Vaccination fears fuel increase in exemptions sought, AP finds - page 8

BOSTON - Sabrina Rahim doesn't practice any particular faith, but she had no problem signing a letter declaring that because of her deeply held religious beliefs, her 4-year-old son should be exempt... Read More

  1. by   lovthatlea
    I'd love to see that documented!
  2. by   nyapa
    Quote from Jolie
    To those of you who don't want un-vaccinated kids attending public school: if you're so sure your vaccine works, why are you so worried? Seriously, not trying to be smart, I really want to know.

    Like all medications, vaccinations are not 100% effective.
    Agreed. When I first started nursing I had the Hep B regime. I did not seroconvert. The policy was at that time to do it again. I still have not seroconverted. They now no longer redo it. So I am not covered against Hep B. But I wish I was; a friend of mine died from the disease, within a week of it being detected. Yes it is extreme. But these diseases do kill, and that is why there are vaccines...
  3. by   Noryn
    Quote from lovthatlea
    not at all sharon. i am a medical coder by trade but am not working. this leaves me a great deal of time to research vaccines and their history. more than anything i would like to be shown that i'm wrong about them since the guilt of injecting my kids with something i didn't take five minutes to research has about sent me over the edge.
    the problem is that you are misinformed on so many issues. i am not worried about the nurses on here, 99 percent of them will see your claims and dismiss them. i am a bit concerned that these posts often show up in a general search so misguided or anxious parents may believe what you are posting. you have no legitimate studies or resources to back your claims up. whereas you have organizations such as the american academy of pediatrics who disagree with your claims.

    your view on vaccinations is quite simply dangerous. throughout history there has been periods of concern over the safety of vaccinations which prompted many not to receive them. this inevitably led to epidemics and deaths. the american academy of pediatrics has a great link of what would happen today if vaccinations were stopped:
    http://www.cispimmunize.org/ill/ill_main.html

    just to point out a few inaccuracies you have posted.

    for instance "i know scarlet fever never had a vaccine and it is gone"

    scarlet fever is not gone, still out there.

    "polio is now called aseptic meningitis"

    i dont know where you came up with this but different virus different condition.


    "most people that come down with the diseases you speak of are vaccinated"

    so that is why in the us we have such an epidemic of diptheria, pertussis and tetanus right now. actually we havent had a large scale epidemic of these shortly after we started vaccinating.


    "a child with active tb should be in hospital not school"

    that is not correct, someone with active tb may very well be at home taking antibiotic therapy.


    "how does injecting some of the most toxic chemicals on the planet, aluminum, formaldehyde, mercury, msg, aborted fetal cells, monkey kidney tissue, i could go on but i think you get the point, along with a half dead/dead/live virus into a developing immune system no doctor has a full grasp of? can you poison yourself into immunity? i think not."

    so if we are being poisoned why has life expectancy continued to increase since vaccinations were started?

    "the actual illness often can cause death.
    only if its mismanaged."

    again you have limited knowledge of disease processes. often there is little treatment that can be done for a viral infection so prevention is key. once you have hepatitis b, it is yours for life. if you have brain damage from meningitis, again not a lot that can be done for it.

    "what medicine is still in practice today that was used in the early 1900s?"

    i got a kick out of this one. another poster beat me to the punch but to answer your question probably the most commonly used medications today--acetaminophen, aspirin and morphine.
  4. by   sharona97
    Quote from noryn
    the problem is that you are misinformed on so many issues. i am not worried about the nurses on here, 99 percent of them will see your claims and dismiss them. i am a bit concerned that these posts often show up in a general search so misguided or anxious parents may believe what you are posting. you have no legitimate studies or resources to back your claims up. whereas you have organizations such as the american academy of pediatrics who disagree with your claims.

    your view on vaccinations is quite simply dangerous. throughout history there has been periods of concern over the safety of vaccinations which prompted many not to receive them. this inevitably led to epidemics and deaths. the american academy of pediatrics has a great link of what would happen today if vaccinations were stopped:
    http://www.cispimmunize.org/ill/ill_main.html

    just to point out a few inaccuracies you have posted.

    for instance "i know scarlet fever never had a vaccine and it is gone"

    scarlet fever is not gone, still out there.

    "polio is now called aseptic meningitis"

    i dont know where you came up with this but different virus different condition.


    "most people that come down with the diseases you speak of are vaccinated"

    so that is why in the us we have such an epidemic of diptheria, pertussis and tetanus right now. actually we havent had a large scale epidemic of these shortly after we started vaccinating.


    "a child with active tb should be in hospital not school"

    that is not correct, someone with active tb may very well be at home taking antibiotic therapy.


    "how does injecting some of the most toxic chemicals on the planet, aluminum, formaldehyde, mercury, msg, aborted fetal cells, monkey kidney tissue, i could go on but i think you get the point, along with a half dead/dead/live virus into a developing immune system no doctor has a full grasp of? can you poison yourself into immunity? i think not."

    so if we are being poisoned why has life expectancy continued to increase since vaccinations were started?

