$3.9 million gift will attack nursing shortage - page 4

Will they be hiring new nurses in 15 months? I sure hope so for all our sakes!... Read More

  1. Visit  kcochrane profile page
    1
    Quote from elkpark
    not all of us are willing to kill for a living -- some people have moral, conscientious objections to joining the military.
    whoa...that's a little harsh for all of us that actually did go into the military. granted cingham's post was a little harsh too, but why trash all those that have served? i respect your objection to serving yourself, but please respect my wish to serve.


    btw if you go into the military as a nurse..that's what you will be doing - nursing.
    Valerie Salva likes this.
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  3. Visit  Valerie Salva profile page
    0
    Quote from emergency rn
    you know, i've talked about this once before here several years ago, and many people actually got incensed and irate, and called me a troll for even offering up the idea. but good ideas should not die, so here it goes again.

    make nursing a tax free employment option.

    here's why, it would not only entice more people into nursing, but in the long run it would actually help employers towards hiring more nurses. consider that when someone applies for a job and calculates his take home; that is the figure that determines whether a career is economically viable or not. while people may not want to flip bedpans, they may do it if their take home salaries are good enough. consider that the federal government takes roughly 25% of a nurses' income, what if that 25% was added back into the paycheck? what would happen?

    first, employers would thank the government because the feds just gave their nurses a raise and it didn't cost them a dime. the money saved could go towards many other patient care things, including hiring more nurses. it would be as if someone gave their payroll budget a 25% increase. secondly, downstream from this, is the fact that people would be attracted to a profession that is "tax free" in some sense. at any rate, it would goes towards keeping many in the profession who are choosing to abandon ship after a few bedside years.

    note, this idea does not need to be enacted fully at 100%. it could also come in the form of federal tax incentives, percentage rated rebates, say for years of service, whatever. my point is, that the federal government could do a lot more than what it has. if nursing "shortages" can be mitigated by h1b visas, then a change of a few lines in the tax code is not without possibility. further, don't let anyone tell you that there isn't a shortage, there is; when a patient rings that bell and a nurse doesn't answer, that is a shortage. it's the politics and economics of nursing that has also contributed to that and we can see what has happened.

    no nurses at the bedside while thousands are standing in the street begging for a job?

    what the hell is wrong with that picture?

    imho, employers need to be able to financially shoulder hiring more nurses. it it takes the federal government to subsidize this by making nurses a tax favored profession, then just do it. a plan such as the above would not only create more nurses, but ensure that those nurses being produced have impact at the bedside; the final judge overall is more positive patient care outcomes.
    we don't need more nurses, we need better working conditions. when the call light rings and a nurse doesn't answer, that's not a shortage- it's short staffing- and nursing work loads being way to heavy. there's a world of difference.

    also, nursing is the second largest profession in the us- second only to teachers. if we paid no or reduced taxes, it would leave a huge fiscal short-fall in the revenue our gov't needs to collect in order to operate and provide the services we need. it will never happen.
  4. Visit  Valerie Salva profile page
    0
    Quote from Walden-Puddle
    Typically the accelerated, ABSN, second degree programs require you to have a LOT more pre-reqs going in than the regular BSN programs....so you can't just go from a BA in English and start nursing school....

    We had to have the basics (Anatomy, Physiology, Chemistry, Biology) all with labs, plus nutrition, developmental psychology, sociology, interpersonal communications, Statistics, pathophysiology, pharmacology and I think even one or two more classes FINISHED in order to even apply to the ABSN program.

    Whereas the typical ADN program in our area require A&P, bio and chem and you're good to go.

    BIG DIFFERENCE....
    Ahem...I don't know where you live but things are a lot different where I am.

    I'm an ADN RN. I was required to take A&P 1 & 2, (both with labs) chem (with lab), micro bio (with lab), nutrition, sociology, pharmacology, pathophys, communications, intro to psych, developmental psych, and even art and PE classes for my ADN.

    And yes, we had to have all these classes completed, and have a minimum 3.0 GPA before applying to the ADN program...And in the grading scale was tougher than the usual.

    92% and above = A
    82-91% =B
    75 to 81 = C
    Below 75% is failing.
    Last edit by Valerie Salva on Feb 12, '10
  5. Visit  Walden-Puddle, RN profile page
    0
    Quote from Valerie Salva
    Ahem...I don't know where you live but things are a lot different where I am.

    I'm an ADN RN. I was required to take A&P 1 & 2, (both with labs) chem (with lab), micro bio (with lab), nutrition, sociology, pharmacology, pathophys, communications, intro to psych, developmental psych, and even art and PE classes for my ADN.

    And yes, we had to have all these classes completed, and have a minimum 3.0 GPA before applying to the ADN program...And in the grading scale was tougher than the usual.

