Goodbye OT: RN's LOOSERS, LPN's WINNERS - page 4

From MSN, the new OT bill was passed. RN's you loose, LPN's win. Overhaul redefines overtime pay rules advertisement More lower-income workers are guaranteed overtime pay, but... Read More

  1. Visit  jenrninmi} profile page
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    What about 4-year degree nurses?
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  3. Visit  wjf00} profile page
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    Quote from lee1
    How many nurse's (RN) that make more than $100,000/yr. There are none in my area unless they are managment and they don't get OT anyway.
    In the unit I work in a lot of nurses topped $100,000. last year. At least 2 I know of topped $125,000.
    So these changes do affect nurses.
    I regularly refuse all OT. I work 24 hours a week and I dont particularly want any more hours. If not for a union contract I could be forced to work OT with no compensation.
  4. Visit  orrnlori} profile page
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    Quote from JENRN2BMICHIGAN
    What about 4-year degree nurses?
    What about them?
  5. Visit  ktwlpn} profile page
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    Quote from orrnlori
    Geeeeezzzzz. I think some are getting their panties in a wad when the details are not clear yet. While I know hospitals are not always the brightess bulbs in the fixtures I still think they have a little grasp on reality here.
    I think many of our co-workers are truly worried about paying their bills-many depend on OT .......If you don't have a union you will be at the mercy of your administration and many are very shortsighted....Some do have a little grasp on reality-very little.......you are right about that......
  6. Visit  jenrninmi} profile page
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    Quote from orrnlori
    What about them?
    What do you mean "what about them"??? You guys are all talking about 2-year degree nurses losing overtime pay, I don't see anything about 4-year-degree nurses. I thought that would be obvious.:uhoh21:
  7. Visit  mitchsmom} profile page
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    Face it, you're all going to be screwed because I just decided to enter this profession so naturally it will go to $&!.
    Seriously, I don't think it will make a huge difference right away but they will use it to chip away little by little. If they do it that way then no one will revolt (which they have apparently been doing this slowly for years already judging by what I read around here... higher pt/nurse ratios, mandatory OT, etc etc. more work, less time to do it...) . Slow and steady wins the race. Of course they are going to save money at any possible opportunity, that's the bottom line.
    My husband has coworkers in his company in CA that sued the company, claiming that they are non-professional level workers so they should get OT. They won their suit and so the CEO basically swore they would NEVER get a minute over 40 hours unless it was over his dead body and hired another worker so they DON'T. Now they make EXACTLY their salary and not a penny more (before they didn't get time + 1/2, but at least they got paid their regular day's rate if they worked extra).
    There's always a way to get around it.

    Jennifer, I think BSN's, MSN's, etc. fall into the same category as ADN RN's. I think the two year degree thing was the dividing line that made RN's "professional" and eligible for salary/no OT (I guess at the $100,000 mark... I still don't understand it all either). An educational level less than the 2 year degree was decided as "skilled labor" (hourly labor, blue collar, whatever they call it) and qualifies for OT as part of an hourly wage worker. Someone correct me if I've got it all wrong
    In this situation it is confusing because RN's are hourly workers too... usually it's a difference between salaried workers who don't get OT, any extra work is part of the job description and considered part of their salary; and hourly workers who traditionally get OT.
    Last edit by mitchsmom on Apr 26, '04
  8. Visit  rhiannonwolf} profile page
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    THIS IS WHY I AM VOTING FOR KERRY.....
    I can't stand Bush......ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!
  9. Visit  kwagner_51} profile page
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    Neither Kerry nor Bush can do ANYTHING!!! They have absolutely NO power. We need to be concerned about our US Reps and Senators.

    More important than the president, learn who your [our] State Reps are. It will be changed in the STATE house NOT the WHITE HOUSE!!

    Each individual State has the right to override the Fed gov. [10th Amendment to the US Constitution]. States can't go lower but they can go higher. [i.e. min wage] States can also pass laws to overrule this Crap! We just need to let our state people know!!
  10. Visit  NannaNurse} profile page
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    I agree.......WE are the one's who will have to STAND UP AND YELL AS LOUD AS WE CAN THAT WE ARE NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!! I've said for a long time, I will we nurses had the 'balls' to pick a day and make it a 'National Nurses Sit Out Day' where all of us, regardless of title, LPN and RN alike...we are all PROFESSIONAL people and we are getting royally screwed :hatparty:
    We really can't complain about our work load, hours, etc....because we had stood by and allowed it to happen.
    We all need to get unionized and let the 'powers that be' we are sick and tired and we are not going to take it anymore.
    Until we all, as one voice, one group, are heard AND seen, we are going to keep working our butts off and line the pockets of other people who really don't give a crap :angryfire
  11. Visit  becca.utns} profile page
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    I know nobody likes to be told they can't have something, but really...how many RN's make over 100,000? You can't believe everything you hear from your co-workers.
  12. Visit  rasmu} profile page
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    Quote from suemom2kay
    Exempted from the rules means no overtime pay. Exempt employees do not get overtime pay.