    "the actual illness often can cause death.
    only if its mismanaged."

    again you have limited knowledge of disease processes. often there is little treatment that can be done for a viral infection so prevention is key. once you have hepatitis b, it is yours for life. if you have brain damage from meningitis, again not a lot that can be done for it.

    "what medicine is still in practice today that was used in the early 1900s?"

    i got a kick out of this one. another poster beat me to the punch but to answer your question probably the most commonly used medications today--acetaminophen, aspirin and morphine.
    noryn:

    thanks for that link. it is awesome. i remember seeing my xrays and having brick-like atelectasis that was so unbelievably large, it looked liked i swallowed a brick. i still have atelectasis today. i use airborne before entering into public places, and use long sleeves to hold on to railings durng winter months, summer months i just am very aware of what i touch and avoid. hand washing more now than when i was on the floor, probably a bit ocd lol.

    i agree, it's almost a mute debate when it gets wacky with subjectivity instead of acknowleding objective data that is still ignored. but, i am very grateful for all the data that i've been able to follow, you can't believe the healing power it instills to cope with my complications.

    sharona
  5. by   Jolie
    Quote from lovthatlea
    Nurses have been sued for a vaccine injury? I think not...I'd have to see that case to believe it.
    If you go back and read my post, you will see that I was referring to the potential liability to nurses if it is determined that autism is caused by pre-natal and/or ante-natal incidents. Not everything is about vaccines.
  6. by   Jolie
    Re: Vaccination fears fuel increase in exemptions sought, AP finds permalink

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jolie
    To those of you who don't want un-vaccinated kids attending public school: if you're so sure your vaccine works, why are you so worried? Seriously, not trying to be smart, I really want to know.

    Just to be clear: the above quote is not mine, but was posted by Valerie, I believe. There is a quirk in Allnurses software that makes it appear as if a quote was made by the person who responds to it, if the full quote is not posted.
  7. by   lovthatlea
    [quote=noryn;2461505]the problem is that you are misinformed on so many issues. i am not worried about the nurses on here, 99 percent of them will see your claims and dismiss them. i am a bit concerned that these posts often show up in a general search so misguided or anxious parents may believe what you are posting.

    the problem is that you are misinformed on so many issues. i am not worried about the nurses on here, 99 percent of them will see your claims and dismiss them. i am a bit concerned that these posts often show up in a general search so misguided or anxious parents may believe what you are posting.

    thank you for taking time out of your day to show me how misinformed i am. i would love to go back to believing i did the right thing by vaccinating so i'm hoping to continue this conversation. i wouldn't worry about other parents believing my claims. most people will do their own research and come up with their own conclusions. i know i did. hopefully they will spend some time on the cds's website and understand where i'm coming from. when the cdc says mercury is dangerous and is most toxic to the developing fetus and then recommends a flu shot for the pregnant with 25 mcgs of it that they claim concentrates in a fetus, i think this sends a mixed message.

    you have no legitimate studies or resources to back your claims up. whereas you have organizations such as the american academy of pediatrics who disagree with your claims.

    well i beg to disagree. there are a great deal of medical doctors who concur with my views. i know my own current holistic doctor used to be a pediatrician that gave vaccines and now does not.

    if you take time and read the fda's workshop in vaccine development and listen to the doctors' concerns about adventitious virus in the vaccines, you too might make the same desision. have you read the letter the fda sent to merck asking them to please screen for avl ( bird leukemia) in the egg based vaccines? now they are so proud the avl is out of the vaccines they post it on the label. check your mmr labels and make sure it says so. sorry about all the kids injected with the bird leukemia before we found the extra virus.... besides that they still voice concerns over the fact that if they don't know what the virus looks like they can't screen for it. they call it "an on going problem".......not in my kids it won't be....

    your view on vaccinations is quite simply dangerous.

    was dangerous...to my son...now i think differently.


    throughout history there has been periods of concern over the safety of vaccinations which prompted many not to receive them.

    agreed.

    this inevitably led to epidemics and deaths. the american academy of pediatrics has a great link of what would happen today if vaccinations were stopped:
    http://www.cispimmunize.org/ill/ill_main.html

    i will spend some time on this site.

    just to point out a few inaccuracies you have posted.

    for instance "i know scarlet fever never had a vaccine and it is gone"

    scarlet fever is not gone, still out there.


    yes but it was at epidemic proportions at one time and is not now, without a vaccine.



    "polio is now called aseptic meningitis"

    i dont know where you came up with this but different virus different condition.


    however is has the same symptoms. most conditions are classified by symptoms.


    "most people that come down with the diseases you speak of are vaccinated"

    so that is why in the us we have such an epidemic of diptheria, pertussis and tetanus right now. actually we havent had a large scale epidemic of these shortly after we started vaccinating.


    since these are all diseases are bacteria wouldn't antibiotics work just as well? can you become immune to a bacteria? how come if you come down with tetanus/diptheria/pertussis you are not immune forever?

