states the change on the website and says students following the 575 track will continue in the 575 track.
OK, I'm done nitpicking...
May 8, '12
I agree with the second poster. My school did something similar to help weed out competition- they added an interview last minute. I had a 4.0 in pre reqs, 3.8 overall, all my pre reqs done and then had to interview. I was beyond nervous and didn't make the cut. This semester I tried again, however gypped I felt- I had to move past it and do whatever I could to prepare myself for the next round! I retook the admissions exam, studied up on interviewing, and reapplied. This time, I was much calmer and I got in! I hope that the raw pain of rejection doesn't impede your progress to nursing school! Looking back, and suing over things you probably won't be able to change is only going to hold you back!
May 8, '12
I'm not going to let any of this hold me back. My reason for being here today is to inform my fellow classmates. If you have other schools in mind look into them. Their website can say one thing all day while the college does another. The PAX test applicants are the perfect example of not keeping the students informed about changes. They make changes overnight, don't tell you and they reject your application. I am speaking from hard core experiences. What ever information you found on the website was not there before the students applied for that term. Its only on there now because they have to explain what they did to the students and maintain professionalism.
May 8, '12
ok so my reply did not send. CCAC sent pre nursing students a letter last semester telling us about the changes. I go to CCAC and i was imformed about the changes. CCAC is very disorganized, but what they did was pretty fair. most schools go by a point system. And you always got more points for having your co reqs done. I'm sorry you didn't get in, maybe try the hospital schools.
May 9, '12
Moved to PA Nursing Programs
for more response.
May 9, '12
you must be joking?? the flow chart is simply a flow chart showing the minimal course progression if you just came out of high school . if you went to high school and did well on your sats or placement tests the only actual course a person would have to take *before the line* is bio 151 to technically be able to apply but not necessarily be competitive. there were hundreds of people taking micro and a&p before applying to the program long before the change in criteria because they know its required anyway, they are difficult courses and they want to be able to focus on nursing once accepted. these motivated students were just finally rewarded by an official change in standards. if it never held any bearing in the past then the admissions committee would have consisted of a computer and a calculator.
the new selection criteria and point system was clearly listed on pg 8 of the application packet with a revision date of december 2011.
that date means it would have been impossible for someone to pick up an application during the jan-march application period without this information in it. so even if you were not informed before january 15th from keeping up with the website, your advisors, nursing office staff, or even your fellow pre-nursing classmates about the rumors of the removal of the pax and change in gpa requirements a potential applicant would have been well aware of it before turning in their application. so completely reading your application packet could have prevented anyone from being unpleasantly surprised when acceptance/rejection letters came out.
also even if you would have met the original gpa requirement there is no guarantee that you would have gotten in. i can’t believe how many times i heard,” i don’t care what grade i get, just as long as i get a c ,”from other students in pre-req classes. well complacency kills….it also doesn’t get you into nursing school in this economy. even if you fought your way into the program where on earth would they put the hundreds of you all who feel so wronged? i’m pretty darn sure there’s still a shortage in nursing instructors in the us which is why if you kept up with the profession you would know that programs all over the country are cutting seats and dealing with 1000’s of deserving applicants that they aren’t able to accept (i.e. impacted programs and wait lists). so c’s won’t cut it getting into any nursing program anywhere in the country. many programs are changing admissions requirements in order to deal with this issue. there were people who started off their pre nursing courses striving for the best possible grade, had 4.0’s and were still nervous as to whether they would get into the program.
