Nurse Strangles Intruder With Bare Hands - page 4

What a story! Last night in Portland, Oregon a 56 year old nurse came home to find an intruder in her house. I think he had a hammer? She strangled him with her bare hands! He is dead. I'm sure... Read More

  1. by   RN/MSN/JD
    Quote from Gompers
    I agree. That poor woman is going to have to live with this for the rest of her life. I don't care who the victim is - murder is never something to cheer about.
    "Murder" is what the law says it is. In this case, it was probably NOT murder. If Oregon is a state that allows deadly force without retreat against an intruder in your home, then it is not anything. If Oregon does NOT allow deadly force in this situation, it is at best manslaughter.
  2. by   Daytonite
    While my first reaction to hearing this story was shock, then, good for this nurse, upon further thought I'm now thinking that this might not be such a good situation for all of nursing or this nurse in particular. The media is going to have a field day with this. This is going to be used to justify every bad thing the public has ever heard about nurses.

    I am currently taking a class in Law as it relates to healthcare. A law professor teaches it. While this incident hadn't been reported since my last class I will be interested to hear what the professor has to say about it. My concern for this nurse is this: there are some limits to self-defense. I am worried that this nurses' professional training and work as an ER nurse might be used by a Grand Jury or a District Attorney to hold her to a higher standard. They might believe that she had the knowledge to know just how far choking this man could have gone toward just incapacitating him as contrasted to resulting in his death. I read both articles linked to this story on the first page of this thread and both make similar statements that could be very detrimental to this nurse. One quotes her neighbor as saying something to the effect that she was calm after this incident because she was an ER nurse and went on to praise her for her clear thinking. Folks, you don't kill when you are thinking clearly and calmly, and I think a statement like that could get this nurse into a lot of trouble in the days to come. If this neighbor also made that statement to police investigators I think it could spell a lot of trouble for this lady. Add to that the fact that this nurse bested this intruder by 80 pounds. If this 180 pound man were in a compromised position toward the end of their physical struggle, someone weighing 260 pounds, her stated weight in the CNN article, sitting on his chest would make a serious difference in his ability to breathe! They think that is how Binion was killed in Las Vegas a few years ago--technically called burking. That, to me, would be an intentional act over a helpless person. Of course, the autopsy will reveal a lot of information as well and I'm sure the public doesn't have all the facts.

    I do know one thing. If I had been in this nurses' shoes and survived this, I would have been shaking, crying and barely able to even crawl over to a neighbor's house. That's a huge difference from the description of this nurse after her ordeal. I have no doubt that is going to be considered when all the facts of this case are reviewed by the powers that be. I do feel very, very sorry for this nurse. I think she may be in for a very rough time yet to come. I also feel very, very sorry for the nursing professional as a whole. This is not good publicity for us at all. We're supposed to be supporters of life, not takers of it, even when it happens accidentally through malpractice. Unfortunately, I think this poor sod is always going to be seen by the media as being right up there with Nurse Ratchet.
  3. by   RN/MSN/JD
    Quote from Daytonite
    While my first reaction to hearing this story was shock, then, good for this nurse, upon further thought I'm now thinking that this might not be such a good situation for all of nursing or this nurse in particular. The media is going to have a field day with this. This is going to be used to justify every bad thing the public has ever heard about nurses.

    I am currently taking a class in Law as it relates to healthcare. A law professor teaches it. While this incident hadn't been reported since my last class I will be interested to hear what the professor has to say about it. My concern for this nurse is this: there are some limits to self-defense. I am worried that this nurses' professional training and work as an ER nurse might be used by a Grand Jury or a District Attorney to hold her to a higher standard. They might believe that she had the knowledge to know just how far choking this man could have gone toward just incapacitating him as contrasted to resulting in his death. I read both articles linked to this story on the first page of this thread and both make similar statements that could be very detrimental to this nurse. One quotes her neighbor as saying something to the effect that she was calm after this incident because she was an ER nurse and went on to praise her for her clear thinking. Folks, you don't kill when you are thinking clearly and calmly, and I think a statement like that could get this nurse into a lot of trouble in the days to come. If this neighbor also made that statement to police investigators I think it could spell a lot of trouble for this lady. Add to that the fact that this nurse bested this intruder by 80 pounds. If this 180 pound man were in a compromised position toward the end of their physical struggle, someone weighing 260 pounds, her stated weight in the CNN article, sitting on his chest would make a serious difference in his ability to breathe! They think that is how Binion was killed in Las Vegas a few years ago--technically called burking. That, to me, would be an intentional act over a helpless person. Of course, the autopsy will reveal a lot of information as well and I'm sure the public doesn't have all the facts.

