That spelled badly, contravesial thread about NA's...

  1. 0
    Hmmmm, thinking hat on now...

    Factoids (being poorly contructed facts)

    -Nursing = what nurses do = The provision of care

    -Care requirements have difrent componencts (say IVI's and bed baths) both important care requirments but the backgroud education required to perform them is significantly difrent

    -RN's are performing tasks that NA's do on many wards.

    -The performace of NA's in some fascets of care is better than RN's can provide (partialy beacuse of time factors, partialy other reasons)


    questioniod (questions I cant answer beacuse im not entirely sure what the question actualy is...)

    -Why cant we accept that the invisable task (NA's) are nurses in their own right? Not trained with 3 years academdic knowledge and advanced skills.

    But,

    for lack of a better definition than the above one, 'nurses nurse', 'provide nursing care', 'we are nursing'

    Therefore nurses (not RNs or NAa, but 'Nurses') are still providing nursing care, those core nursing activities that we vaunt so very much....

    So why are we worried about the transmition of tasks to NA's?


    Tribalism maybe.....


    dont flame me, I dont think I even belive the above points but I'm just tring to bounce ideas around in my own head and though outside assisstance might help resolve the question....
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  5. 0
    In The State of Texas, NAs only need to have 40 hrs of training at a nursing home, pass a 30 question test with 75%, and have an eighth grade reading level, and they are certified nurses' aides. They are not required to know CPR, or the Heimlich Maneuver. They are not trained in how to hook up and turn on an 02 tank.

    I have met some nice CNAs who care about their pts and have a strong work ethic, and I have met some whom I felt would soon be in jail, if they haven't been already.

    I was a CNA myself for two years. At no time did I ever consider myself a nurse, and I do not consider CNAs to be a nurses.

    That is akin to considering a medical asst to be the same as an MD, IMHO.
  6. 0
    Maybe this is more a UK thing then, perhaps, I know alot of NA's who will 'allow' patients to call them nurse or lead them to belive their a nurse, hell as a student nurse all my friends refere to me as a nurse and its very plesant to let them..., (though I do correct them once per conversation on the topic)

    And patients always call for a nurse, Never Registered nurse!
  7. 0
    I am a CNA & don't consider myself a nurse, I consider myself part of the nursing team. IN my training class, we were taught CPR & the Heimlich (I realize every state is different, I think it's interesting how different places are).
  8. 0
    Just looking at the time of your post BritishStudent and I'm wondering if you are just in from the pub???

    I would maybe answer the question, if indeed that's what it is,if I could make any sense of your post at all.

    I'm beginning to wonder if you are actually a student nurse at all,
    because i'm wondering how you were accepted at Uni in the first place' and how you continue to pass written work to an acceptable standard.

    I'm not flaming you or being mean,I don't think being Edgar Allan Poe necessarily makes for a good RGN,but it is part of our Code of Conduct and therefore a compusory requirement.

    "Record keeping is considered by the UKCC to be a fundamental part of nursing, midwifery and health visiting practice. Documentation and maintenance of medical records thus forms an integral part of care of expedition members. The following information is taken from Guidelines for Records and Record Keeping, UKCC 1998. This document should be referred to for further information.

    There is no single model for a record but there are a number of key principles which underpin good records and record keeping.

    Patient records should:

    be factual, consistent and accurate

    be written as soon as possible after an event has occurred, providing current information on the care and condition of the patient

    be written clearly, accurately and be dated, timed and signed

    not include abbreviations, jargon, meaningless phrases or irrelevant speculation
    be written in terms the patient can easily understand (last updated: 14 Nov 2002)"


    I think I've made my point and sorry to "hi-jack" your thread away from it's original subject.
    Last edit by ayemmeff on Jan 22, '03
  9. 0
    I think his poor spelling is intentional. He is just trying to see how we will respond. You can tell that by the title of the thread.
  10. 0
    I too have wondered if he is for real. the title nurse is protected by law...........no one can use it who is not on the register. you should know that!

    and nursing is an art- which takes time to learn. ok some bits are task led but we work at different competencies- see Benner 'novice to expert'. its all about the level that you work at. And I am worried about the future of nursing here and glad you are not one of my students- you'd have been flamed ages ago!!!

    Karen
  11. 0
    Oh good, a discusion on how crappy my spelling is

    Yeah my spelling sucks, my grammar is terrible and my sentance structure more flexable than a house officers working hours, so what, dose that make mypoints less relivant?

    I am dyslexic (and dyspraxic, but thats less pertenant). If I want to spell correctly I need to concentrate and run my work through the spell checker 3-4 times, wow what a great sob story, boohoo.

    At the time of that post I'd just come back from my fourth long day in a row on a new placement (CDU), so yeah maybe i was kinda tired and smelled like three difrent types of bodily fluid, and I will confess, a little uspet by a patient dying and having to listen to the RN's talk about how disgustingly fat mr X in bay Y was.

    *bows low* please forgive me oh judgemental british nurses of this board.

    Beasuse as we all know its not what your doing that counts but that you look profesional, spell everything correctly in the patients codex and records while patients die in their own vomit. (as seen today!)

    forgive me for being a little defencive (not been the best day)
  12. 0
    Originally posted by ayemmeff

    I'm beginning to wonder if you are actually a student nurse at all,
    because i'm wondering how you were accepted at Uni in the first place' and how you continue to pass written work to an acceptable standard.
    Ouch. Beacuse I did my A levels and so on, and work very hard, and not meaning to be arrogant- I know my stuff, and vocaly am able to articulate myself very well.

    not include abbreviations, jargon, meaningless phrases or irrelevant speculation
    be written in terms the patient can easily understand (last updated: 14 Nov 2002)"
    I saw TAPS and NFT writen in the nursing notes today....
    TAPS= Thick as Pig ****.
    NFT= Normal for Thanet (a local district, with derogatory conotations)


    I think I've made my point and sorry to "hi-jack" your thread away from it's original subject.
    Bah!, Im not sure there was a thread...

    Originally posted by karenG
    I too have wondered if he is for real. the title nurse is protected by law...........no one can use it who is not on the register. you should know that!
    Karen
    True, but do you see NA's refereing to themselves as nurses, or responding to calls for a nurse?
    Last edit by BritishStudent on Jan 23, '03
  13. 0
    Originally posted by BritishStudent
    Beasuse as we all know its not what your doing that counts but that you look profesional, spell everything correctly in the patients codex and records while patients die in their own vomit. (as seen today!)
    I really take exception to this,BritishStudent.Of course it matters that every single aspect of our practice is of the highest standard,but you cannot say that your written work is unimportant.

    We are not talking about the odd spelling mistake in your posts,what you write is, on occasion, unintelligible,and this detracts greatly from the points you are trying to make.And yes, I'm sorry,it does make you look unprofessional.

    You said that today you had a patient die in their own vomit(i'm sorry,that sounds like it sucked)Did you have to write up the cardex?You do understand that if that patients family decide they want an investigation,and God forbid it gets to court,you will have to read those notes out,they will be scrutinised and
    judged and you will be judged alongside them.If not this family,what about the next?or the one after that?

    What happens if you leave written instructions in the cardex for the nurse on the next shift and because of your inability to write clearly and concisely,an error occurs?What about care-planning?
    Check lists?

    I'm sorry that you think all this is unimportant,I expect thats why it's part of the Code of Conduct.(we can all do sarcasm,BritishNurse)


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