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| No. 100 |
May 24, 2009, 07:54 PM
Re: Talk of insurance mandate growing
I'm all for a single-payer system, not-for-profit organizations comprising the system, controlling the costs of pharmaceuticals just as do many other industrialized countries, rationing extreme care, the use of significant deductibles that impose some pain upon the users of the system in order to limit frivolous use.
I also believe that there should be wellness incentives... people with behavior related risks pay a penalty (or are denied a discount) in their deductibles.
I believe that health care is a basic human right.
| | Advertisement Sponsored Links | | | | No. 101 |
May 24, 2009, 08:05 PM
Re: Talk of insurance mandate growing
Some people think single payer means we will be just throwing out free care willy nilly.
This is ridiculous. Of course there would be some sort of administration of the benefits - just like you're private insurance company does. For example - to de-incentivize people from going to the ED we can charge them $100 per visit - or maybe free if it is a true emergency and maybe charge them $100 if it isn't.
Furthermore, we can incentivize people to go to their primary care physicians early by making it low cost or no cost. We can also incentivize those who don't smoke, those who have a healthy bmi, blood presure, etc.
So yes, there are simple ways to administer a universal system responsibily. No one is advocating for some sort of healthcare system with no controls.
| | No. 102 |
May 24, 2009, 10:42 PM
Re: Talk of insurance mandate growing
I don't think we are going to see a mandate. However, I do think we are going to see a real mess , we would be better off to implement a single-payer plan.
| | No. 103 |
May 24, 2009, 11:46 PM
Re: Talk of insurance mandate growing Originally Posted by GCTMT I don't think we are going to see a mandate. However, I do think we are going to see a real mess , we would be better off to implement a single-payer plan.
Yes, all these will make a mess. WHY was single payer not even listed? (Of course we know it is due to corporate $$$.) http://www.guaranteedhealthcare.org/ | | No. 104 |
May 25, 2009, 05:23 AM
Updated
May 25, 2009 at 05:29 AM by George_MSN
Re: Government waste & healthcare Originally Posted by msteeleart
Yes, I do fully support government supported healthcare because I would rather pay higher taxes and know that I will not be on the brink of bankruptcy if I have to get a $250,000 operation when I can't afford the 20%. I trust the gov't more with my health than a corporation who just wants to make a profit and pad their executives pockets.
Some observations I came up with: - The state of California last week came up with a $21 billion shortfall. One of the first things to be cut was health care.
- In Washington, DC - budget deficit nearing $2 trillion, they're trying to come up with ways to cut wasteful spending
which would initially come up with $17 billion (a drop in the proverbial bucket). Fiscally speaking, Medicare & Social Security are anything but healthy. The recession has slashed payroll-tax revenue adding to fiscal woes.
- New Orleans (post Katrina) - a case study of a population with minimal health care and health insurance. Almost two-thirds of New Orleans residents now report chronic health problems. As flawed as our present system in the rest of the country may be, it pales in comparison.
With all this deficit spending running into the trillions of dollars, how could massive inflation not soon follow? If you think health care is expensive now.... The poor have no insurance, check. Those with pre-existing conditions have no insurance for that condition unless they get in with a big corporation's insurance plan, or luck out with a similar plan. Many health care workers have some of the lousiest health insurance around, and you are "incentivized" to only use it when your are half-dead.
So, let's see. The government can't afford health care. We the people can not afford health care. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Even Billy Mays, the TV huckster, doesn't seem to have the answer!
I work with a multinational biotech company (Baxter International). There are people with virtually uninsurable pre-existing conditions whose only motive for employment is to obtain otherwise unobtainable coverage. Not only is hospital pay lower the non hospital pay, the health care benefits are worse too (usually, it seems).
| | No. 106 |
May 25, 2009, 10:20 AM
Re: Talk of insurance mandate growing Originally Posted by Agrippa Of course there would be some sort of administration of the benefits - just like you're private insurance company does. For example - to de-incentivize people from going to the ED we can charge them $100 per visit - or maybe free if it is a true emergency and maybe charge them $100 if it isn't.