    I do know one thing. If I had been in this nurses' shoes and survived this, I would have been shaking, crying and barely able to even crawl over to a neighbor's house. That's a huge difference from the description of this nurse after her ordeal. I have no doubt that is going to be considered when all the facts of this case are reviewed by the powers that be. I do feel very, very sorry for this nurse. I think she may be in for a very rough time yet to come. I also feel very, very sorry for the nursing professional as a whole. This is not good publicity for us at all. We're supposed to be supporters of life, not takers of it, even when it happens accidentally through malpractice. Unfortunately, I think this poor sod is always going to be seen by the media as being right up there with Nurse Ratchet.
    Glad you are taking a law class. I have a JD, and I think you have jumped into the deep end of the pool. This has nothing to do with nursing or healthcare in general. It will boil down to one thing: the state law regarding whether deadly force may be allowed without retreat against an intruder.

    That's it.
  4. by   mercyteapot
    Quote from Daytonite
    While my first reaction to hearing this story was shock, then, good for this nurse, upon further thought I'm now thinking that this might not be such a good situation for all of nursing or this nurse in particular. The media is going to have a field day with this. This is going to be used to justify every bad thing the public has ever heard about nurses.

    I am currently taking a class in Law as it relates to healthcare. A law professor teaches it. While this incident hadn't been reported since my last class I will be interested to hear what the professor has to say about it. My concern for this nurse is this: there are some limits to self-defense. I am worried that this nurses' professional training and work as an ER nurse might be used by a Grand Jury or a District Attorney to hold her to a higher standard. They might believe that she had the knowledge to know just how far choking this man could have gone toward just incapacitating him as contrasted to resulting in his death. I read both articles linked to this story on the first page of this thread and both make similar statements that could be very detrimental to this nurse. One quotes her neighbor as saying something to the effect that she was calm after this incident because she was an ER nurse and went on to praise her for her clear thinking. Folks, you don't kill when you are thinking clearly and calmly, and I think a statement like that could get this nurse into a lot of trouble in the days to come. If this neighbor also made that statement to police investigators I think it could spell a lot of trouble for this lady. Add to that the fact that this nurse bested this intruder by 80 pounds. If this 180 pound man were in a compromised position toward the end of their physical struggle, someone weighing 260 pounds, her stated weight in the CNN article, sitting on his chest would make a serious difference in his ability to breathe! They think that is how Binion was killed in Las Vegas a few years ago--technically called burking. That, to me, would be an intentional act over a helpless person. Of course, the autopsy will reveal a lot of information as well and I'm sure the public doesn't have all the facts.

    I do know one thing. If I had been in this nurses' shoes and survived this, I would have been shaking, crying and barely able to even crawl over to a neighbor's house. That's a huge difference from the description of this nurse after her ordeal. I have no doubt that is going to be considered when all the facts of this case are reviewed by the powers that be. I do feel very, very sorry for this nurse. I think she may be in for a very rough time yet to come. I also feel very, very sorry for the nursing professional as a whole. This is not good publicity for us at all. We're supposed to be supporters of life, not takers of it, even when it happens accidentally through malpractice. Unfortunately, I think this poor sod is always going to be seen by the media as being right up there with Nurse Ratchet.
    I've got to disagree. I think the public in general is sick and tired of being victimized by career criminals, and I think the media is going to play that angle of the crime.
  5. by   tofutti
    Having been attacked by an intruder in my home, fought and got away, I will say that my full intention was to kill him dead on my kitchen floor and not consult technicalities of my state's laws first. I did get the knife away and stab him 3 times with it before he regained control of me, then I was able to hit the security alarm panel as he dragged me past it, and he fled.
    He did big jail time for it.