    92% and above = A
    82-91% =B
    75 to 81 = C
    Below 75% is failing.
    See...I think that's great that they have you really load up on the pre-reqs so that you can actually concentrate on learning nursing and nursing skills once you have started in the program. I've always wondered how you could get into a nursing program with just a few science classes (now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure there's some basic english/writing requirement as well.) I'm in Norcal...and they simply include a lot of those other classes in the basic curriculum for the ADN program.

    With all of the classes that you took BEFORE starting, how long was your actual program to get your ADN? (I believe the one I'm thinking about is a little over 2 years full time.) If yours is the same amount of time...and with all the pre-reqs you took BEFORE you entered, you should be darn close to a BSN dgree when you graduate, and not just an ADN, no?
  6. Visit  Valerie Salva profile page
    0
    Quote from Walden-Puddle
    See...I think that's great that they have you really load up on the pre-reqs so that you can actually concentrate on learning nursing and nursing skills once you have started in the program. I've always wondered how you could get into a nursing program with just a few science classes (now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure there's some basic english/writing requirement as well.) I'm in Norcal...and they simply include a lot of those other classes in the basic curriculum for the ADN program.

    With all of the classes that you took BEFORE starting, how long was your actual program to get your ADN? (I believe the one I'm thinking about is a little over 2 years full time.) If yours is the same amount of time...and with all the pre-reqs you took BEFORE you entered, you should be darn close to a BSN dgree when you graduate, and not just an ADN, no?
    I also had to take (checking my transcript, here) Writing 101, 102, English Lit, algebra, intro to health care, survey of human diseases, drug calculations, and human relations in business and industry.

    All of these had to be completed before applying to my RN program. All are college level and fully transferable, with the exception of my CNA classes.

    Full time beginning to end would have been four years, at 15.8 credit hours per semester. I worked full time, so it took six years. Graduating GPA was 3.69.

    In total, I have 127 credit hours. This includes CNA and LPN classes.

    All colleges I have contacted would require another 60 credit hours for me to earn a BSN.

    This includes CNA and LPN classes.


    I believe these fast track, second degree BSN programs really should look at the full picture, and evaluate candidates individually. There are many RNs in situations similar to mine.

    I think we should not be excluded from these programs, but we are.
  7. Visit  littleneoRN profile page
    0
    Quote from Nurse80sbaby
    A BSN in 15 months just for having a previous bachelors in ANY other field? *****? It took me 18 months just to get my ADN. I guess next they will allow you to turn in the proof of purchase on a couple boxes of Cheerios and they will send you a degree by mail. Im so tired of people watering down this profession.....not job.....profession. I hear there will be a shortage of general practice MDs in the near future. Can I buy all the Grays Anatomy and House series on DVD and send in my reciept in exchange for my MD license??
    It seems ridiculous that anyone is trying to address a nursing shortage with such a short term plan seeing as how the nursing shortage is more long-term and hypothetical at this point. (That was a side note...now for my main comment...)

    I had a bachelor's degree in a different field, and I had taken sociology, psychology (lifespan), nutrition, biology, chem, stats, calculus, physiology, etc. I then entered a 15 month program that had an IDENTICAL curriculum to the typical BSN program at that school. The difference was that you took an extra class each semester and and went full time the entire summer. In the end, my academic credentials were no different than a nurse from the traditional BSN program. I had an equivalent number of clinical hours, and our school offers more clinical hours than many other programs. It is not for everyone because not everyone can dedicate every waking moment to school. And, people who struggle in school might need a little slower pace. BUT, I feel like I received a good education and was as (or more) prepared as other new grads. (I would argue that the bar of preparation for all new grads should be higher than it currently is, but that's another discussion). So, it is not ludicrous to think a nurse can earn a BSN in 15 months. This is four semesters, if you use the summer, which is the same amount of time that many BSN programs dedicate to nursing. And the same as some ADN programs take--yes I know some of your programs have taken longer, but some really do take 4 semesters. Please don't compare my education to a mail order set of credentials.
  8. Visit  twinjeep97 profile page
    0
    I just think that people need to realize that there is a nursing shortage becuase hospitals ONLY care about making money and hiring the fewest amount of nurses possible. Also, theres a shortage because theres no professors, or no professors who want to teach. We also need to look at who the nursing shortage is referring to- RN's with BSN and above (mostly above) (Not techs,LPN's, Nurse assistants)- which schooling is so short causing a massive influx of nurses right away.
  9. Visit  CrazierThanYou profile page
    0
    Quote from Nurse80sbaby
    A BSN in 15 months just for having a previous bachelors in ANY other field? *****? It took me 18 months just to get my ADN. I guess next they will allow you to turn in the proof of purchase on a couple boxes of Cheerios and they will send you a degree by mail. Im so tired of people watering down this profession.....not job.....profession. I hear there will be a shortage of general practice MDs in the near future. Can I buy all the Grays Anatomy and House series on DVD and send in my reciept in exchange for my MD license??
    At my school, you can get a BSN in 12 months if you have a bachelors degree. In any other field. It was 15 months and they just shortened it to 12.


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