LPNs Fight Efforts To Phase Them Out - page 4
Licensed Practical Nurses at one hospital are fighting efforts to have them phased out of direct patient care. The hospital intends to go with a different care model calling for expanded use of RNs... Read More
Apr 22, '11I'm an LVN in Texas and it's almost impossible to find an acute care position. The current thinking here is RN for acute care LVN/LPN for LTC. Bridging is also becoming more expensive and difficult to complete. The hospitals will probably phase out the LVN/LPN and replace them with 1/2 as many RNs.
Apr 23, '11A representative of the American Nurses Association, Silver Spring, Md., the only full-service professional organization representing the interests of the nation's 3.1 million registered nurses, believes recent health care studies might have influenced the hospital's decision.
I'm going to guess the author of the article isn't well versed on nursing issues if she thought maybe the ANA who has been trying to get rid of LPNs and ADNs since 1964 would have anything other than that to say.
It doesn't sound like the LPN union is very much on top of things if they sincerely only heard about the impending firings on March 30 and could only offer the opinion that they were "not OK with it" (when would any union be OK with all of their members in a facility being fired for no reason related to their performance??) and that she suggests the hospital hire 51 RNs to replace the 51 LPNs who will soon be out of work. They don't care what you think, Ms Smith.
It's pretty callous that the hospital never gave them a heads up in advance especially for the recently widowed 59 year old LPN who had worked there for "39 years and 5 months". So instead of a party and a "thank you" her loyalty is rewarded with "happy 40th year at Schuykill. You're fired."
My cynicism about this profession is growing by leaps and bounds.Last edit by nursel56 on Apr 23, '11
Apr 23, '11This actually happened on my floor at a hospital I was working with. We had more LPN's than any other floor. I have to say this I had a great working relationship with our LPN's. Most of them had worked at our facility for 30 + years. (I was a new RN) The hospital had been encouraging them to get there RN, but the nurses I worked with were within 5 yrs of retirement. They were not going back to school. I really felt like this was a bad deal. So what they did was they closed our entire floor and re-deployed these LPN's in MA job, phlembotomy, nurses aides & MD offices. They were very upset. Especially if you had to take am major cut in pay. I learned then that there is no loyalty. I also pointed out to a fellow RN....(I currently have an Associates RN) That it is only a matter of time before it is me they are phasing out due to an Associates. My friends actually had a HR person tell them in redeployment that if it was RN with experience but an assoc. applying for a job, or someone fresh out of school w/BSN. They take a BSN first. So ....patient's suffer...We need to get the state board of nursing involved with some grandfathering in of yrs experience vs. degree.
Apr 23, '11Where I live the hospitals are very competitive and magnet status is a big deal. I know of at least 1 major hospital that is very close (Ive heard within the next year) to requiring all their nurses to be BSN grads. The RNs there now dont know if this means they will lose their jobs if they dont get their BSN. Im in school right now and was told by my teacher that if we didnt at least say we were going to pursue our BSN we might not be able to land a hospital job when we graduate. Are BSN going to be paid more? From what I have heard its about .50 more than an RN makes right now. The way this is going down, you will end up spending more of your life working harder and longer, shelling out thousands more for education and make the same amount of pay and this applys to almost any profession out there today. Welcome to the new world order.Last edit by Anne36 on Apr 23, '11
Apr 23, '11Some of the best caretakers in the hospital are LPN's and I let them know it. New BSN grads would be well served to learn from these LPN's. I would hate to see that much knowledge leave the hospital. This is just my opinion and nobody is listening (administration).
Apr 23, '11Quote from drmorton2bThis is what happened in the early 90s in Massachusetts with most acute care hospital LPNs. I am slowly but surely going to get my RN.
To all of us considering returning to school to improve Nursing education/credentials; please more surely than slowly. If you are living in a state with a "BSN in 10" bill or law, timing is very important. LPNs you know what you must do. Simply put, much publicized research and the consumerism movement equate RN staffing and education to improved patient outcomes. If you are not retiring in the next ten years you may want to consider getting RN/BSN sooner rather than later. RNs are scrambling to get their BSN and LPNs are scrambling to hold onto their jobs. Especially true in NJ's tight Nursing market. Some hospitals are requiring BSN in five years. Advanced Nurse Practioners are required to obtain Doctorial status to continue Practice and achieve Doctorial status as entry into practice as of 2015 no grace periods or grandfathering! Success to you in your endeavors. Thank you for the post.:grad:
Apr 24, '11It is not true (at least not yet) that NPs are required to have a doctoral degree to enter into the practice as of 2015:
There has been no deadline set, and in fact, no such requirement yet exists. I was also told that by the dean of UPenn . It may be coming, but the requirement isn't here yet.