they didn’t make you do anything extra from what you should have been doing to secure your spot into the program and remain competitive. it has always been advised to get all the developmental/intro and science classes done. they actually made it easier for those who were doing what they were supposed to be doing to apply and be recognized for their efforts. i wasn’t even planning on applying this year until i found out i wouldn’t have to take the pax. you should have been making progress getting courses out of the way and fighting for the best grade possible and not wasting your time and money. if you were a responsible adult you would have also had a backup plan and would have been prepared to apply to other nursing programs which also require you to take a& p and such. everyone was informed at the same exact time but some people were more prepared for success than others. if you were lazy, got c’s, took one class every other semester, read one pre-rn exam book and thought passing one test made you deserving of a seat in a competitive program you were wrong. wait your turn, finish your non-nursing courses, get a’s and b’s and your time will come. i am a full time student at pitt in a program with rigorous courses and heavy clinical requirements, a military spouse, travel on a monthly basis cross country between my two home states and was able to finish every single non nursing class at ccac in 2 summers and 1 fall semester. with a 3.1 ccac gpa and all of my non nursing classes finished i got my first choice campus and i deserve it. i will enjoy focusing on only nursing courses (in the nursing program not the”let’s see how many times it takes you to pass micro while you take up a seat in the nursing program”) .i will be taking only 2 classes a semester for 3 out of the 4 semesters and have proven with my transcript that i will most likely finish on time.
i mean the reason for the change must have obviously been for a good reason not just to screw over a bunch of people. i guess they finally addressed that the pax was not a good indicator of success within the program and that often students do not do as well when tackling difficult required courses such as a&p and micro while also diving head first into the wonderful world of nursing. it’s a bit silly for them to give a seat to an applicant who has only proven they can pass developmental/intro courses with a c and are marginally good test takers. that student hasn’t taken the most difficult of the courses most closely related to the major and will have a full course load once in the program. this leads to repeats galore, effects the school’s on time completion/grad rate(( which with new education reform can affect how much federal funding a school or program can get)), wastes their time, space and your money . most ccac students work full time or have families and the school has noted the obvious trend that the more time you have to commit to only nursing classes the more likely you are to get to the end goal of becoming an rn. in all honesty, you may see it as a roadblock on your career path but they are doing you a favor to ensure your success. better luck next yr!!
Last edit by Mizz1371 on May 9, '12
May 10, '12
! I thought this website was here to offer advise or experiences from others to grow from. I know from now on not to post anything else here. You know nothing about me or my situation. Its easy to criticize and act all big when your on the other side. I didn't right this post to be attacked about your accomplishments. I wrote this post because someone that I trust suggested some things to me and to get feedback from other students that may have been rejected. In no way shape or form has this broken me or made me not want to still be a nurse. It has done the opposite. Since you want to attack my intelligence, I am a very educated woman with several other certifications, a degree, self employed, and I have a license in another field. Oh, and by the way my GPA is a 3.3. This post was not for you or anyone else to feel as though they have the right to look down on me. I hope you don't treat your patients and their families like this in the field!!! You take care and much success to you and yours
May 10, '12
I think. . .your frustration with not getting into the program is understandable, and if what you indicate about your grades is true you probably just have to reapply and wait. But (as someone else mentioned) the list of prerequisites are the *minimum* required to apply to the program. There is no guarantee of admissions here or to any program: that's just a fact of life.
Of COURSE they made the requirements more strict when they didn't have enough seats, and understandably so. That's not illegal or grounds for a lawsuit that's just how admissions works.
May 10, '12
Well, I apologize for the way I came off it was just upsetting seeing that you were plotting against and blaming the school as if they commited some awful injustice. There are other schools and CCAC is the one you chose. There were rumors about this for over a year and unfortunatly you didnt have enough classes done in time for the change. Instead of complaining and saying your going to sue a school that has the right to do what they want in their selection process, you should just take the 2 or 3 extra classes and apply for spring next month or next fall. There was no surprise the application stated exactly how they would be choosing people yet you applied with anyhow knowing your current situation. Of course your upset, you were expecting an acceptance letter, but you shouldnt have applied after you found out the new criteria because there were hundreds who had taken those courses and would get placed above you during this application period. You should have enrolled in the other courses as soon as your situation permitted you to. Im sure you are a wonderful canidate but just a few classes short of being competitive which can be easily fixed in a semester or two.Everyone was affected just the same by the change and some were just more prepared by doing more than the minimum courses.
May 11, '12
Well said Mizz1371. After having many friends complete CCAC's nursing program, I can tell you, if you do not have those prerequisite courses done, you are setting yourself up for failure no matter how smart you are.
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