My degree is not worth the debt! - Page 19

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  1. Asst. Admin
    Jul 3, '11 by
    Quote from Kooky Korky
    Perhaps it should. Maybe we need to go back to the old model of apprenticeships. Learning on the job. OK, let the flaming begin.
    I'm not going to flame you because I am in agreement with you.

    We also need to stop telling every single high school student to go to college. Some students are kinesthetic, very hands-on learners who will never thrive in academic environments where visual and auditory learning is imperative. These students are likely to become disengaged and drop out of a traditional high school with a college-prep track, but would stay the course and graduate if a vocational track was offered (basic high school courses during the first three years and practical job training during the last year in welding, machine operation, plumbing HVAC technology, healthcare, culinary arts, computerized office clerk, and so forth).
    Nurse2bKimberly, lindarn, NRSKarenRN, and 2 others like this.
  2. Jul 3, '11 by
    I think that it's sad that so many high schools have gotten away from vocational training. People in many of these professions have the potential of making some money. Have you hired a plumber, electrician, or a mechanic lately?

    Fuzzy
    Nurse2bKimberly, lindarn, CCRNDiva, and 3 others like this.
  3. Jul 3, '11 by
    Quote from sensei07
    The base pay in my area is $54k for a new grad... minus taxes.. it will probably be $45k/year (this is arbitrary.. I always calculated income tax at 21% based on my HS experiences '05-07). I definitely plan on getting a part-time job (even if it is waitressing/babysitting/caregiver gig)--- that should bring in an extra $15-20k. With the stuff that I want to do (paying off debt, helping out my family, saving for grad school, and retirement), I would have to work 60hrs+/week for the next couple of years. But I'd rather put in the hours now than when I'm in my 40s...
    Yes, you are right on with that. I wish I had done more overtime before marriage and family. Word of advice though- if you can do extra shifts for time and a half you will make out better than a low paying part time job, if you can bear it wherever you are working. In some jobs 40 hours is more than enough. Also, private duty pays very well for extra money and is not physically draining. I have always worked extra jobs, but why work for 10 dollars an hour when you can make 25 as a nurse?
    Nurse2bKimberly, lindarn, and CCRNDiva like this.
  4. Jul 3, '11 by
    Yup it is even rather difficult to enroll for these CCs that have major university course transfers. Intersession and summer classes fill up in moments with online enrollment - especially the sciences. Here you are in the midst of your university classes in a state far away, coming in late for a class one morning just so that you can try to get into one of the CC courses back home, in online enrollment at the time you need it, in order to both take those summer classes at night and do your summer internship during the day. Lots of people have someone enroll for them if they are in a class/lab at enrollment time. It's a gamble, but it's the way to go if you can in your area. This economy does benefit the CCs as well, some are all PhD educators who are leaving the big Us or leaving Biotech for one reason or another. Bottomline is before you choose your university you need to know if any of this is possible. These days, it is part of your preliminary research.
    lindarn likes this.
  5. Jul 3, '11 by
    I was always told- as long as you have a degree it wouldn't matter what school you got it from... but after talking with several employers, they all said the same thing- "it does matter where you go to get your degree." Now, I'm not saying everybody is like that but most people in my area are very particular on who they hire and they look closely at what school they (the student) went too.

    I have decided to go to a private university- because it has one of the best nursing facilities in my state. The state schools in my area are horrible- and people look down on you if you get your degree there because of all the gossip that goes on. It's sad- I know! After it's all said and done, I'm going to be 50k in debt, but I have the luxury of living at home and not having to pay any bills... So, I will pay off my debt before I even think about starting a family. Should take me less than 3 years.
    lindarn, Not_A_Hat_Person, and ktliz like this.
  6. Jul 3, '11 by
    Quote from TheCommuter
    I'm not going to flame you because I am in agreement with you.

    We also need to stop telling every single high school student to go to college. Some students are kinesthetic, very hands-on learners who will never thrive in academic environments where visual and auditory learning is imperative. These students are likely to become disengaged and drop out of a traditional high school with a college-prep track, but would stay the course and graduate if a vocational track was offered (basic high school courses during the first three years and practical job training during the last year in welding, machine operation, plumbing HVAC technology, healthcare, culinary arts, computerized office clerk, and so forth).
    The smartest kid at my junior high school wanted to be a truck driver, which got him a LOT of razzing. He went to the voc/tec high school, where he graduated as valedictorian, and later got an associate's degree in diesel mechanics from the local community college, where he has taught this subject for many years. That school probably produces the best diesel mechanics anywhere!