Furthermore, we can incentivize people to go to their primary care physicians early by making it low cost or no cost. We can also incentivize those who don't smoke, those who have a healthy bmi, blood presure, etc.
So yes, there are simple ways to administer a universal system responsibily. No one is advocating for some sort of healthcare system with no controls.
I agree 100% that there must be financial responsibility on the part of every user of the health care system, to promote responsible use of resources. But your proposal to charge a $100 copay for ER visits runs contrary to the argument we hear now that that would make services inaccessible for many people. If someone had $100 to spend on health care, s/he could go to a private physician's office, urgent care, or Walgreens-type clinic instead of utilizing the ER for minor care.
Don't get me wrong. I believe we need to insist that all healthcare consumers of all income levels begin to budget and save for non catastrophic health care expenses (even if it's just a few dollars a week). I like your suggestion that a substantial co-pay be tied to ER usage that does not involve life-threatening conditions. But it will draw criticism from those who believe that any financial responsibility on the part of the low-income consumer equals blocked access to health care.
| | No. 107 |
May 25, 2009, 10:28 AM
Re: Government waste & healthcare Originally Posted by George_MSN Some observations I came up with: - The state of California last week came up with a $21 billion shortfall. One of the first things to be cut was health care.
- In Washington, DC - budget deficit nearing $2 trillion, they're trying to come up with ways to cut wasteful spending
which would initially come up with $17 billion (a drop in the proverbial bucket). Fiscally speaking, Medicare & Social Security are anything but healthy. The recession has slashed payroll-tax revenue adding to fiscal woes.
- New Orleans (post Katrina) - a case study of a population with minimal health care and health insurance. Almost two-thirds of New Orleans residents now report chronic health problems. As flawed as our present system in the rest of the country may be, it pales in comparison.
With all this deficit spending running into the trillions of dollars, how could massive inflation not soon follow? If you think health care is expensive now.... The poor have no insurance, check. Those with pre-existing conditions have no insurance for that condition unless they get in with a big corporation's insurance plan, or luck out with a similar plan. Many health care workers have some of the lousiest health insurance around, and you are "incentivized" to only use it when your are half-dead.
So, let's see. The government can't afford health care. We the people can not afford health care. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Even Billy Mays, the TV huckster, doesn't seem to have the answer!
I work with a multinational biotech company (Baxter International). There are people with virtually uninsurable pre-existing conditions whose only motive for employment is to obtain otherwise unobtainable coverage. Not only is hospital pay lower the non hospital pay, the health care benefits are worse too (usually, it seems). First-of-Its Kind Study: Medicare for All (Single-Payer) Reform Would Be Major Stimulus for Economy with 2.6 Million New Jobs, $317 Billion in Business Revenue, $100 Billion in Wages Establishing a national single-payer style healthcare reform system would provide a major stimulus for the U.S. economy by creating 2.6 million new jobs, and infusing $317 billion in new business and public revenues, with another $100 billion in wages into the U.S. economy, according to the findings of a groundbreaking study released today. http://www.calnurses.org/media-cente...s.html?print=t
The study - http://www.calnurses.org/research/pd...study_2009.pdf | | No. 109 |
May 25, 2009, 01:42 PM
Re: Talk of insurance mandate growing Originally Posted by blue note And you actually believe them? I think the reasons for their announcement are: 1) good PR; 2) attempt to pre-empt, derail, obfuscate any talk of real reform that would hurt their bottom line, such as a competing "public option" plan that they know they cannot compete with. I think it is telling that they waited only after health care reform became a serious possibility before they so generously came up with the "we can save more" idea. Why didn't they just do it in the first place if they cared so much?
Yep... It's just like how big pharma rolled out their bus tour and discount programs as serious discussions began about state-sponsored drug reimportation or - gasp - limiting drug prices like everybody else does, or - horror of horrors - reducing the period of patent protection in order to speed the availability of more affordable generics.
Now they're the big, cuddly, caring pharma industry...
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