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| No. 40 | 
Oct 30, 2009, 03:49 PM
 re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster
The school was fraudulant from the beginning. The proposal was rigged up to look as though the school was going to serve the underserved in the North Philly community, once the money was received from the government and Work force the face started changing. Getting rid of the first Dean (who was changing grades for those she liked, right along with her grand daughter) then the backlash on students who where a product of her beginning.
How can a school hold students responsible for what they are not being taught. We are Consumers who have paid for a service and have been robbed. All the glitzy talk of what will be provided to the students to help them acheive their dreams was just a smoke screen to get the money. Instructors walking out in the middle of lectures to never return, The Dean interrupting seminars and lectures if instructors weren't teaching like her. Real personal stuff that the students should not have been a part of....
Students had to share gloves during lab time, and a few times at the clinical site. There was no proper equipment to do blood draws on, one dummy arem with a million holes in it for 30-60 students to pratice on.. A 30 year psych nurse that haven't been on a med floor in years teaching about the heart(didn't know the material herself). Thats crazy.......
 | | Advertisement Sponsored Links | | | | No. 41 |
Oct 31, 2009, 12:32 AM
re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster
I was told this story by a nurse who'd graduated from Iowa before later becoming a travel nurse and ending up here in AZ.
There was an instructor at an eastern Iowa school who bragged that if you could find the answer to one of her test questions in any reference she wasn't doing her job.
Apparently she thought her job was to make things as tough as possible, in order to prepare her students for "the real world." Later she was fired and lost her license after turning off drips in an ICU rotation to see if the students caught them during their assessments, and then forgetting to turn them back on after they failed to notice them.
I have seen only 2 types of instructors in my time in nursing school: those who seriously mentor and aid their students, and those who play favorites while trying to make things difficult for the ones who don't meet their personal criteria. I would be hard pressed to name any who fell in between.
Ayrman
| | No. 42 |
Oct 31, 2009, 12:37 AM
re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster Originally Posted by ♪♫ in my ♥  I was also surprised at the remarkable lack of breadth among some (certainly not all -- some were amazing) of my NS instructors... poor grammar, marginal math skills, suspect reading comprehension, and limited knowledge of chemistry.
It was occasionally frustrating to interact with an instructor who tried to speak authoritatively on subjects in which their knowledge was deficient and yet, due to only to his/her position as a nursing instructor, expected deference to her/his opinion or representation of the truth.
As with any field, one can be a truly excellent nurse without being particularly well-rounded or knowledgeable in subjects outside of narrow realm of nursing.
What is true in all disciplines, and perhaps especially in nursing, is that a PhD is no indication of practical knowledge nor any ability to impart same to novices.
I totally agree with this. Most of the teachers in nursing are EdDs and have Phds in things like leadership. Nothing wrong with those PhDs but they need to get some people with PhDs in sciences, stats, psych, more variety. This is especially true since lots of the new people coming in ARE experts in their fields prior to entering nursing school.
I used to do data analysis. Had an instructor insist that I did not understand statistics which my previous employer would be amazed to learn! The reality was that SHE did not understand very basic statistical concepts (think ABC's here) and when I started to explain something she got lost and turned it around on me. The more I tried to explain this very basic concept to her without embarassing her the more she insisted that I "did not comprehend the statistics presented and was not interpreting them correctly". Yeah right. We were reviewing the analysis of some research studies which is something I used to make my living at. To top it off, my mid semester review said that I was beginning to understand basic concepts and develop critical thinking skills with help from faculty. She told me that my critical thinking skills were questionable and currently at a failing level. This from a person who does not understand the difference between parametric and nonparametric statistics and may be able to repeat teh definition of a normal distribution but certainly does not know what that implies. Yep I'm the one with no critical thinking skills.
The reason this is really funny is because I have always been chided for being so analytical and always connecting the dots. No one has ever told me that I lacked critical thinking skills or had an inablity to think out of the box. Now if she told me I needed to lighten up, that I would get.
I saw the same instructor try to explain to a computer scientist in my class why computers could not be used in the capacity that the computer programer had suggested. It truely was laughable. But no one wants to fail so the laughing has to wait for after class.
This is all just insecurity. A lot of this faculty may be fine floor nurses and that is what we are there to learn. Its the other stuff they lack in and they need to stop pretending they know stuff they dont. But if the field is going to go up in respectablity I think there really need to be more science and math type people in the field because that knowledge really is necessary to do good research and do good data analysis.
| | No. 43 |
Oct 31, 2009, 07:55 AM
re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster
I am a second career nurse with master's degree in other field, and I was shocked at the lack of ethics that some of the instructors exhibited at my school. The whole field of nursing is unfortunately imbued with this "junior high", spiteful, petty mentality, including management. I think some of it begins at school. If some of the instructors were in the corporate world, they wouldn't last 5 minutes.
Oldiebutgoodie
| | No. 44 |
Oct 31, 2009, 08:09 AM
re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster Originally Posted by Ayrman I was told this story by a nurse who'd graduated from Iowa before later becoming a travel nurse and ending up here in AZ.