    One of my former co-workers just had his oldest son graduate from high school with honors, and he's going to an intensive 18-month auto body repair program. We need people to do this, and if he ever changes his mind and decides to be a pharmacist like his dad or a preschool teacher like his mom (as an example), he will have a way to support himself very well while he's in school.
    Nurse2bKimberly, lindarn, CCRNDiva, and 1 other like this.
  7. Jul 3, '11 by
    Quote from ktliz
    I don't think an $800/month student loan payment is necessarily unreasonable for a $45,000 salary. I'm a second-degree BSN student and spent the past 3 years making $9/hour. When I graduate with my BSN, I will have an $800/month student loan payment (undergrad and BSN combined.) I should easily be able to make my payment as well as enjoy a slight increase in my standard of living. Or, I can continue to live as frugally as possible while making extra payments on my loans.

    Just my situation...YMMV.
    Umm, I hate to be the one to tell you this but you will have a hard time making it on $45,000/yr while paying $800/mo in student loans. That is close to what I pay for my mortgage. You will bring home about $12-1300 biweekly on that salary. That leaves you with about $1600/month to pay rent, car payment, utilities, eat, etc. I don't know if you have kids but if you do that will make it even harder. I've worked with RNs with that kind of debt or more. They couldn't buy a home and some had to pick up a 2nd job. A couple had no choice but to go back to school for their NP or CRNA just to increase their income.

    I'm not trying to squash your dreams but there is no way in the world I would pay $800/mo to be a RN unless someone else was going to reimburse me for it. In no way are you alone. Many people are drawn to nursing with reports of being a RN is a guaranteed job. I'm here to tell you it is not!! Many graduates in our area have not been able to secure a job yet we have two schools churning out 2nd degree students on top of traditional students every yr like they're going out of style. Wages are stagnant in a lot of areas. I'm getting a 2% raise after 3yrs without one. Nursing is being oversold as a recession-proof career. These schools are setting up 2nd degree and masters entry programs at alarming rates and charging record amounts for tuition. Some of these grads are coming out with $75,000+ to be a RN!! It should be illegal to charge that amount when most RNs do not make close to that in a yr. They should be ashamed of themselves but we must remember post-secondary education is big business. They want to make $$ whether they are for-profit or not-for-profit.

    Like many others, I'm going to grad school to become a NP which will mean even more debt. This time, I'm looking for a job that has better tuition reimbursement benefits so I won't have to drastically increase my debt burden. My advice to you: be willing to move where the money is. You will need the highest paying RN job you can find to pay off that kind of debt. Beware, though, most of the high paying jobs are in areas with high costs of living. Good luck to you!
    Nurse2bKimberly, lindarn, nursemarion, and 1 other like this.
  8. Jul 3, '11 by
    A little more edu for those who don't know. You get your fancy degree from the big U. You take as many courses as you can at your CC (if you have a good one near you that articulates). You graduate from your big U. You are not graduating from the CC and no one is the wiser. This is why people do this. There is no downside .

    When I got my first degree from the big and difficult to get into U, this stuff was not available to me. It didn't exist. Now two of my young relatives also were smart enough to get into the big and difficult to get into U. They are using up the CC. They began to save by taking courses the summer prior to leaving for the big U. They are now home for summer and making the most of intersession and summer session. One, has lightened his load somewhat and now, will have the time to do special research as well, when he goes back to the big U. BONUS. This research, would not happen if he had to carry the same hours as his fellow most excellent classmates at the big U. This will assure him an internship next year at a most excellent company. Being proactive, he has already had his interview.
    lindarn likes this.
  9. Jul 3, '11 by
    Quote from cxg174
    Pharmacists have a lot of responsibility. They can do a lot more than just fill prescriptions if given the chance. I think that the doctorate is justified. Physical therapists will also have to have a doctorate, but they actually prescribe a plan of care for the patient- the doctor only signs it because it is required. A NP who is prescribing medications too is in a highly responsible position. I can see requiring a doctorate for this too.
    Sounds good, but I disagree! I'm not sure about the history of pharmacist, but PA's and NP's (especially NP's) started out because they already had the on-the-job training to do these things. PA school was started for military medics and hospital corpmen that were skilled in trauma care, and NP school was started because nurses already had the skills to do some of the general practice work needed for children. All these people needed was some extra knowledge and class time to hone and focus their already gained on-the-job skills.

    If your going to get a doctorate degree for these positions, then why not just go to medical school. I can understand if their was no previous gained skills or experience, but in all honest, it only defeats the purpose for why these schools and degrees were created for in the first place, and that is--for NP's mostly--because of a lack of medical students going into primary care services. This is still true today as medical shool costs are high and other specialties pay MD's more money to justify their loans, but not so for NP's getting a PHd--at least not money wise. The most they gain for their cost of a PHd is the ability to be called a doctor--which is not an occupation.
    Nurse2bKimberly, lindarn, CCRNDiva, and 2 others like this.
  10. Jul 3, '11 by
    There's a local NP who also has a Ph.D., but I don't know what the Ph.D. is in. It might be something completely unrelated to nursing. I know what you mean, though.