Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

rph3664 · Oct 17, 2009, 06:58 PM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

Originally Posted by MandaTaye

I think there's a special place in heaven for CNA's who work in long-term care facilities.

They certainly took wonderful care of my grandmother for the last two years of her life, when she was in a nursing home.

Toydemon10 · Oct 18, 2009, 02:04 PM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

My favorite is when I see staff in skilled nursing forced to take elderly patients out of bed or their rooms against their will to attend activities. Then I see elderly people slumed over in their chairs sleeping while someone dressed like Bozo the clown is throwing a ball to them. What is the point in forcing people to do things in the name of a regulation when there are no ascertainable benefits for one thing and these "activities" are not the type of thing that an elderly person much less another human being in general ever has or would ever care to participate in.

IMABSNRN · Oct 18, 2009, 02:40 PM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

Originally Posted by Toydemon10

My favorite is when I see staff in skilled nursing forced to take elderly patients out of bed or their rooms against their will to attend activities. Then I see elderly people slumed over in their chairs sleeping while someone dressed like Bozo the clown is throwing a ball to them. What is the point in forcing people to do things in the name of a regulation when there are no ascertainable benefits for one thing and these "activities" are not the type of thing that an elderly person much less another human being in general ever has or would ever care to participate in.

You could be describing the LTC facility where I work. Therapy is a joke for the most part, and look at the tons payed out for it. Activities are a joke, for the most part, too. Who wants to go sit in a circle and get hit in the head with a beach ball? These are one of many reasons why I am frustrated with LTC and want out.

Talk about no dignity.

*leslie :-D* · Oct 18, 2009, 02:47 PM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

Originally Posted by tewdles

As a post note....today we have a growing anger and hysteria over "death panels" and government types who want to "kill granny".

isn't that a fact?
while many of us acknowledge "futile care", there are just as many going into a panic about the alleged "death panels", not fully correlating that these 'death panels' are all about the futility of care!!
oh.
and limbaugh is an idiot.
a rich idiot, but still, an idiot nonetheless.

Originally Posted by MandaTaye

As a CNA, I have personally saved a nurses job... and had that nurse been anything but respectful towards me during our employment together, I am not sure that I would have been so forgiving of her mistake. Also, I did work under a LPN for awhile who was very rude and treated (in my opinion) her patients very disrespectfully. When I finish nursing school, I will be her boss. Be careful how you treat your CNA's. Glad this point was brought up..

honestly, the above post sounds a tad spiteful.
bottom line is you treat people the way you'd want to be treated.
always.

Originally Posted by MandaTaye

I think there's a special place in heaven for CNA's who work in long-term care facilities.

not all cna's, for sure.
but some of them- yes.
same for nurses.

leslie

OriolesMagic · Oct 18, 2009, 03:43 PM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

I used to work in subacute rehab and they would try to force people to do physical therapy who had no interest in it. Part of my job as a nurse was to get people to go to PT. I'll never forget that one 98 year old woman told me to "leave me alone and let me die", in response to trying to give her a nebulizer treatment. Of course she was given the diagnosis of depression.

FairyCari · Oct 18, 2009, 05:02 PM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

People are so afraid of death, but it really is a natural and normal part of the life cycle.
I believe that death should not be treated as 'defeat', but as a process of our life cycle which is to be respected. Pain and comfort measures, as well as spiritual and emotional support should be given, not a breathing tube.

*Moogie* · Oct 18, 2009, 05:28 PM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

Originally Posted by IMABSNRN

You could be describing the LTC facility where I work. Therapy is a joke for the most part, and look at the tons payed out for it. Activities are a joke, for the most part, too. Who wants to go sit in a circle and get hit in the head with a beach ball? These are one of many reasons why I am frustrated with LTC and want out.

Talk about no dignity.

ITA about the lack of dignity in many LTC facilities. I hear you about the beach ball volleyball. Occasionally, might not be a bad thing but if residents aren't participating, if they're just sitting there getting hit in the face or don't appear to be enjoying themselves, do something else! And don't just offer bingo 24/7.

The lack of any semblance and planning into age-appropriate activities also led to my getting frustrated with LTC as well. <sigh> Another one bites the dust.

IcepackRN · Oct 18, 2009, 06:29 PM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

With limited amount of health care dollars I can't understand why hospitals in my area, and the one where I work, have installed flat screen T.V.s, marble countertops, expensive woodwork and landscaping. Many patients and staff do not enjoy this level of luxury in their own homes. It seems so over the top. What good are all the fancy surroundings when there is basically a skeleton crew to provide care. Can a marble countertop provide pain relief? Will a flat screen T.V. assist you to the bathroom. Sorry there is no one here to help you, we spent it all on the custom curtains. Aren't they beautiful?

StaceydRN · Oct 18, 2009, 09:56 PM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

As a brand new RN on med-surg....6 months now...I can honestly say that this situation with overtreating the elderly against their will and against all common sense is definitely one of my biggest frustrations since leaving school.

I'm struggling to believe that the majority of families, even the ones in severe denial, would not instead opt for DNR/DNI and comfort measures if they truly understood that installing a PEG tube and intubating a 97 year old with metastatic lung cancer is not only futile, but literally torture for their loved one. I literally want to cry every time we are forced to code these people. As we go through the process of quickly getting grandpa onto the vent, I can't help but notice that every other professional in the room has the same look on their face....how long until sepsis comes knocking and the foley bag is dry? I am not suggesting we take away anyone's hope when there truly is a realistic chance for a positive outcome....like in someone with curable diseases, and temporary need of a vent, but I am often disgusted by the sugar coated explanations I've repeatedly heard being given to families with loved ones who literally have a 0% chance of EVER coming off that vent. Perhaps, if we would be more honest about the fact that their loved one IS ready to die, then maybe we really could stop some of this prolonging the inevitable madness. Maybe I'm being naive thinking that something could change if we did more to educate families without fluff. At least I know now I'm not alone in feeling this way. Anyone have any suggestions that might actually improve this situation?

prudence09 · Oct 19, 2009, 04:34 AM

Re: Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

I have to say this is such a great discussion because as nurses we see this all the time no matter where we work. I'm a new grad and a first when I started working i was afraid of the discussions with patients families but now I see it as one of duties to my patients because they need a voice when they can't speak for themselves. I had a patient who was dying and his family could not accept it. The patient was discharged and they literally drove around the hospital and came back to the ER. Long story short the patient was put on a vent got a peg a few days later and was still a full code and they did code him and he died. This person was put through all that to die. They just couldn't accept the fact that death was approaching. They could have let this person go home and die with dignity but they put this person through all that. I don't understand people sometimes. I really really don't.

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Studies: Some Nursing Home Elderly Get Futile Care

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