    "a child with active tb should be in hospital not school"

    that is not correct, someone with active tb may very well be at home taking antibiotic therapy.

    home preferably ...not at school. but as we have seen with the newlywed with tb on a plane, no one caught tb from him including his wife...maybe the germ theory is just that...a theory....


    "how does injecting some of the most toxic chemicals on the planet, aluminum, formaldehyde, mercury, msg, aborted fetal cells, monkey kidney tissue, i could go on but i think you get the point, along with a half dead/dead/live virus into a developing immune system no doctor has a full grasp of? can you poison yourself into immunity? i think not."

    so if we are being poisoned why has life expectancy continued to increase since vaccinations were started?

    better medical interventions maybe? are we all that healthy? the human body is amazing though. some people can even recover from cancer but does that mean we should inject it inside them?


    "the actual illness often can cause death.
    only if its mismanaged."

    again you have limited knowledge of disease processes.

    or maybe you do? have you ever tried another modality of treatment? we were forced to and it worked.

    often there is little treatment that can be done for a viral infection so prevention is key. once you have hepatitis b, it is yours for life.

    that is my main complaint. i don't want pieces of hep b injected inside me.


    if you have brain damage from meningitis, again not a lot that can be done for it.

    since its a side effect of vaccination, again another reason to avoid them.


    "what medicine is still in practice today that was used in the early 1900s?"


    i got a kick out of this one. another poster beat me to the punch but to answer your question probably the most commonly used medications today--acetaminophen, aspirin and morphine.

    and we are only recently discovering how dangerous they can be. how many deaths a year have been attributed to tylenol? or cold remedies for children? don't get me wrong i think drugs are great and will take them when i need them but its doesn't mean they aren't dangerous and it doesn't mean there aren't alternatives.

    again thank you for taking time to try and show me how wrong i am. i am open to any and all explanations of the benefits of vaccinations. you all as nurses should really pay attention to this exchange because as you saw with the article on exemptions more and more parents are questioning the validity of the vaccine research and its a good idea to really have some good answers for parents when they ask them. you are welcome to practice with me or ignore me. either way you will see this discussion again. i thank you for your time.


    noryn:
  8. by   Noryn
    You have your mind made up, I am not going to convince you otherwise. The majority of doctors do not agree with your position and again there is not a legitimate study that I have read that defends your position. I can see not having faith in our FDA, I dont have faith in them but also realize that it is not only 1 or 2 agencies saying there is no relationship to autism it is multiple agencies around the world.
    http://www.vaccinesafety.edu/cc-thim.htm

    Prevention is the key to good health, not treatment. Often once an illness develops, medical treatment often cannot cure it--rabies for instance. Going back to tetanus, once you become infected the bacteria produce toxins which cause the effects. By the time it is caught usually it is extremely late in the process and antibiotics are of more limited use immediately. Yes they will kill the bacteria but you will need prolonged treatment. I am sure you can argue that the treatment for tetanus is much better than the vaccine to prevent it. I personally would rather have an extremely safe shot than to be on a ventilator for weeks.

    As we have seen with MRSA antibiotics (which are wonders) have definitive limitations. Also do you not realize that people have died from Penicillin and other antibiotics? So what is the difference?
    Last edit by Noryn on Oct 24, '07 : Reason: needed to add often before cannot!
  9. by   HM2VikingRN
    A man just died from Rabies in MN. If he had been vaccinated after the bat bite he would probably have lived.
  10. by   cardiacRN2006
    Quote from lovthatlea
    And on top of that 25 mcgs in a flu shot while mom is pregnant or 75 mcgs in a rhogam shot. These kids don't have a chance.

    So, these kids don't have a chance? So every kid whose mom got the flu shot while pregnant, or received Rhogam ended up getting autism? Every single kid? No chance not to, right?



    Other than long ramble-fests of anger, I still haven't seen convincing evidence of a vaccine/autism link.
    Last edit by cardiacRN2006 on Oct 24, '07
  11. by   sharona97
    Quote from HM2Viking
    A man just died from Rabies in MN. If he had been vaccinated after the bat bite he would probably have lived.
    I said the same exact ting to my dh this am. Isn't that sad?
  12. by   Jolie
    Quote from lovthatlea
    75 mcgs in a rhogam shot. These kids don't have a chance.
    Actually, the kids who "don't have a chance" are the ones whose Rh negative mothers don't receive Rhogam.

    Have you ever seen a critically-ill newborn with hydrpos fetalis related to Rh incompatibility? I bet not. Give me the Rhogam shot any day. At least those kids live.
  13. by   RainDreamer
    That's what I was thinking! Hmmm, hydrops or a rhogam shot? I think I'll take the latter! I can't imagine a mom intentionally refusing the shot ...... poor kiddos, that's one of the worst kinds of suffering.

    If rhogam is so bad, then why have the incidence of hydrops related to Rh incompatibility decreased over the years? I can't see how that's a bad thing.
    Last edit by RainDreamer on Oct 24, '07

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