    http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/complian...17n_nurses.htm

    Nurses

    To qualify for the learned professional employee exemption, all of the following tests must be met:
    The employee must be compensated on a salary or fee basis (as defined in the regulations) at a rate not less than $455 per week;
    The employee's primary duty must be the performance of work requiring advanced knowledge, defined as work which is predominantly intellectual in character and which includes work requiring the consistent exercise of discretion and judgment;
    The advanced knowledge must be in a field of science or learning; and
    The advanced knowledge must be customarily acquired by a prolonged course of specialized intellectual instruction.

    Registered nurses who are paid on an hourly basis should receive overtime pay. However, registered nurses who are registered by the appropriate State examining board generally meet the duties requirements for the learned professional exemption, and if paid on a salary basis of at least $455 per week, may be classified as exempt.
    Clear as mud... ain't it???

    Licensed practical nurses and other similar health care employees, however, generally do not qualify as exempt learned professionals, regardless of work experience and training, because possession of a specialized advanced academic degree is not a standard prerequisite for entry into such occupations, and are entitled to overtime pay.
    I believe that the DOL is actually being clear about it's intentions toward registered nurses. What they are saying is that registered nurses who are paid an hourly basis, will get overtime. Salaried registered nurses will not.

    When the DOL says "registered nurses who are registered by the appropriate State examining board ... may be classified as exempt.", who they are talking about is ALL salaried registered nurses. There isn't any such thing as a registered nurse who isn't registered by the appropriate state examining board.

    The stilted lawyer-like language is deliberate. In an election year, they are trying to create confusion in the press and hide what they are doing to registered nurses.

    If you want to know what happens to workers who are salary exempt in a field with high cost pressures and with mandatory overtime, talk to anybody who works in the Information Technology field. Look on their websites, and you will read nightmare stories about how employers in that field view free overtime as UNLIMITED overtime.

    Ultimately, this will put pressure on RNs who are paid hourly, as employers try to convert hourly jobs to salaried exempt jobs.

    Maybe the shortage of nurses will hold these forces at bay for the short term, but if that shortage ever goes away..... Look out.
  13. Visit  Tony35NYC} profile page
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    Quote from rasmu
    Maybe the shortage of nurses will hold these forces at bay for the short term, but if that shortage ever goes away..... Look out.
    If anything, these overtime rules will probably drive more nurses out of the hospitals, the quality of patient care will deteriorate, and the hospitals will suffer. Its no secret that some RNs are making more $$$ than some physicians, and if the hospitals could figure out a reasonable way to cut overtime for RNs they would do it in an instant. But, management will be cautious because they don't want to lose their best nurses. The smart administrators know that continuous staff turnover is much more costly than paying overtime.

    As for the nursing shortage. Sure, there's lots of people applying to nursing school these days but most flunk out along the way, and according to the DOL the number of new grads continues to be small relative to the number of people who leave for other professions or retire. Despite Bush's efforts, I'm very optimistic about the future of the profession.
  14. Visit  rasmu} profile page
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    Quote from Tony35NYC
    If anything, these overtime rules will probably drive more nurses out of the hospitals, the quality of patient care will deteriorate, and the hospitals will suffer. Its no secret that some RNs are making more $$$ than some physicians, and if the hospitals could figure out a reasonable way to cut overtime for RNs they would do it in an instant. But, management will be cautious because they don't want to lose their best nurses. The smart administrators know that continuous staff turnover is much more costly than paying overtime.

    As for the nursing shortage. Sure, there's lots of people applying to nursing school these days but most flunk out along the way, and according to the DOL the number of new grads continues to be small relative to the number of people who leave for other professions or retire. Despite Bush's efforts, I'm very optimistic about the future of the profession.
    Yee gads! I've been admitted as a nursing student to an RN program, and will be starting in the Fall. What do they DO to student nurses to make them all flunk out?

    Nursing is a second career for me, and I am also quite optimistic that I have made the right choice. (I used to be a computer programmer before the job market became flooded with cheap overseas computer programmers and all the jobs disappeared). I can see some tough things going on in the nursing field, but what particularly impresses me is the high ideals repeatedly expressed on this website, despite the adversity. I am glad I will soon be one of you.


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