Nurses - Low Skilled Workers - page 9

no college? not necessarily a problem report points to 16 good fields for lower-skilled workers by andrea coombes, marketwatch last update: 7:36 pm et oct. 27, 2005 san francisco... Read More

  1. by   RN34TX
    Quote from grannynurse FNP student
    I guess I live in an area that has it backwards. SW Florida starting salary for a new teacher $32,500, starting RN $22, 500.

    Grannynurse
    $20,000 is the starting salary for a CNA with no experience in a hospital in the Houston area.
    No wonder FL has such a horrible reputation for RN pay.
  2. by   grannynurse FNP student
    Quote from RN34TX
    $20,000 is the starting salary for a CNA with no experience in a hospital in the Houston area.
    No wonder FL has such a horrible reputation for RN pay.
    And people asked why I left hospital nursing, after six months, down here. How about $6.10 an hour, for second shift and charge responsibilities? To heck with the sun shine, it didn't help pay my bills.

    Grannynurse
  3. by   TheCommuter
    Quote from Q.
    Frankly I think when nursing education gets revamped we need to keep the current skills focus and hoan in more on business skills and other liberal arts. Nurses who can hardly write a coherent sentence, much less a paragraph, nurses who can't express themselves eloquently in meetings, (and thus are ignored or passed up) nurses who are suddenly nurse managers because "they did their time" but have no management training on how to deal with employees (and we'll all seen the posts where managers handle things horribly) don't do much service to our profession either. How can we begin to take charge of our profession when top executives can't take us seriously?
    I recently completed VN school.

    One of my instructors, a BSN, wrote me up in late March 2005 for applying a patient's trach necktie too tightly. This 'professional nurse' prepared her written incident report and asked me to read it prior to signing. I was quite dismayed when the page-long write-up contained numerous errors in spelling, grammar, and basic composition. In fact, I honestly have a difficult time believing that this woman possessed the knowledge and capabilities needed to pass English 101. Additionally, this instructor was not very articulate.

    Not all BSNs are well-educated.
  4. by   TheCommuter
    Quote from grannynurse FNP student
    Just think requiring all facualty to have a minimum of an MSN to teach, would definitely free more for nursing education.
    This is not a viable solution because only 2 percent of all nurses are MSNs.
  5. by   Fun2, RN, BSN
    Quote from TheCommuter
    This is not a viable solution because only 2 percent of all nurses are MSNs.

    I'm not sure about the actual percentage, but I do agree with the point of this message.

    However, it all falls back on money...higher pay for instructors, higher pay for higher levels of education, more scholarships, more cost of living raises, etc.
  6. by   TheCommuter
    Not all professionals with bachelors' degrees are respected or well-paid.

    1. The typical BSW (bachelor's in social work) earns less than $30,000 annually.

    2. Forty-three percent of all schoolteachers possess masters' degrees and earn less than $40,000 annually.

    3. The typical BFA (bachelor's in fine arts) is poorly paid and receives no respect from families, friends, and society. Numerous people have declared that artists always 'starve'.

    4. Philosophy majors don't command much respect, even though most possess bachelors' or masters' degrees.

    The aforementioned academic degrees represent only a few examples of the numerous career pathways that command crappy pay and minimal respect. In my opinion, the ADN-prepared nurse will always command more trust, respect, and pay than the average social worker, philosopher, teacher, or artist. The degree is not as important as other factors.....
  7. by   Fun2, RN, BSN
    EXCELLENT!

    Also, a person isn't a respected "Doctor" with just a Bachelors, same goes for many "respected" titles.

    If you want respect, you either demand it, or you go above the B.S.


    Quote from TheCommuter
    Not all professionals with bachelors' degrees are respected or well-paid.

    1. The typical BSW (bachelor's in social work) earns less than $30,000 annually.

    2. Forty-three percent of all schoolteachers possess masters' degrees and earn less than $40,000 annually.

    3. The typical BFA (bachelor's in fine arts) is poorly paid and receives no respect from families, friends, and society. Numerous people have declared that artists always 'starve'.

