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Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide



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No. 60
Old Sep 18, 2006, 09:36 PM

Default Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
Ouch. Sounds like this woman would have had better odds if she'd called an ambulance. EMTs would have been sure to slap an ECG on her and it's got to be hard for ER staff to blow off a couple of EMTs. Am I wrong?

And yeah, this does sound like it's within the bounds of criminal law. Gotta wonder exactly what goes into a bad decision like that.
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No. 61
from clee1
Old Sep 18, 2006, 09:53 PM

Default Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
Originally Posted by cyberkat
That would be against the law. A person presenting to an ER must be evaluated by a physician or mid-level practicioner before determining whether the patient is in a life-threatening situation. Triage doesn't count for that.

Nobody is going to have a doc sit at the triage desk and do an eval on everyone who comes in.
OK.... I can see that point. But, with the ED implosion we are currently witnessing, I can see the possibility that triage will become the domain of a NP or PA.

I can also see the law changing once more people die d/t rediculous ED wait times. More quickly if one of those that dies happens to be a VIP.
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No. 62
from Altra
Old Sep 19, 2006, 09:27 AM

Default Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
Originally Posted by spacenurse
I found it interesting that on the preprinted juror's verdict worksheet the manner of death choices (with one circled) are "homicide", "suicide", "accident" and "undetermined". No "natural causes" or some other similar term is available as a choice.

Having never worked for a medical examiner or served on a jury for an inquest, I have no idea if this is typical.
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No. 63
from charebec65
Old Sep 19, 2006, 07:17 PM

Default Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
Originally Posted by MLOS
I found it interesting that on the preprinted juror's verdict worksheet the manner of death choices (with one circled) are "homicide", "suicide", "accident" and "undetermined". No "natural causes" or some other similar term is available as a choice..
I guess in their county, nobody dies of natural causes.... that is odd...
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No. 64
Old Sep 19, 2006, 07:36 PM

Exclamation Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
THIS is a LESSON for all of us!!!take good care of our patients as well as our license.
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No. 65
from weirdRN
Old Sep 19, 2006, 10:13 PM

Default Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
I work in LTC. I sent a resident out who said that his SOB, CP and Nausea were all just symptoms of his hiatal Hernia. Thankfully, that is exactly what it was. However, I am glad I erred on the side of caution. Esp since now I KNOW I could be charged with homocide if I don't get him to a hospital in a timely fashion.
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No. 66
from CHATSDALE
Old Sep 19, 2006, 10:35 PM

Default Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
i worked for a DON once who told me if i needed to go to er no matter the problem to c/o of cps she felt that that was the smart thing to do... i don't think she ever worked in an er

as to the denial part, i had crushing chest pain, disphorisis etc i jumped in the car and drove 20 minutes away to a hospital passing a charity hospital on the way...please don't call me stupid, my kids and the er people took care of that md said that he hated to have nurses for patients..turne out to be hh and it has not repeated in 5 years, i really don't know how i drove through traffic in that condition
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No. 67
from Pat_Pat RN
Old Sep 20, 2006, 12:10 AM

Default Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
What is a "triage nurse"?
We have ONE nurse in our ER. She does it all.
Who is this "charge nurse"?
Hallways are for walking.....AND putting patients in if all 5 of your ER beds are full, and their s/s warrant.
BTW: We DON'T have pharmacy after 5pm, we NEVER have a Radiologist in our facility and sometimes the (one) lab tech takes vitals in the ER.
Welcome to life in Rural America.
You make due with what you are given.
Arise and overcome, it is what our Country was made from.
Be grateful for what you have.

Pat
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No. 68
Old Sep 20, 2006, 12:36 AM

Default Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
I am shocked at this. Homicide to me is an intentional act.
On a clinical rotation I saw a pt come in dripping blood from a lac. Wouldn't have taken long to suture and the ER wasn't busy at that point. She was back in a bed for about 3 hours before anyone ever started sewing her up. I have worked in an office where things like that were treated promptly. Chest pain was always treated promptly. Another ER clinical day I saw a pt come in with CP, had an order to be admitted, had a bed, but had to wait in the ER for 4 more hours waiting on the doc to call with orders. I think that an MD's office that collaborates with the ER to see their nonemergent cases might help. The ER at the hospital I work at has the hospital owned md office directly across a small side street. They could very easily triage and refer instead of having to treat the runny noses and yeast infections.
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No. 69
Old Sep 20, 2006, 12:58 AM

Default Re: Death after two-hour ER wait ruled homicide
Originally Posted by southernlpn
I am shocked at this. Homicide to me is an intentional act.
On a clinical rotation I saw a pt come in dripping blood from a lac. Wouldn't have taken long to suture and the ER wasn't busy at that point. She was back in a bed for about 3 hours before anyone ever started sewing her up. I have worked in an office where things like that were treated promptly. Chest pain was always treated promptly. Another ER clinical day I saw a pt come in with CP, had an order to be admitted, had a bed, but had to wait in the ER for 4 more hours waiting on the doc to call with orders. I think that an MD's office that collaborates with the ER to see their nonemergent cases might help. The ER at the hospital I work at has the hospital owned md office directly across a small side street. They could very easily triage and refer instead of having to treat the runny noses and yeast infections.
''Negligent homicide is a charge brought against persons, who by inaction, allow others under their care to die. This offense mostly concerns itself with the death of small infants or children, the handicapped, or the elderly'' No one is saying that this was an intentional act, but it doesn't have to be to meet the criteria for this charge. If it had been intentional, she'd likely be charged with murder.
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