Chlorhexidine bathing decreases hosp-acq infection - page 5

by GrnTea

10,991 Views | 47 Comments

Thought you all would be interested in this paper, especially those who prefer soap and water even when the hospital protocol is to use chlorhexidine. Effect of Daily Chlorhexidine Bathing on Hospital-Acquired... Read More


  1. 0
    I actually heard this argument on NPR yesterday. Some MD, from TUFTS I believe, (now I wish I would have paid closer to their name) stated that it is quite possible that the use of these soaps have lead to the development of superbugs and actually increased the risk of becoming infected as we are "losing our natural immunity" to our surrounding environment by limiting our exposure to infectious processes.

    Oh well mute point as I can't source the information.

    However.....I can comment that allnurses loves lively debates it is required tha the debates be polite with no personal attacks.
    This means you are free to disagree with anyone on any type of subject matter as long as your criticism is constructive and polite. Additionally, please refrain from name-calling. This is divisive, rude, and derails the thread. Our first priority is to the members that have come here because of the flame-free atmosphere we provide. There is a zero-tolerance policy here against personal attacks. We will not tolerate anyone insulting other's opinion nor name calling.

    Our call is to be supportive, not divisive.
    A few posts have been edited or removed from view..... I think we need to agree to disagree and not be disagreeable in the process.

    We need to please adress each other politely and with respect. I always tell my teens...if you have nothing nice to say....say nothing at all.
  2. 0
    Quote from Esme12
    I actually heard this argument on NPR yesterday. Some MD, from TUFTS I believe, (now I wish I would have paid closer to their name) stated that it is quite possible that the use of these soaps have lead to the development of superbugs and actually increased the risk of becoming infected as we are "losing our natural immunity" to our surrounding environment by limiting our exposure to infectious processes.
    That would be Dr. Levy, the same researcher who published the supplemental article in CID in 2007 (which caused the media attention over antibacterial soaps) detailing some theoretical and speculative concerns on the topic of home use of antibacterials. This is a concern that they still haven't been able to demonstrate with any power and significance in the real world as far as I've been able to find in the literature. Now, the idea has not been discredited, but it doesn't have a lot of evidence to support and the concerns aim squarely at public use where there is no measurable benefit to outweigh the theoretical potential cost.

    Your post also brings up a feature of the human mind: that we tend to recall information far better than we can attribute its source (or veracity). Unfortunately, this human tendency can allow information to later have more credence upon recall (or even the opposite meaning) versus what we might want. We all suffer from it and have to police our minds.

    Oh well mute point as I can't source the information.
    MOOT point... sorry, but that one drives me nuts.
    Last edit by SummitRN on Mar 8, '13
  3. 0
    Quote from SummitRN
    That would be Dr. Levy, the same researcher who published the supplemental article in CID in 2007 (which caused the media attention over antibacterial soaps) detailing some theoretical and speculative concerns on the topic of home use of antibacterials. This is a concern that they still haven't been able to demonstrate with any power and significance in the real world as far as I've been able to find in the literature. Now, the idea has not been discredited, but it doesn't have a lot of evidence to support and the concerns aim squarely at public use where there is no measurable benefit to outweigh the theoretical potential cost.

    Your post also brings up a feature of the human minds, that we tend to recall information far better than we can attribute its source (or veracity). Unfortunately, this human tendency can allow information to later have more credence upon recall (or even the opposite meaning) versus what we might want. We all suffer from it and have to police our minds.


    MOOT point... sorry, but that one drives me nuts.
    I just caught that .....stupid auto correct. Spelling in a pet peeve of mine as well....I was just going to edit when it became "moot" point.....when I saw your response/comment.

    Thanks....I had just picked up my kids at school and there was a a cacophony of chatter and I only heard bits and pieces....I even believe he said that there was not "evidence" of this as well. I don't like to mention a comment about anything without a reference....but it was a just lead in to the conversation.

    I suffer from a rare auto-immune disease and I have heard every theory out there as to why the rise in these rare auto-immune diseases....there are many parts of the theory that for me....rings accuracy and truth.

    I do agree that to not use of these anti-bacterial agents can have far more dire consequences to morbidity and mortality
  4. 0
    I actually like the chlorahexadine baths from the bottle...the wipes are good as well.

    What the policy is at my facility is we can still give the good ole' baths, wait 2 hrs, then do the wipes. You can still do skin care on chlorahexadine treated skin after the bath is dry; preferably two hours after.