    4. Philosophy majors don't command much respect, even though most possess bachelors' or masters' degrees.

    The aforementioned academic degrees represent only a few examples of the numerous career pathways that command crappy pay and minimal respect. In my opinion, the ADN-prepared nurse will always command more trust, respect, and pay than the average social worker, philosopher, teacher, or artist. The degree is not as important as other factors.....
  8. by   marylyric
    Quote from Future_RN_Jess
    Absolutely, the ppl arguing that BSN nursing is much more educated than ADN, cannot really prove a point. RN-BSN programs consists of more liberal arts, lit, history, calculus, and other jibberish. With NO clinical difference.

    Exactly!!!!
  9. by   ali_gator
    Quote from Future_RN_Jess
    Absolutely, the ppl arguing that BSN nursing is much more educated than ADN, cannot really prove a point. RN-BSN programs consists of more liberal arts, lit, history, calculus, and other jibberish. With NO clinical difference.
    Your choice word "jibberish" reflects a very poor attitude towards higher education. I hope this a fluke comment, and not your true views.

    Such classes may not apply directly to nursing, but they certianly make one more well-rounded; I'm taking a Marxism (upper division Philosophy) class right now, which demands that I think in a way that is rather alien to me. Will hospitals care that I can debate the finer points of Marxism with somebody? Will I go on Marxist rants at work? Probably not, but I know this class has made me a better critical thinker... a skill one needs in spades to be a nurse.
    Last edit by ali_gator on Nov 19, '05
  10. by   Fun2, RN, BSN
    I'm really sure the term "jibberish" meant non-nursing courses.

    (Also, if you read back, she has apologized for that comment it was not to offend anyone. For that matter, if someone thinks that all the non-nursing courses are "jibberish" that is his or her opinion. An opinion is not wrong, it may not be mutual across the board, but it is not wrong.)
  11. by   kadokin
    Quote from tlhubbard
    I am an RN in Ohio with an associates degree. I posted on another the thread (for LPNs) a concern with what Indiana and Ohio are considering. They are piloting having "trained" (6 or 8 weeks course) CNAs to pass meds in LTC. :uhoh21: I see this as a way to "band aid" the nursing shortage with a warm body mentality. We spend years on pharmacology, someone else gets weeks and is considered competent? This is also a "cost effective" way to not have as many nurses on staff :angryfire

    Personally, I think it is VERY unfair to the LPNs in our state (who until the recent grads-last 6 months-did not have IV certification). LPNs without the certification can only assess IV sites and verify hanging solutions and rates. Otherwise they need an LPN with IV cert or an RN. This will put them at a BIG disadvantage with jobs, as the hospitals will not be able to absorb them either (r/t IV certification).

    It is sad that we are not more valued by the powers that be (our employers, local and state government and our Boards of Nursing). Just as the insurance companies have business degree people making medical decisions, we have politicians making nursing realm of practice changes. We need to make more noise and defend our careers and the dignity of our profession.

    We need to make our profession more appealing to those who may consider it. If we were paid based on the percent of patient contact, we'd put the doctors out of business.
    ...If we were paid based on the percetage of pt contact... too true, and yet, we don't have the md's preparation. I know, I know...there are many seasoned nurses out there who can out-think and out-perform a green or incompetent md, but still, we are NOT mds. We approach pt care in a completely different way that I believe is no less valuable. Try and get the job done w/o us DR! I've said it before, and I'll say it again (this is from the dean of my nursing school, not an original thought), People come to the hospital(or ltc facility) for NURSING care. I extend again my challenge to anyone who can name a service offered by a hospital (besides nursing) that could not be given on an outpt basis.
  12. by   Fun2, RN, BSN
    Quote from kadokin
    ...We approach pt care in a completely different way that I believe is no less valuable.
    This is so true, and the reason why many of us are going into (or are already in) nursing.

    People always talk about "the bad bedside manner" of a doctor, but seldom do you hear about the "the bad bedside manner" of nurses. Why? Because nurses are, in general, the caring part of healthcare. Therefore, in this sense, nurses are respected.

    I would far rather be known as a caring nurse, than a Dr. with a bad bedside manner.
  13. by   kadokin
    Quote from grannynurse FNP student
    I guess I live in an area that has it backwards. SW Florida starting salary for a new teacher $32,500, starting RN $22, 500.

    Grannynurse
    Yes, I see this in my area (central IL), as well. Teacher's pay is better than nurse's. But, then, they have a v. strong uion in this area. But, compare most educated professional's pay to a high performer in sports or show-biz and you will get an idea of how our society assigns value. It is just too bad.:uhoh21:

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