Five sue over nursing-school ouster

Have you guys asked for your grades? Have you gone up the chain? What gives?

I can't help but wonder if maybe some of the students should not have been in school to begin with. Yes, I know there are instructors who play games, play God, do awful things to students. But some students are very difficult, too.

Students are working full time, they are raising families, they are doing both of the foregoing. They come to class unprepared, come late, expect lots of latitude in attendance, dress, turning in work due to home and personal issues.

When I was an instructor, I made it known from Day 1 that there was no excuse less than death that was acceptable for absenteeism or tardiness. Harsh, yes, did I hold them to it, of course not. But they got my point. They knew I would not accept babysitter ills, car and other transportation troubles, broken heaters, water mains, or other disasters. They were told to have as many back-up sitters, home care, and travel arrangements as needed to never ever ever miss my class or clinicals. And they didn't. If they missed pop quizzes, too bad, no make up.

If they or their child were sick and they brought me an excuse from an ER or MD office, I'd verify the excuse and let them take the test. Otherwise, no. Same with papers, prep for clinicals, everything. Headache, tylenol, cramps, Pamprin, sorry, I am not coming in on my day off to make up missed clinical hours. Sorry if that's selfish, but I thought that part of my job was to prepare them for the world of work, where employers are apt to be less than kind about all of these problems, especially if it's always the same person having all of these troubles.

I held plenty of review sessions in which I darn near gave them the answers. I was shocked at how many still barely passed or even failed. That's why I say some students don't belong in school. My lectures were meant to be review if they had read the text before class. Boring but simple, easy. Yet, so many had not pre-read and even the ones who c/o about the boredom had trouble passing the tests.

I'm in school right now, so I'm in the middle of "full time family, full time work, full time school." I've also got the real life experience of being an LPN on a ICU stepdown/telemetry floor. Here's what I'm seeing:

1. Students who are "book smart, world foolish" -- people who can recite a book answer, but when you show them an actual patient, they don't know ABCs, and focus on how to make a bed rather than the fact that the pt's blue.

2. Students who are "world smart, book foolish" -- people who have been working in the field as EMTs, LPNs, CNAs, and think they already know it all, are good at clinicals, and fail the tests because they don't match the real world.

3. Students who get into it for the wrong reasons -- money, steady job. Honey, for the things we risk -- AIDS, hep, TB, noro, meningitis, virus of the week, being sued for anything by anybody -- we are NOT paid well. All it takes is one mistake, one flailing patient with AIDs or Hep C, and you just paid for your job with your life.

4. Students are NOT prepared (some folks, not all, my school, my experience). I'm talking about the folks who don't know drugs, don't know labs, don't know the pathology, but talk about being management before they've even graduated, or CRNAs before they've even worked on a floor because "it's not nasty." Wait till the first time you see a CRNA put in a femoral TLC. And we don't need managers like you.

5. Students are not exposed to the bad stuff -- I know my hospital tries not to "scare off" the students. Do them a favor. SCARE THEM. Don't make the first time they see someone die be after they've graduated and off their preceptorship. Put them on a GI bleeder, or a person with uncontrolled seizures, or flipping out. Show them what it's really like, not some fluffy butterfly dream.

6. Finally -- get your mind around what nursing school's for. it is about one thing -- teaching you to pass the boards. That is the program's purpose. Anyone who's done the job knows pretty quick that most of the crap you get in school does not help with real world. Nursing school is the price you pay to get out in the world and THEN learn how to be a nurse.

My nursing school taught me how to be a nurse....plain and simple. I passed the boards because I learned what they had to teach (and am very smart). To say all schools teach you how to pass the boards is incorrect. I went to a hospital based nursing school. A higher percentage of people who graduated from this kind of school passed the boards than any other kind of program. And as a new grad, I could run circles around BSN graduates who could quote theory but hadn't a clue what to do with a real person. Lets not lump all schools together.

but those schools, the kind that you and i attended, are rare these days....and becoming rarer.....i would guess that the collegial model is more to the test.....esp d/t cramming things into a shorter time span...i did almost 30 hours a week between class and clinical...i would be interested in what the colleges do....

Had the opportunity to attend a hospital based program and have been in a college BSN program. Very, very sorry that I didn't get with the hospital program. My paper-writing skills might not be so hot, but I know my nursing skills would be a lot better.

lol...yah. I had a BA before I went to school so all my nurses' notes are grammatically correct and the syntax is stellar. Things have changed in nursing education and not for the better I fear.

If you are an interested student, motivated and focused on becoming a nurse, I don't know for sure, but I think all schools give you the tools to become a nurse. The school doesn't make you a nurse. You make yourself a nurse. It's kind of that old saying: dont confuse a degree with an education and don't confuse an education with intelligence(being a nurse). Then comes the question - What is a nurse? As far as the state is concerned it is passing the NCLEX. Any school gives a motivated person the tools to do that. Those tools may not include someone holding your hand, giving good lectures, clinical experience and motivating you. In the end, good or bad instructors, you have to accept responsiblity for yourself and your ability to make it. I had one good instructor(i prefer to call her a teacher). The rest sucked and in spite of them I did very well in school and consider myself a nurse. As I work towards my BSN, I hope I have good instructors in the future, but it doesn't really matter because in the end I will become a BSN and a better nurse.

I was "weeded out" of a BSN program when I was 20 in my sophmore year. I behaved poorly - bad grades & late to classes. I repeated a class - nursing assessments & thought i passed the exam - but the professor failed me on my 2nd try (you're out if you fail a class 2x) - & basically she said this wasn't for me or to go to an ADN program. 15 years later I went back to nursing & graduated with a 96 avergae in my LPN program & then subsequently with all A's in my RN program. I KNEW I could do it. I wish someone at the 1st school took me by the hand & simply asked what was wrong instead of booting me out - & glad that I wouldn't ruin their reputation. I don't know how this would be of any help to you - the OP - but I hope to God they win that fight. Also - I was offered an opportunity to appeal it (I didn't - i was so young & ignorant) - they should have as well.

An instructor has no business making personal assessments of people. Instructors should look at your grades and class/clinical performance before making a list of who is "not nurse material" - even then, they have no way of knowing.

My CNA instructor said I'd never make it as a CNA, well, she was such a stupid piece of work. She taught because she couldn't hack nursing. No wonder she thought everyone else was incompetent. I passed my state exam and am working now.