And yes, here in NJ, it is a tight market and jobs for LPNs are becoming harder and harder to get. Even many of the LTC facilities are now hiring RNs exclusively or in greater numbers than in the past. Some of the bigger hospitals have gone BSN-only, but here in South Jersey, most of the hospitals still hire ASNs. Again, that could change.
May I put a kind word in for the LPNs I have worked with who have taught me so much about patient care! It would be tragic if they were forced out without being given a chance to get their RNs first.
Apr 24, '11LPNs in my hospital were d/c in all critical areas. Now they are only allowed to work in med/surg without tele, and are being replaced with RNs when they leave.
Apr 24, '111. There is more than enough work to go around 2. People assume that we are not real nurses I beg to differ each state governs what role you perform as your title permits your scope of practice 3.lpns. need the support of everyone in the healthcare community plain and simple 4.if you think we are not worth our weight in gold think about thisyour patient count will only increase and since healthcare is now law that means more people will be needing our services so support your lpns in this endeavor keep me on the team and you know the dr will noot be providing bedside care nurses you will and remember you are still responsible on your license remember I have a license to protect
Apr 24, '11Quote from martinalpn1. There is more than enough work to go around 2. People assume that we are not real nurses I beg to differ each state governs what role you perform as your title permits your scope of practice 3.lpns. need the support of everyone in the healthcare community plain and simple 4.if you think we are not worth our weight in gold think about thisyour patient count will only increase and since healthcare is now law that means more people will be needing our services so support your lpns in this endeavor keep me on the team and you know the dr will noot be providing bedside care nurses you will and remember you are still responsible on your license remember I have a license to protect
No one has argued against any of this. Everyone has only stated how they see the trend going in their respective areas.
Apr 25, '11Unfortunately or fortunately for my residents, the LPN's are knowledgeable, capable and pretty much run the show where I work. They are caring and more than capable to provide excellent nursing care, and not to good to accept constructive criticism to provide the best possible care. I won't say all, but the majority of RN's I work with are threatened by the level of knowledge the LPN's have, and go out of their way not to fix errors found by the LPN's, or make up excuses why the errors are really not errors??? The law is the law, and not left open for interpretation, it never ceases to amaze me.
I have heard the rumor since I received my nursing license in 1975 of the LPN's being phased out. It's just not going to happen. I will admit, if I had the opportunity I would of returned to school to get my RN. Not just to say I am an RN, but to be able to make worthwhile contributions without having to play the game of stroking the RN's to be heard. Having RN after your name is not a guarantee of intelligence...sometimes, just the opposite!
One thing always to remember a "good" nurse has respect for all their staff. Every position/department plays an important role in the recovery or maintenance of your patients. There's no place for an inflated ego in any aspect of patient care.
Apr 25, '11Quote from Ginger's MomI guess it all depends on what setting you work in.While I feel bad for the lpns, the acute hospital is too complex for the lpn. I know the lpns feel they are equal to the rns,but reality they are not. Being a rn who has to assume the meds, the blood trandfusuons for the lpn, it is not easy or the same. If there is an issue, does adm call the lpn, no it is the rn who gets the call.
Do a search on quality measures for this hosptial cited, it is below the state and national average. I went back to school to get my msn, I was close to 50 when I graduated. I was motivated since the positions I wanted needed a msn. If you aspire to work a nurse in a hospital, get a rn, and protect yourself with a bsn.
I'd have to respectfully disagree with the assertion that pts in the hospital are too complex for LPNs to deal with. I've been in a supportive environment where I've been encouraged for years to push myself and learn all I can. I regularly get medically complex pts...those ones that are teetering on the edge of needing ICU or step-down care...b/c I can handle the complexity. It's also no big thing on my floor for the BSNs to ask me my advice when they have more critical pts; there's a recognition there that I often have more experience than they do, regardless of the level of formal nursing education any of us have. And I can guarantee you that if something goes down, it's gonna be my butt in the office. I run my own team as independently as any of the RNs do, and have the same accountability. There are plenty of times when it's me in there teaching how to do procedures...CAPD, dropping a NG, NT suctioning most recently...and plenty of times that I'm asked to explain the thinking process behind why docs ordered one med vs another, or certain procedures, etc.
I realize that not all LPNs have the opportunities or environment I do, and that seems like a waste to me. How can people be expected to excel if they are in a setting that is constantly setting limits based on a skewed misperception of their abilities? I'm not talking about operating beyond scope of practice, of course...just that all too common misconception that "LPNs do tasks and RNs do the thinking".