Belgium Euthanizes Deaf Twins Going Blind - page 3

by Esme12 Senior Moderator | 7,976 Views | 47 Comments

I am for the right to die......however, they weren't terminal, I am not sure how I feel about this....thoughts?... Read More


  1. 1
    Quote from Esme12
    My issue is with they are considering dementia patients...so when you are tired of caring for Momma...and she is confused....put her to sleep...it is a slippery slope.
    Right. Or worse, Momma has dementia and a nice-sized life insurance policy, let's just say she wouldn't want to live this way. And haven't there been cases of parents killing their disabled children as 'mercy' killings? I don't know, it just seems to me like there is so much potential for harm even if most probably WOULD have good intentions...
    CarryThatWeight likes this.
  2. 1
    for them , who are any of us to force them to suffer for years because of uncomfortable feelings about life. why life life life at any cost ? thier life, thier death, thier choice.
    elkpark likes this.
  3. 4
    Quote from CarryThatWeight
    I'll get flamed for this, but I'm horrified. Horrified that it's legal there, and horrified that the best help the medical community could come up with for these two brothers was euthanasia. What happened to do no harm? I agree that there are worse things than dying and that suffering is terrible, but I still believe euthanasia should not be in the medical community's scope of practice. Let's not even talk about being able to consent for others to be euthanized!
    I agree with you.

    Donning asbestos suit now.......
  4. 1
    It's difficult to evaluate this story from the Americanized medicine point of view. People who live in countries with socialized medicine have a different skew. Without any references to this case, patients on the ends of the spectrum of age, do not get the rescue measures that we offer because they couldn't afford to give it to the masses. Your 24 weeker fetus survives with simple measures.....or not. Of COURSE the story of the twins is different but Helen Keller had the same deficits and these young men had the advantage of having been able to see before blindness. She had a life of contribution and meaning without the "advantages" these two men had.
    AngelicDarkness likes this.
  5. 2
    I think it would have been possible, given the right teaching and motivation, for those twins to have some quality of life with each other. The method Helen Keller had of communicating, via the sign language alphabet in a hand, would have worked for these two, also braille and there are good, relatively easy to use portable braille writers available these days. It seems to me they would have required some live-in help just to see to basics, cooking, cleaning and safety. And such a scenario would have required a lot of work. It just makes me sad to think these fellas had such a sense of despondency that they would choose death, when people in years past have shown just what is possible with these disabilities. It makes me think that they deserved better.
  6. 0
    Quote from CarryThatWeight
    What happened to do no harm?
    i believe that many would contend that allowing these twins to exist (not live, but exist) in total darkness and silence, is doing harm.
    that provided there wasn't any further recourse or options, euthanasia was the most compassionate allowance given to the brothers.
    i do not believe this decision was made so casually that other alternatives weren't explored.
    upholding the right of patient autonomy and self-determination, to me it would be causing harm in denying their wishes.
    this isn't about us, it's about them and what they wanted.
    we don't have to like or even agree with it.
    if it's legal and it is what they wanted, that is all that matters.

    i won't even address the slippery slope issue, but would be extremely proactive in preventing any type of euthanasia that takes one's life based on falsehoods, presumptions, and obscurity.
    this doesn't seem to be the case here (with the info that i've received).

    leslie
  7. 2
    Do you really believe it is a slippery slope and that they would eventually allow the demented and the children to be euthanized, or are you catastrophizing a bit?
    OCNRN63 and MandaRN94 like this.
  8. 0
    Quote from mariebailey
    Do you really believe it is a slippery slope and that they would eventually allow the demented and the children to be euthanized, or are you catastrophizing a bit?
    i'm not sure who you are directing the question to, but sadly, no one is "catastrophizing" anything.
    i personally have witnessed extremely unethical orders because of the pt's mental illness and/or their age.

    i for one, wish i was being histrionic and that it couldn't happen.
    but it could, it does, and all of us need to be alerted to the possibility.

    leslie
  9. 0
    Quote from leslie :-D
    i'm not sure who you are directing the question to, but sadly, no one is "catastrophizing" anything.
    i personally have witnessed extremely unethical orders because of the pt's mental illness and/or their age.

    i for one, wish i was being histrionic and that it couldn't happen.
    but it could, it does, and all of us need to be alerted to the possibility.

    leslie
    Leslie: Think I'm 180 degrees in disagreement here. 2 young, relatively healthy men were euthanized because they REQUESTED it(??!!) And I think that age and mental capacity are valid considerations when certain health problems require painful, debilitating or extraordinarily expensive treatments that should be left to younger patients that can survive the consequences. Comfort measures only is an ethical plan....unless you're talking about killing them...not sure what these "unethical" orders are.
    When I get old and demented, please just give me TLC - preferably with my cats present
  10. 0
    Quote from subee
    It's difficult to evaluate this story from the Americanized medicine point of view. People who live in countries with socialized medicine have a different skew. Without any references to this case, patients on the ends of the spectrum of age, do not get the rescue measures that we offer because they couldn't afford to give it to the masses. Your 24 weeker fetus survives with simple measures.....or not. Of COURSE the story of the twins is different but Helen Keller had the same deficits and these young men had the advantage of having been able to see before blindness. She had a life of contribution and meaning without the "advantages" these two men had.
    As far as I can tell your just making that up. I work with a Nurse who's worked in NICUs in Canada, Japan, and Portugal, and she noticed no differences between the US. There's no less use of vent support, ECMO, etc.


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