    I did this with my pedi CC pt...then dumped the basin I wanted my pt with a clean face, but no chance of a Petri dish face either.
  5. 2
    Quote from morte
    we have heard/seen here on AN. that short staffing has lessened hand washing....and 20% sounds like a lot, but that is 20% of less than 1% of patient days....as i said 23% of small (actuallyvery small) is very, perhaps even very very, small.
    23% is actually pretty huge. It doesn't matter that the sample size was 500, it's meant to be representative of the population in general. And 23% reduction in the general population...well.
    ♪♫ in my ♥ and GrnTea like this.
  6. 2
    Quote from SummitRN
    It is important to understand the COMPLETELY DIFFERENT MECHANISMS by which antibiotics and disinfectants work, and how MDROs develop. You seriously need to review these basic concepts. This is basic nursing fundamentals and pharm 101.

    By your logic we'd better stop using bleach... we don't treat patients with PO bleach... or IV chlorhexidine.
    Wow, I am impressed how quickly you jumped to conclusions and attacked my basic nursing knowledge. You clearly misunderstood what I am saying. I never said antibiotics and disinfectants are the same thing. I do NOT need to review these basic concepts. In fact, I have a very solid understanding of pharm, patho, and microbiology. For the record, since you are attacking my "basic nursing knowledge", I graduated at the top of my class from one of the top nursing schools in the country. I actually know a lot about research and basic research 101 is not to take just one study at face value. I think this is solid study but as a responsible RN, it is my job to ask questions. We all know the link between antibiotics and superbugs but there has also been a link between DISINFECTANTS and superbugs. I just did a 5 minute search of pubmed and found a few links for you:

    Effect of subinhibitory concentrations of benza... [Microbiology. 2010] - PubMed - NCBI
    Pseudomonas aeruginosa cells adapted ... [J Antimicrob Chemother. 2002] - PubMed - NCBI
    Cross-resistance to antibiotics of Escheric... [J Appl Microbiol. 2004] - PubMed - NCBI
    Interactions between biocide cat... [Antimicrob Agents Chemother. 2002] - PubMed - NCBI

    You can also google disinfectants and superbugs and get some news articles on this topic if you wish. I never said that chlorhexidine wipes would absolutely lead to more superbugs. From what I can tell, all the studies published on these wipes show their benefits in acute care settings. Subsequently, I never said we should stop using these wipes or other disinfectants in practice (kind of like we shouldn't stop using antibiotics just because their overuse has lead to superbugs). All I did was ask a very relevant question about the long term use of these wipes. You should reevaluate your attitude before jumping to conclusions. Rather than insulting someone over the internet about something you know very little about, you should probably update yourself on current research.
    Last edit by yuzzamatuzz on Mar 9, '13
    morte and ♪♫ in my ♥ like this.
  7. 0
    Thank you....
    Quote from yuzzamatuzz
    Wow, I am impressed how quickly you jumped to conclusions and attacked my basic nursing knowledge. You clearly misunderstood what I am saying. I never said antibiotics and disinfectants are the same thing. I do NOT need to review these basic concepts. In fact, I have a very solid understanding of pharm, patho, and microbiology. For the record, since you are attacking my "basic nursing knowledge", I graduated at the top of my class from one of the top nursing schools in the country. I actually know a lot about research and basic research 101 is not to take just one study at face value. I think this is solid study but as a responsible RN, it is my job to ask questions. We all know the link between antibiotics and superbugs but there has also been a link between DISINFECTANTS and superbugs. I just did a 5 minute search of pubmed and found a few links for you:

    Effect of subinhibitory concentrations of benza... [Microbiology. 2010] - PubMed - NCBI
    Pseudomonas aeruginosa cells adapted ... [J Antimicrob Chemother. 2002] - PubMed - NCBI
    Cross-resistance to antibiotics of Escheric... [J Appl Microbiol. 2004] - PubMed - NCBI
    Interactions between biocide cat... [Antimicrob Agents Chemother. 2002] - PubMed - NCBI

    You can also google disinfectants and superbugs and get some news articles on this topic if you wish. I never said that chlorhexidine wipes would absolutely lead to more superbugs. From what I can tell, all the studies published on these wipes show their benefits in acute care settings. Subsequently, I never said we should stop using these wipes or other disinfectants in practice (kind of like we shouldn't stop using antibiotics just because their overuse has lead to superbugs). All I did was ask a very relevant question about the long term use of these wipes. You should reevaluate your attitude before jumping to conclusions. Rather than insulting someone over the internet about something you know very little about, you should probably update yourself on current research.
  8. 1
    I know this is a topic from a few weeks back, but I just received an e-mail about how the AACN has issued a practice alert. Now I know some respondents here do not practice in critical-care but it is interesting that this is now what the AACN advocates for critical-care patients.

    http://www.aacn.org/wd/practice/cont...?menu=practice
    Last edit by TiffyRN on Apr 25, '13 : Reason: forgot the link!
    Altra likes this.


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