Jahi McMath "What does it mean to die?"

  1. Interesting read....

    What Does It Mean to Die? | The New Yorker


    Before having her tonsils removed, Jahi McMath, a thirteen-year-old African-American girl from Oakland, California, asked her doctor, Frederick Rosen, about his credentials. "How many times have you done this surgery?" Hundreds of times, Rosen said. "Did you get enough sleep last night?" He'd slept fine, he responded. Jahi's mother, Nailah Winkfield, encouraged Jahi to keep asking questions. "It's your body," she said. "Feel free to ask that man whatever you want."
    Last edit by traumaRUs on Jan 30
    •  
  2. Visit Christy1019 profile page

    About Christy1019

    Joined: Mar '08; Posts: 893; Likes: 1,857

    38 Comments

  3. by   klone
    What a great article! It certainly changes my thinking about the whole situation. While I would not choose to remain unconscious on a vent, nor would I choose that for one of my loved ones, I definitely don't believe she's brain dead after reading that article and the testing/research they've done with her.
  4. by   elkpark
    I can't believe anyone is still helping this family maintain and publicize this charade. It's so sad. They should let her go (and the state should certainly not be paying for her care). I'm disappointed in TNY for publishing this. I notice the story left out details from her original surgery, like the reports of the family feeding her fast food post-operatively, contrary to the physicians' dietary orders, and just makes it sound like the providers couldn't be bothered to do a good job and something just mysteriously went wrong.
  5. by   meanmaryjean
    Quote from elkpark
    I can't believe anyone is still helping this family maintain and publicize this charade. It's so sad. They should let her go (and the state should certainly not be paying for her care). I'm disappointed in TNY for publishing this. I notice the story left out details from her original surgery, like the reports of the family feeding her fast food post-operatively, contrary to the physicians' dietary orders, and just makes it sound like the providers couldn't be bothered to do a good job and something just mysteriously went wrong.
    Agreed! There is soooooo much more to this story than the family likes to admit.
  6. by   Rose_Queen
    Quote from elkpark
    I can't believe anyone is still helping this family maintain and publicize this charade. It's so sad. They should let her go (and the state should certainly not be paying for her care). I'm disappointed in TNY for publishing this. I notice the story left out details from her original surgery, like the reports of the family feeding her fast food post-operatively, contrary to the physicians' dietary orders, and just makes it sound like the providers couldn't be bothered to do a good job and something just mysteriously went wrong.
    Not to mention they kept writing tonsillectomy and she had a much more involved surgery than just that.
  7. by   klone
    I think the type of surgery and whether the family's actions may have caused the bleeding complications are irrelevant to the point of this particular article.
  8. by   elkpark
    Quote from klone
    I think the type of surgery and whether the family's actions may have caused the bleeding complications are irrelevant to the point of this particular article.
    Perhaps, but I find the unquestioning acceptance and endorsement by the author of the family's perspective off-putting. The article seems v. one-sided to me. The family and their supporters are all good, and members of the mainstream medical community are all bad. I don't see a point to enabling and publicizing the family, and I don't see much other point to the article.
    Last edit by elkpark on Feb 1
  9. by   klone
    Quote from elkpark
    Perhaps, but I find the unquestioning acceptance and endorsement by the author of the family's perspective off-putting. The article seems v. one-sided to me. The family and their supporters are all good, and members of the mainstream medical community are all bad. I don't see a point to enabling and publicizing the family, and I don't see much other point to the article.
    Did you read the article in its entirety? A good 1/3 of the article was not about Jahi at all, but rather about the history of the idea of "brain death" and how it has been forced to evolve over time as technology has advances. It's about how the world's leading medical experts on neurology and bioethics came together several times over the last 40 years to assess, and reassess, how brain death should be defined. And how, when faced with new information that contradicts their strongly held beliefs, some of those experts chose to deny the existence of validity of the information, and others chose to accept and embrace the new information, have epiphanies, and weave this new information into the framework of what they believe to be "true."

    Frankly, I thought it was a beautiful article about the evolution of science, and the Jahi part, while fascinating, was a secondary story, IMO.

    I thought this quote from the article was particularly poignant:
    "...the people who have done the deep and conceptual thinking about brain death are people with high I.Q.s, who tremendously value their cognitive abilities-people who believe that the ability to think, to plan, and to act in the world are what make for meaningful lives. But there is a different tradition that looks much more to the body."
  10. by   JKL33
    Quote from klone
    A good 1/3 of the article was not about Jahi at all, but rather about the history of the idea of "brain death" and how it has been forced to evolve over time as technology has advances. It's about how the world's leading medical experts on neurology and bioethics came together several times over the last 40 years to assess, and reassess, how brain death should be defined. And how, when faced with new information that contradicts their strongly held beliefs, some of those experts chose to deny the existence of validity of the information, and others chose to accept and embrace the new information, have epiphanies, and weave this new information into the framework of what they believe to be "true."
    I found this thought-provoking as well.
  11. by   OrganizedChaos
    Quote from klone
    I think the type of surgery and whether the family's actions may have caused the bleeding complications are irrelevant to the point of this particular article.
    I don't think so. They discuss the whole fiasco & point the finger at all the doctors & nurses. We know what really happened & the article should put what really happened.
  12. by   OrganizedChaos
    Quote from elkpark
    I can't believe anyone is still helping this family maintain and publicize this charade. It's so sad. They should let her go (and the state should certainly not be paying for her care). I'm disappointed in TNY for publishing this. I notice the story left out details from her original surgery, like the reports of the family feeding her fast food post-operatively, contrary to the physicians' dietary orders, and just makes it sound like the providers couldn't be bothered to do a good job and something just mysteriously went wrong.
    I know. I can't believe it's been so many years & they are keeping this going. If they want to keep a brain dead child alive, the parents should pay for it. Not the tax payers.

    I don't know why the mother is shocked people are reporting her. If she doesn't have a job where is the money coming from for her purses & things? We're not stupid!
  13. by   OrganizedChaos
    Quote from elkpark
    Perhaps, but I find the unquestioning acceptance and endorsement by the author of the family's perspective off-putting. The article seems v. one-sided to me. The family and their supporters are all good, and members of the mainstream medical community are all bad. I don't see a point to enabling and publicizing the family, and I don't see much other point to the article.
    It was v. one sided & made it hard to read. Why wild O want to read an article that's full of lies?
  14. by   OrganizedChaos
    Quote from klone
    Did you read the article in its entirety? A good 1/3 of the article was not about Jahi at all, but rather about the history of the idea of "brain death" and how it has been forced to evolve over time as technology has advances. It's about how the world's leading medical experts on neurology and bioethics came together several times over the last 40 years to assess, and reassess, how brain death should be defined. And how, when faced with new information that contradicts their strongly held beliefs, some of those experts chose to deny the existence of validity of the information, and others chose to accept and embrace the new information, have epiphanies, and weave this new information into the framework of what they believe to be "true."

    Frankly, I thought it was a beautiful article about the evolution of science, and the Jahi part, while fascinating, was a secondary story, IMO.

    I thought this quote from the article was particularly poignant:
    Yeah, but you have to dig through all the bs to find the gold. There was waaaay too much bs.

close