    On the humorous side of the story, this was the conversation among some of my nurse friends: Um, you tried to attack a tired, tough ER nurse with one hammer? One hammer, that's all you brought? :chuckle
  6. by   fedupnurse
    If there is a DA stupid enough to bring charges and a grand jury stupid enough to indict, I still think it would be nearly impossible to find a jury that would convict her. She will have to live with this the rest of her life regardless of what happens. I wish the best for her!
  7. by   RN/MSN/JD
    Quote from tofutti
    Having been attacked by an intruder in my home, fought and got away, I will say that my full intention was to kill him dead on my kitchen floor and not consult technicalities of my state's laws first. I did get the knife away and stab him 3 times with it before he regained control of me, then I was able to hit the security alarm panel as he dragged me past it, and he fled.
    He did big jail time for it.

    On the humorous side of the story, this was the conversation among some of my nurse friends: Um, you tried to attack a tired, tough ER nurse with one hammer? One hammer, that's all you brought? :chuckle
    I think most of us feel that way. And thankfully, I live in a state in which one does not have to retreat to use deadly force against an intruder in his/her own home.
    If there is a DA stupid enough to bring charges and a grand jury stupid enough to indict, I still think it would be nearly impossible to find a jury that would convict her. She will have to live with this the rest of her life regardless of what happens. I wish the best for her!
    You might be surprised to find that there have been several convictions for just that. There was one recently, and I am thinking it is in Vermont, because the homeowner used deadly force and there was one more place in the home left to which to retreat.

    There have also been civil suits because of injuries to intruders in states where retreat is required.
  8. by   Daytonite
    Quote from tofutti
    On the humorous side of the story, this was the conversation among some of my nurse friends: Um, you tried to attack a tired, tough ER nurse with one hammer? One hammer, that's all you brought? :chuckle
    I'm ROTFLOL! :roll

    I'm sticking by my thoughts, however, that this neighbor didn't help at all with the comments he made to the press. It really doesn't make nurses look good at all in the eyes of the public which is why, I think, the media latched on to this story.
  9. by   chuckc
    Quote from greenmiler
    Good Job ABCs ;Airway first!!!
    :chuckle :yeahthat:
  10. by   greenmiler
    some of you people on this thread saying things like she shouldn't have murdered him or too bad she had to murder him need to remember this is an international forum, and the link identifies her, and libel is a serious charge.. The article didn't say that she 'murdered' him because the press know better. She has not been arrested for anything and If I we're her and read some of these 'murder' accusasions, I would be a little ticked.

    If I'm a female entering my house and find a guy coming toward me with a hammer , and I find some way to choke him out, i will consider myself lucky.
    If he dies it's too bad.
  11. by   azhiker96
    Quote from BSNDec06
    While I am glad to hear that this nurse was able to defend herself and save herself from becoming a victim, I do not approve of glorifying her for what she did. A life was lost, and that is never something to celebrate.
    I salute any crime target who refuses to be a victim and turns the tables on their attacker.
  12. by   tntrn
    Quote from RN/MSN/JD
    Some states require you to 'retreat' from an intruder in your own home before using deadly force. Let's just hope this nurse does not live in one of those states.

    But if that "intruder" is also armed with a deadly weapon with clear intentions of harming you, must you then retreat? What hogwash! Please, let me know what states have stupid laws like that and I'll make sure to never go there.
  13. by   nuangel1
    i agree she had a right to defend herself i hope i will never be in her position to have to but hope i hve the courage and strength to defend myself.it was self defense.but i agree she still has to live with this terror and the fact he died for the rest of her life.but i don't feel bad the the criminal lost and didn't hurt her .i am glad she is alive.the fact that she is a nurse has nothing to do with it.

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