There was an instructor at an eastern Iowa school who bragged that if you could find the answer to one of her test questions in any reference she wasn't doing her job.
Apparently she thought her job was to make things as tough as possible, in order to prepare her students for "the real world." Later she was fired and lost her license after turning off drips in an ICU rotation to see if the students caught them during their assessments, and then forgetting to turn them back on after they failed to notice them.
I have seen only 2 types of instructors in my time in nursing school: those who seriously mentor and aid their students, and those who play favorites while trying to make things difficult for the ones who don't meet their personal criteria. I would be hard pressed to name any who fell in between.
Ayrman
There was also a third type where I went to school. They showed up for work and went through the motions. If pressured by the student(s), they were likely to go through the motions of helping them, unlike those who played favorites or were out to get rid of students.
| | No. 45 |
Oct 31, 2009, 09:48 AM
re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster
This must be why 95% of the new nurses I meet are as dumb as toadstools...."Oh you can't run an IV or GTube without a pump. It won't work." Apparently they've never heard of gravity. "Here, take these pills. Doctor says you need them." "What are they?" I asked. "Diuretics" she answered. "Hmmm" says I. "Didn't we just find out my blood pressure is 78/40?" "Well, they're not blood pressure pills, they are water pills."
NO critical thinking skills, not able to think on their own, clueless about what medications are used for. What do they learn in school these days?
Get rid of the bad instructors, but PLEASE, get rid of the dumb nursing students before you set them loose on an unsuspecting public.
| | No. 46 |
Oct 31, 2009, 09:58 AM
re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster
I am going to play devil's advocate.
The court may say that the accreditation of a nursing program is public information, therefore, the school had no duty to specifically disclose that fact.
| | No. 47 |
Oct 31, 2009, 10:00 AM
re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster Originally Posted by caliotter3 There was also a third type where I went to school. They showed up for work and went through the motions. If pressured by the student(s), they were likely to go through the motions of helping them, unlike those who played favorites or were out to get rid of students.
That was our nursing instructors.
We were given our assignments and then our instructor disappeared until it was time for post-conference.
| | No. 48 |
Oct 31, 2009, 10:40 AM
re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster Originally Posted by CapeCodMermaid This must be why 95% of the new nurses I meet are as dumb as toadstools...."Oh you can't run an IV or GTube without a pump. It won't work." Apparently they've never heard of gravity. "Here, take these pills. Doctor says you need them." "What are they?" I asked. "Diuretics" she answered. "Hmmm" says I. "Didn't we just find out my blood pressure is 78/40?" "Well, they're not blood pressure pills, they are water pills."
NO critical thinking skills, not able to think on their own, clueless about what medications are used for. What do they learn in school these days?
Get rid of the bad instructors, but PLEASE, get rid of the dumb nursing students before you set them loose on an unsuspecting public.
Well, I'm not sure the nurses are dumb, I think too much time is spent on care plans, nursing diagnoses, and APA format. Not enough time on the practicalities. I was pretty dumb when I got out of nursing school, too.
When I start the Oldiebutgoodie Nursing School, I will DRILL my students on the most common drugs and what side effects to expect, and when to NOT give it. Critical thinking is developed over time. We need to give baseline information. Right now, students are expected to look up the drug and its side effects. There are 20-30 side effects, for heaven's sake. Which are important? I would make sure that in post conference, they would be drilled on such things as CHECK THE BP before giving the BP pill, the diuretic, or if the patient is going to have dialysis later (one of my own mistakes).
I think a lot of the info given in nursing school is superfluous and makes the experience inefficient, which is why students end up being dump as posts (myself included at the beginning).
Oldiebutgoodie
Dean, the Oldiebutgoodie Nursing School
(not yet accredited)
| | No. 49 |
Oct 31, 2009, 11:53 AM
re: Five sue over nursing-school ouster
Admin note since this is a legal matter:
I caution posters that any info posted here about the schools program is discoverable and can be used in law suit, both for and against, so use caution and discression when posting.
As in any profession and work setting, there is a gammat of great, mediocore and poor performers. Nursing has always tried to uphold highest standards, that's why their is NLNAC (all types of nursing programs) and CCNE(collegiate) accrediation programs.
Candidacy is the first step toward NLNAC Accreditation which St Joseph's as a diploma program would be eligible ..they are not yet listed at Programs with
Candidate Status as only in 3rd year and still working to have program fulfill NLNAC diploma program accreditation, especially outcome standards re
-performance on licensure exam
-program completion
-proram satisfaction
-job placement http://www.nlnac.org/manuals/NLNACManual2008.pdf
NLN's The 2009 NLNAC Report to Constituents includes information about the more than 1,200 nursing programs of all types accredited by the NLNAC as well as highlights from the Fall 2008 and Spring 2009 accreditation cycles. The Report is a great source of information about trends in nursing education. |
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